Johanni with less aggressive Cichlids?

[Labenator65000]

I have a relatively new tank. You can read my profile to see what is in there. My concern is the Electric Blue Johanni. The LPS that I purchased it from swore that it would be completely compatible with my other Lake Malawi Cichlids. However, several online sources completely disagree with that and warn me that it will one day turn into an aggressive killer. I've had it for about a month. So far it has not been a problem. Oh, right after feeding (when the food is gone and just bits are left) it gets a little ornery for a few minutes, but not so much that the others get stressed or hide from it. It has not caused any injuries. Opinions?

Thanks,
JD

 

[Wy Renegade]

Long term, when they mature and begin the process of establishing territory, it will most likely turn into the most aggressive cichlid in the tank.

 

[Labenator65000]

Partially in response to your reply to another post of mine, now I am starting to reconsider whether I should remove the Johanni. The LPS where I purchased it will not take it back, and I'm not sure I can even give it to any other pet stores in the area. Not sure what to do.

 

[Jmedic25]

There is no absolutes in Africans. It depends on too many factors. The x factor is that particular fish. Just keep an eye on things, If he turns into a murdering pain. Get rid of him. If hes just the tank boss, removing him will just give way to another tank boss. It is safe to say if he kills then he will again. Africans need a pecking order. If you want a totally peaceful tank dont keep malawis. Even the most peaceful Tang tank will still have some aggression. Rocks and proper stocking will reduce aggression but it will always be present.

 

[Wy Renegade]

Indeed as "J" pointed out, there are no absolutes with cichlids (or any other fish for that matter). Obviously the temperament of individual fish will vary. Your LFS may have had good luck with these mixed with other Africans, but there are so many factors they may not be considering or telling you. How big are the tanks they were stocked into? How much rockwork was present to provide hiding places? How overstocked were the tanks to help reduce aggressiong? All are factors that can affect the overall out come.

All I can reference is my own personal experience - I always thought they were pretty (females bright orange, males turn a pretty purplish-blue), and had great sexual dimorphism. As a result, I've tried them several times; large tanks, smaller tanks, over stocked tanks, under stocked tanks, bigger fish, etc. In every case, I've eventually ended up with the Johanni male being the single survivor or I've had to remove them from the tank. The last one I had lived out its life in 20Long tank all by itself, because I couldn't put it in any of my other tanks.

Hopefully yours will work out for you, but just keep a sharp eye on him, especially once he matures.

 

[Labenator65000]

Both great posts. Thanks! So at about what size would the Johanni be considered to be adult?

 

[Mouth-Brooder-Fanatic]

adult can be like 6 or more inches in a good size tank, but breeding maturity would be a min of 2-3in.
if u got lots of females of johanni or africans similar to them, there would be less chance of aggression in the tank x
can i ask what it is in with?

 

[Jmedic25]

Indeed as "J" pointed out, there are no absolutes with cichlids (or any other fish for that matter). Obviously the temperament of individual fish will vary. Your LFS may have had good luck with these mixed with other Africans, but there are so many factors they may not be considering or telling you. How big are the tanks they were stocked into? How much rockwork was present to provide hiding places? How overstocked were the tanks to help reduce aggressiong? All are factors that can affect the overall out come.

All I can reference is my own personal experience - I always thought they were pretty (females bright orange, males turn a pretty purplish-blue), and had great sexual dimorphism. As a result, I've tried them several times; large tanks, smaller tanks, over stocked tanks, under stocked tanks, bigger fish, etc. In every case, I've eventually ended up with the Johanni male being the single survivor or I've had to remove them from the tank. The last one I had lived out its life in 20Long tank all by itself, because I couldn't put it in any of my other tanks.

Hopefully yours will work out for you, but just keep a sharp eye on him, especially once he matures.

Wy...have you heard of any success keeping a large Hap as the tank boss with a Jo? Ive heard but not read any good data on the subject. The idea is the Jo would be kept in check by the Hap...But the hap would have to be a pussycat. The aggressor in the tank I saw was a male auratus...What do you think

 

[Wy Renegade]

It wouldn't surprise me, but again it would take a large overstocked tank with lots of hiding spaces. The M. auratus is just as aggressive as the Johanni. In fact I've got a rescue that is all by himself in a 30gal tank right now. I don't know that you would really be solving the problem, so much as replacing one issue causing fish with another.

 

[Jmedic25]

It wouldn't surprise me, but again it would take a large overstocked tank with lots of hiding spaces. The M. auratus is just as aggressive as the Johanni. In fact I've got a rescue that is all by himself in a 30gal tank right now. I don't know that you would really be solving the problem, so much as replacing one issue causing fish with another.

The hap was put in to keep the arautus in check...It was told to me that it worked well. Another thing to try may be dither fish..

 

[joel618]

Isn't electric blue johanni a trade name for maingano?

 

[Wy Renegade]

The hap was put in to keep the arautus in check...It was told to me that it worked well. Another thing to try may be dither fish..

Ah, ok sorry guess I was misreading the post. I don't know how you would insure that the Hap. had the right personality and didn't become an even bigger problem in and of itself?

Isn't electric blue johanni a trade name for maingano?

No, maingano is actually a different species, Melanochromis cyaneorhabdos, as opposed to the johanni, which is M. johanni.

 

[joel618]

No, maingano is actually a different species, Melanochromis cyaneorhabdos, as opposed to the johanni, which is M. johanni.

I know but I think they are sometimes sold as "elective blue johanni". I may be wrong though.

 

[Mouth-Brooder-Fanatic]

johanni and electric blue johanni can be different.
melanochromis cyaneorhabdos = electric blue
melanochromis johanni = johanni norm
melanochromis maingano = similar to johanni

xx

 

[Wy Renegade]

I know but I think they are sometimes sold as "elective blue johanni". I may be wrong though.

It wouldn't surprize me to see them sold mislabeled. The most common way to get them around here is "assorted".

 

[kay-bee19]

Isn't electric blue johanni a trade name for maingano?

This is actually correct in a way.

"Electric Blue johanni" is the 'common name' for Melanochromis cyaneorhabdos.

The collection point of this species is at Maingano (just northeast of Likoma Island in Lake Malawi), and this fish is also referred to by that name. From my understanding, Maingano is the only place in Lake Malawi in which M. cyaneorhabdos is found. To confuse things a bit, years ago this fish was formally known as Melanochromis sp. 'Maingano'.

Melanochromis cyaneorhabdos=Maingano=Electric Blue Johanni.

 

[Wy Renegade]

This is actually correct in a way.

"Electric Blue johanni" is the 'common name' for Melanochromis cyaneorhabdos.

The collection point of this species is at Maingano (just northeast of Likoma Island in Lake Malawi), and this fish is also referred to by that name. From my understanding, Maingano is the only place in Lake Malawi in which M. cyaneorhabdos is found. To confuse things a bit, years ago this fish was formally known as Melanochromis sp. 'Maingano'.

Melanochromis cyaneorhabdos=Maingano=Electric Blue Johanni.

Interesting, after a quick search of internet sites I did indeed find a few that list this fish as "blue johanni" or "electric blue johanni". Some just refer to it as the electric blue. I would still consider it a mislabeled trade or common name, as it is not a johanni. Both male and female M. cyaneorhabdos are the same blue color, whereas johanni females and immature males are orange. Know its an older reference, but Ad Konings only refers to it as Melanochromis "Maingano".

Thanks for the catch.

 

[TankBoss]

I just sold my Malawis and my adult Johanni was very aggressive and unbeatable. He would "lean" heavily on one fish in particular at a time. You can still have a healthy tank with a Johanni in it but at least one of your other fish will be singing the blues.

 

[Labenator65000]

I just sold my Malawis and my adult Johanni was very aggressive and unbeatable. He would "lean" heavily on one fish in particular at a time. You can still have a healthy tank with a Johanni in it but at least one of your other fish will be singing the blues.

I notice my Johannii picks on my Yellow labs more than the others. The Ps.Acei and Ruby Reds occasionally. Funny thing is he (nor the others) pay any attention whatsoever to the Albino Rainbow Shark, and the latter (which is the smallest fish in the tank) interacts with all of the others with no fear whatsoever.

The Johannii really only seems to get ornery at feeding time, but only after all of the big pieces have been eaten. Otherwise they all get along just fine.