I have MTS....but what should I do with my koi angels?????

[QTOFFER]

The 30 gal I found in the trash this summer is finally being activated! When it is up and running, I will have two 10 gals, a 15 gal, a 30 gal, and a 58 gal running in my 750 square foot apartment. Since this situation is partially the fault of each and every one of you, I will now burden you with the sordid details!

Last night I ordered a Fluval 304 from BigAl's for the 30 gal. My first choice was another Eheim, but I simply don't have that kind of cash right now. I read some great things about the Fluvals here which influenced my decision. I plan to seed the Fluval with about 50% of the biofilter media from my long established 58 gal. Some well established driftwood and rockwork should add additional bacterial colonies.

Now I get to indulge in the part of the hobby that I love the most... redecorating all my tanks and shifting fish and plants between them!
But, I have some choices to make.

I have two adolescent koi anges (about 3 inches) that get along great together. They have been living in a 15 gal since I got them in March, 2005. They need a larger tank now.

I also have five juvie koi angels (quarter sized) that I got last month. They are in a 10 gal quarrantine tank at the moment.

I have eight tiger barbs that I am determined to keep. In fact, they're so entertaining, I would love to get more. However, they cannot share a tank with the angel fish.


Scenaria A:
Now:
58 gal: 2 adolescent angels, three schools of large tetras, BN plec
30 gal: 8 tiger barbs - acquire another small school of barbs, BN plec
15 gal: 5 juvie angels - sell/trade in before they outgrow this tank


Scenario B:
Now:
58 gal: 8 tiger barbs, BN plec
30 gal: 2 adolescent angels
15 gal: 5 juvie angels

In a few months:
58 gal: 7 angels - allow them to form 2 - 3 pairs and sell/trade in the unpaired individuals, BN plec
30 gal: 8 tiger barbs - acquire another small school of barbs, BN plec


Scenario C:
Does anyone else have an alternative suggestion?

Thanx!

 

[rubysoho]

Scenario C:
58 gallon - all the angels. They won't grow as fast nor have the nice finnage if you don't give them the space. Also, you'll only be able to keep at most 2 paired angels in this tank because of territory issues during breeding times. BN Plec.

30 gallon - all your barbs, plus another small school that you want

15 - free to do what ever you want

 

[rich311k]

I like Ruby's idea. All 7 seven angels will be fine in the 58 for quite a while. My 4 still get along fine in the 36 and they are pushing 6 months, have to make a decision soon.

 

[Jchillin]

I really like Scenario D, sub-division (a): "Give all angels to Jchillin" LOL!

Ok, that's just something I made up. It just sounded like a good idea to me.

I have to go with the angels in the 58 as the others have mentioned.

 

[BrianNY]

Scenario D. A tank full of Jewel Cichlids

 

[QTOFFER]

Hmmm...all the angels in the 58 right now. This would be my dream scenario because I would get to have my cake (lots of angels) and eat it too (lots of barbs)! I hadn't really considered this because I was afraid that the older 3 inch angels would beat the stuffing out of the quarter-sized ones. I guess if things got ugly, I could always move the bully to another tank.

Scenario D. A tank full of Jewel Cichlids

Yeah, you first!

 

[Lonewolfblue]

I'll go with the others. All the angels in the 58G. And the free tank, Rams.

 

[greenmaji]

just bag up the Koi angels and take them over to Jchillin.. he will take care of them..

ok.. in the few months looks good to me..

 

[TomK2]

Well, I had a complete angel fish disaster when I mixed 4 adolescent new angels with four juvinile ones. I ended up losing all the little ones, and all but two of the adolescent ones. Beware mixing angels of different sizes and ages! Of course, if you have a QT to isolate the agressor, you may get away with it. Keep taking the agressor out for longer and longer times till he gives up his evil ways.

also, Angels love room. I have my only two remaining angels in a 55 gal. With smaller fish as tankmates, they are really happy. I wanted 6 angels, but the great angelfish debacle reduced me to two. So you do not have to go through what I did, I say option A.

 

[QTOFFER]

Tom, what happenned to you is my biggest concern, but from what I've read, every angelfish has a different personality and I won't know if it will work until I try it. And yes, I have a few understocked, cycled tanks, so I can shuffle things around and separate the angels if things get ugly. If things don't work out, I will probably go with scenario A and trade in the juvies.

I found the smallest baby angel dead this morning. He really wasn't eating. So now I have two adolescents and four babies.

The 29 gal is all set up. I seeded the new Fluval 304 heavily with media from my establlished Eheim. I also put in a big chunk of driftwood and some plants that had been in one of my other tanks for months. I have a jewel cichlid in the tank to help feed the new bacterial colonies. (This is the same jewel cichlid who hides in his cave all day and only comes out to murder his tankmates. I've been using him to keep my QT tank cycled when I'm not using it.) Anyway, after a week, the water parameters in the new 29 gal are 0 across the board.

 

[TomK2]

Good Luck! As long as you are prepared to intervene, you won't be happy with the other options until you take a shot at what you want. You are correct, there are many stories of successful mixing of angels, as well as other unlikely matches, so you might have fish that can get along.


So, here's hoping the new mix won't trigger any problems!

 

[QTOFFER]

Angelfish Musical Chairs(Tanks)
Phase I: Complete 8)

I set up my new 29 gal two weeks ago. The filter was heavily seeded with media from my established 58 gal, and I added some driftwood from one of my other well established tanks. A solitary antisocial jewel cichlid was used to keep the tank cycled. I tested the water every day, and never saw an ammonia spike. Last night, I checked the water parameters (0ppm NH3, 0ppm NO2, 5ppm NO3). The presence of measurable nitrate was my signal to proceed to Phase I. 8)

First, I did a 50% water change in all my tanks. I think it's less stressful to move fish AFTER a big water change, because the water parameters should not differ very much from tank to tank.
I netted all 8 tiger barbs (no easy feat) and transferred them from the 58 gal to the 29 gal.
Then I netted the psycho jewel cichlid from the 29 gal and put him back in the 10 gal holding tank to keep it cycled.
Then I moved the 3 juvie angels from the 10 gal holding tank to the 58 gal.

I'll give the three juvie angels a week to stake out their claims in the 58 gal before proceding to Phase II - moving the mature angels from the 15 gal to the 58 gal.

 

[rich311k]

Sounds like a plan. Hope all goes well.

 

[Jchillin]

PPPPP (or more commonly known as the 5 P's method - Proper Planning Prevents Poor Performance). It looks like a sound plan, I like it. Here's to continued success.

 

[TomK2]

Here's to keeping your net wet! Hope it works out.

 

[QTOFFER]

Phase II complete! 8)

I did nice big waterchanges in all tanks and moved the two adolescent angels into the 58 gal with the three juvies. The bigger angels don't look as small as I expected them to in the 58 gal! In any case, I', sure they're thrilled to be out of their 15 gal holding prison. The juvies have been in the tank for a week, so hopefully they know the lay of the land. There are LOTS of places where they, but not the bigger angels can fit. I also have a huge Amazon sword, some smaller swords, some anubias, and a big clump of Windelov Java fern (thanks, Travis! ) for them to hide behind. None of the fish have the slightest fin damage, and I hope it stays that way - I'll be keeping an eye on these guys.