Challenging fish and compatibility!

[schoeplein]

So. I come from having owned several challenging salt water tanks, thus I have an unrealistically high expectation for the appearance of the fish that will be in my planted freshwater aquarium. I kept a dragonette for several years, in spite of how difficult they are to keep alive. I've kept water parameters in check to keep blue polyps, multicolored mushrooms, and hard corals. 55g up to 110g, and I helped to keep a 220g predator tank that my stepfather owned. My living situation forced me to dismantle and hand off all of my pieces. I now own my own home and am ready to dive back in. That being said, I'm not opposed to a challenge, and what I'm about to propose will be considered just that (or down right stupid, hehe).

I'm prepping a 65g tank and need some pro advice from folks who have attempted or succeeded in keeping certain mixes of supposedly incompatible fish.

Here's a list of fish I would like to keep, they all won't necessarily get along or have individual requirements that may require separation or special treatment. Please critique my research and point out any glaring obstacles I may have missed.

Zebra loach - Ground scavenger, can be territorial. OK as a solo fish. Small enough at a mature age not to take up too much inch/gallon. I really wanted a clown loach, but I honestly think it would grow too large for even my tank. I'm assuming it will live its full life. Great bottom/cave dweller.

Angelfish - Can grow to be very large. I've read up to 12" tall. OK as a solo fish, but prefer a partner *if* they like each other. Assuming they live long enough, the two of them would have a rather large consumption of aquarium space. Difficult to keep with discus and dwarf gourami. Middle tank inhabitant.

Discus - "very difficult" to keep. Challenges change based their age and maturity. Once paired off, it is suggested the pair is kept in their own tank. Otherwise they should be kept in groups of five or more. Also difficult to keep with angelfish and dwarf gourami. Middle tank inhabitant, also hides.

Dwarf gourami - I actually have experience with these arseholes. One male is always dominant, the rest submissive. In a large enough tank they can exist in pairs or more assuming each can have its own territory. Will chase anything and everything if it feels it is being encroached upon, and definitely bites off the fins of other fish readily. The dominant male I have may do better with a pair of lady friends instead. He also doesn't like fish with extravagant fins, longfin anything. Temperament may reduce with extended space. Swims the entire tank. Most likely won't get along with discus or angelfish.

Cardinal tetras - A decent schooling fish that fits my water temps and parameters. Nothing special, just needs six or more, passive, won't bother others and won't be bothered. Fills the gaps.


Are there other extravagant, colorful fish, that aren't tiny like guppies, that I'm missing? This will not be a guppy tank. I've got another tank full of males for that. I'm also not interested in breeding.

Is it possible to identify discus as male, so I could keep five of them? Or are they like clownfish and can change sex? Or will it be a "buy a dozen and remove the pairs" situation? How violent towards others would a pair of discus be?

I'd like to keep one, or two angels only so they'll have a buddy, but if one can appreciate their own company, that would be better in the long run.

What say ya'll. Dwarf gourami, angels and discus in the same tank. Cats and dogs playing together? Pigs flying? Or can careful selection based on temperament result in a balanced tank?

Sent from my SM-T310 using Aquarium Advice mobile app

 

[philipraposo198]

i am saying your dg's and angel will be a headache and won't leave each other alone.

 

[bribo12]

Discus are incredibly tedious if you don't know what you're doing. Plus a 65 isn't large enough for 5 of them. They also require warmer water than the gouramis and loach would like. I'd do the angels, loaches, and tetras and fill it in with other small colorful fish. Maybe a pair of rams once the tank has been running for a bit

 

[schoeplein]

Huh. Bolivian rams look nice (any other variants I should be aware of?). How hard it is to find a pair of them? I'm assuming much easier than discus. Shame different kinds don't play well together.

Angelfish are shoaling fish as well, I may be able to keep them for a while, but eventually the five of them are going to outgrow the tank.

Is there anything dwarf gourami actually get along with?

So I'm down to a school of tetras, a couple rams, a zebra loach and... a dwarf gourami if he can play nice.

 

[Luananeko]

I second the suggestion to pass on the discus for something better sized for the tank. A pair of dwarf cichlids (Apistos, German Blue Rams, Bolivian Rams, Electric Blue Rams, etc) should do fine with the loaches, or you could go with a pair of Kribs instead. Kribs supposedly get grumpy at breeding time and breed readily, so stick to one if you want to avoid that headache. Angels do fine solo, or in mated pairs, or in a group. You don't have room for a group of adults, and they tend to get nasty at breeding time, so I'd stick to just one. I've never kept dwarf gourami, but I have kept their bigger, supposedly more nasty cousins (Trichopodus trichopterus) in community tanks without any issues. They should be fine as long as they're added either last or at the same time as the Angel.

 

[schoeplein]

I'm guessing a pair of kribs and a pair of rams together is a no go?

Could I mix two zebra and two yoyo loaches?


4 Loaches
1-2 Angelfish
2 Rams / 2 Kribs
School of cardinal tetras
Dwarf gourami

 

[Luananeko]

If it was just the kribs and rams on the bottom level, you could. But with loaches down there too there just wouldn't be enough hiding holes/territories to go around. Loaches are super social and need their own kind to form a school, they tend to bother their tankmates more if there's only one or two of their species. Dwarf Chain Loaches are another option, though they're spendier. They stay smaller than the zebras and yoyos so you can have more of them for a more effective display.

 

[philipraposo198]

If it was just the kribs and rams on the bottom level, you could. But with loaches down there too there just wouldn't be enough hiding holes/territories to go around. Loaches are super social and need their own kind to form a school, they tend to bother their tankmates more if there's only one or two of their species. Dwarf Chain Loaches are another option, though they're spendier. They stay smaller than the zebras and yoyos so you can have more of them for a more effective display.

I agree with this.

If no loaches then your fine for a pair of each. As for gouramis I would look at pearls or dwarfs or Opaline. Keep in.mine gouramis have all kinds of personality some are mean bugger's and others are very gentle.

 

[azmodan]

OP, as already mentioned I'd look into the different apistogramma types. Some types, such as cacatuoides, are not very hard fish to keep, but there are many others that can be pretty challenging to raise and get to breed. Apistos also generally have awesome color.

 

[Mcgolg76]

Zebra loaches are not good solo. Would say at least 6. In groups extremely fun to watch

 

[Delapool]

Can I ask how robust zebra loaches are that people find? I like them although don't keep them but it seems if they get anything it hits them hard? Just curious.

 

[Mcgolg76]

I bought 8 zebra loaches about 10 mos. Might have lost 1 but so hard to keep count cause so active and my tank so full of hiding spots. Still think they are very hardy. They bothered my panda Cory's so I moved the Cory's out but fine with other fish. Little bickering among themselves. One female is very dominate. They don't just hang out bottom. A couple then swim upside down when I feed and eat from top. If you have a big tank. They are incredibly entertaining. If you can find them get them. Lol my review on zebra loaches

 

[Mcgolg76]

Never seen one sick. The one that disappeared was the runt of the litter. The dominant has a wierd growth on her but never acted sick. They are def robust to me

 

[Delapool]

Thanks for the info, much appreciated. Sounds good.