Raising Discus

[shadowstars123]

I really want a few discus for my tanks. They'll be bought as juvies. I know from my uncle who was a discus breeder that you need daily water changes, but as my tank is a 55 gallon, is that really necessary if there are only 2-5 discus in the tank? How prone are they to disease, and what is the best mix of food for them for maximum growth? My tank is lightly planted with a fluval 405 and possibly an AC70 if i pull it out of my attic. Are they really hard to keep as juvies? and how susceptible to death are they?

 

[Batt4Christ]

Every living organism is "prone to death", but that being said- I have yet to jump in to the whole discus game, though some day, I hope too.

But I have read a LOT on the subject over the years while dreaming if that future discus tank and a few things That have stuck with me:

Discus don't like hard/alkaline water and will meet a premature death if hardness or high ph are the rule for the tank.

The seeming "favorite" food to feed juvie discus to get max growth is beef heart. Unfortunately, this leads quickly to serious water condition problems, not only because of the bio-load of the fish, but due to the inevitable waste when feeding such foods (uneaten). Discus are very susceptible to these swings in water quality. It isn't the fish that mandate the frequent water changes, so much ad it is the byproducts of trying to rapidly grow them out. In THEORY, filtration COULD mediate the insane water change schedule- but only minimally.

I have met a few (very few) who claim they haven't done much special to keep discus and supposedly have had good success... But for every person claiming such "easy success", there are hundreds who tell a far different story.

If these jewels cost a tiny fraction of what they do- then I might be willing to jump in and experiment a little. But at a minimum of $35-40 each for juvies, my bank account isn't up for such experiments.

 

[shadowstars123]

Juvies are 20$ each here, so i'm thinking about it. How do they do as a sole tank inhabitant? I know they get stressed, but after about a month, I'll gradually add more once I realize I can take care of them or not.

 

[jetajockey]

I don't treat my discus any different than I do my other fish. Granted I've only had them a short time, but my maintenance schedule and feeding schedule is the same for everything except my fry tanks.

It's working so far, but it may not, who knows. I just decided that if a fish isn't capable of thriving in a basic level of maintenance then it's not worth keeping, so we'll see.

This is coming from someone who breeds rams, I really think people can tend to go overboard on care schedules.

 

[shadowstars123]

I don't treat my discus any different than I do my other fish. Granted I've only had them a short time, but my maintenance schedule and feeding schedule is the same for everything except my fry tanks.

It's working so far, but it may not, who knows. I just decided that if a fish isn't capable of thriving in a basic level of maintenance then it's not worth keeping, so we'll see.

This is coming from someone who breeds rams, I really think people can tend to go overboard on care schedules.

How DO you treat your other fish? Amount of PWC's, Filtration.. ect.

 

[jetajockey]

I do 40 percent-ish water changes every 3 to 4 days and feed juveniles twice daily.

The discus tank is kept in around 84 but otherwise its no different than any other tank.

One of the main keys to successful fishkeeping that I've learned is to never underestimate the power of understocking.

 

[shadowstars123]

40 percent? For all tanks or just juvie? I know this isn't recommended, but with two 1-3'' discus in a 55 with no other fish and a LOT of filtration, can you do a 50% pwc every week and get the same results growing them?

 

[jetajockey]

I do that with all of my tanks except the fry tanks which i tend to do more frequent WCs.

I'm not sure why you'd keep a single discus, they really should be in a school. 4 discus in a 55g is still understocked.

As far as the water change schedule goes, most people are adamant about doing constant water changes to maximize growth. I've never seen a side by side comparison of fish growing out with daily wc's versus weekly, but the work/cost involved in daily WCs puts me off of that idea.

 

[shadowstars123]

I do that with all of my tanks except the fry tanks which i tend to do more frequent WCs.

I'm not sure why you'd keep a single discus, they really should be in a school. 4 discus in a 55g is still understocked.

As far as the water change schedule goes, most people are adamant about doing constant water changes to maximize growth. I've never seen a side by side comparison of fish growing out with daily wc's versus weekly, but the work/cost involved in daily WCs puts me off of that idea.

Do you buy yours fully grown? And i only want one as of now cause if i get like 5, i'd feel terrible if they'd die.

 

[jetajockey]

no mine are all 2-3". If you are really worried about taking proper care of them, maybe you should get some other hardy species to start with. If you really worry about killing them then you aren't ready to take care of them...yet.

 

[shadowstars123]

no mine are all 2-3". If you are really worried about taking proper care of them, maybe you should get some other hardy species to start with. If you really worry about killing them then you aren't ready to take care of them...yet.

Well, my mom and uncle have been trying to talk me out of keepin them, and they're telling me all these horror stories. But i know i can keep the water pristine and healthy, just wondering about how hardy juvies are, as rook told me they're pretty hard compared to adults

 

[carlissilva]

I think if you don't try you will never know if you can take care . I started a tank with out knowing almost nothing about fish I got a tank with fish but with some mistakes I learned and by asking at fish stores.
If you want a discus I would buy two or tree from the same tank at the store and buy them small cause they are cheeper and see how it goes from there.
The really nice thing about getting them small is that each time you go close to the tank they will know it's you and come up to eat and some times eat out of your hand it will take time but some discus do that.

 

[DiscusDennis]

I really want a few discus for my tanks. They'll be bought as juvies. I know from my uncle who was a discus breeder that you need daily water changes, but as my tank is a 55 gallon, is that really necessary if there are only 2-5 discus in the tank? How prone are they to disease, and what is the best mix of food for them for maximum growth? My tank is lightly planted with a fluval 405 and possibly an AC70 if i pull it out of my attic. Are they really hard to keep as juvies? and how susceptible to death are they?

Hi shadowstars123,
I've been keeping Discus for 10 years and I've sent alot of Discus to "Fish Heaven". Been successfully keeping Discus for about 5 years and the key IS daily water changes! Especially for Juvies! You can get away with a little less frequent water changes on adults but Discus DO enjoy fresh water. In the "Rain Forest" Discus (and most other Tropical fish) get fresh rain water everyday. That equals out to doing those water changes!
Most other species of fish can tolerate dirty water (high Nitrate) but Discus are especially sensitive to high Nitrate.

So to answer the question.... Are Discus hard to keep as Juvies?
If you consider doing daily water changes to much work......then Discus are VERY hard to keep. If you can do the water changes.....then Discus aren't very picky. PH....GH...KH aren't as important as clean water! I've known people to keep Discus at PH over 8!

It took me 5 years to figure it out (lol) CLEAN WATER!!!

A tip to seeing a stunted Discus. Look for the size of the eyes..... If they're really big compared to the body size....then the Discus is stunted and probably won't be growing alot. Therfore you shouldn't spend alot of cash on said fish.

Dennis

 

[shadowstars123]

Hi shadowstars123,
I've been keeping Discus for 10 years and I've sent alot of Discus to "Fish Heaven". Been successfully keeping Discus for about 5 years and the key IS daily water changes! Especially for Juvies! You can get away with a little less frequent water changes on adults but Discus DO enjoy fresh water. In the "Rain Forest" Discus (and most other Tropical fish) get fresh rain water everyday. That equals out to doing those water changes!
Most other species of fish can tolerate dirty water (high Nitrate) but Discus are especially sensitive to high Nitrate.

So to answer the question.... Are Discus hard to keep as Juvies?
If you consider doing daily water changes to much work......then Discus are VERY hard to keep. If you can do the water changes.....then Discus aren't very picky. PH....GH...KH aren't as important as clean water! I've known people to keep Discus at PH over 8!

It took me 5 years to figure it out (lol) CLEAN WATER!!!

A tip to seeing a stunted Discus. Look for the size of the eyes..... If they're really big compared to the body size....then the Discus is stunted and probably won't be growing alot. Therfore you shouldn't spend alot of cash on said fish.

Dennis

Dennis are the daily pwc just to keep nitrates down? Whats the best ppm to shoot for?

 

[Hobnobelisk]

To keep the nitrates low but daily water cchanges with a high ph of water is bad for the discus from experience. I haven't done anything differently weekly 40% water changes. In my new tank though I have bought an ozone purifier by phillips which will keep the water in pristine condition. As for buying a solo discus even for a month he won't come out of his shell for ages. I did the same and it took about half a year to act like the others. I hope this helps.

 

[DiscusDennis]

shadowstars123,
I try to keep the Nitrate below 20.
Water changes also help remove bacteria from uneaten food and such.

And my tap water PH is 7.0 and pretty soft (TDS 45-60) so my Discus do very good with daily water changes. It took a week or two for the fish to acclimate to daily water changes. But once Discus are used to water changes......They love it.
I kinda like doing water changes.

I've never subjected my Discus to high PH......just did alot of online reading where people state that there Discus do good with high PH tap water & daily water changes.
Although I do believe Hobnobelisk about his Discus not liking high PH. Everybody's tap water is different.

Dennis

 

[Hobnobelisk]

I think the whole point as Dennis im sure will agree is getting the discus to adapt to the new enviroment be it water changes or water quality over a period of time rather than quickly.

 

[DiscusDennis]

I think the whole point as Dennis im sure will agree is getting the discus to adapt to the new enviroment be it water changes or water quality over a period of time rather than quickly.

You're right Hobnobelisk.
I believe we're all still learning.....especailly me (lol)

Take care,
Dennis

 

[Batt4Christ]

I have a question related to the current discussion here:

With all the talk about water quality vs. frequent water changes (isn't the latter's primary purpose to insure the former?)... and as has been mentioned already in passing - about not underestimating the power of under-stocking...

We have been making preparations to buy a 125 gallon aquarium (with plans to fully fishless cycle) - that size aquarium can house a significant load of fish... but what if we stocked it relatively sparingly - as well as it being heavily planted? Assuming sensible feeding and regular (though far less-so than daily!) water changes, wouldn't water quality remain high for a much longer period of time?

The reason I ask - between a 60g at our lfs that has a pair of full-grown discus, a few beautiful rainbows, and LOTS of plants - the fish and the tank is a "showpiece" - and the discus are very healthy - and they do weekly water changes of somewhere around 20%. Also, one of the folks that work there and I had a conversation and she was telling me about her regiment for her home discus tank - which involves a 60-70% water change ever two weeks (seems like a drastic jump/change to me... but she has been quite successful). But her tank is also under-stocked as well.

I'm thinking weekly water changes of a more reasonable % would be less stressful to the fish... plus even less bio-load per gallon would make a big difference.

 

[Hobnobelisk]

As you say obviously water changes does impact the afformentioned water quality. And all factors of that i.e stocking, overfeeding water change quality etc will all have an impact on the fish you keep. But you can add tools to combat the water quality other than water changes with a really good filter, ozone purifies, not overfeeding being the main ones.