Newb to Nanos

[gurnie]

Morning,
I am a newb to nanos, well at least the saltwater kind. I'm looking for loads of info, preferably in book form. Not sure what size I will go for yet (in terms of the size of the tank) but I qill base that decision based on the information I read.

a bit of info:

I have kept freshwater fish on and off during my life, and have enjoyed them very much. I currently have a female betta in a 3 gallon macaquarium that i built (along with 7 ghost shrimp), and a male betta in a 5 gallon minibow with a ramshorn snail. Both have heated tanks.

At work I have 3 zebra danos in an office tank.

So as you can see i have plenty of freshwater tanks. I was a user of fishforums.net but I've come to the opinion that they are nazi fish keepers and have disagreed with some of my fish keeping practices (despite having excellent water quality and happy, growing fish). This looked like a friendly forum to use, and I hope it is.

[roka64]

Welcome to AA!

Please do not cycle your tank with living animals.

It's good to have you here. In SW, the more water volume you have the more room for error. What type of tank are you looking to do, FOWLR, reef or FO?
We have a bunch of great Articles that can help you get started.

[Devilishturtles]

I agree with Scott. If you are looking at a nano specifically (I assume you are from posting in the nano forums) I would reccomend atleast a 10 or 20 gallon tank. Something smaller is definitley doable, but a larger water volume leaves more room for error, which is very important in a SW tank.

If you are looking for good books to get you started, try The New Marine Aquarium by Michael Paletta or The Concientious Marine Aquarist by Robert Fenner. Both good books. Paletta's is a lot cheaper. hehe.

Welcome to AA!

[gurnie]

Great info, thanky-uo for the warm welcoming and being so speedy with answering questions. Thanks for also not being fish wackos


now some questions, and lets base the answers on a 10-20 gallon nano reef

1. so a question about fishless cycling (I only know the ammonia method freshwater users use) do you leave the shrimp in there to cycle until its completely gone? when do you take it out? Does it matter if its fresh or frozen? Any particular type of shrimp? I understand t has to be raw, not a problem. Is it ok if they are headless shrimp? If you're doing a nano tank should you still do a whole shrimp, just maybe a smaller one (but not one of those teeny-tiny ones, just cocktail size). Should we butterfly the shrimp or is the tank acclimated enough to rot away the shell too? should it be a shelled shrimp? Shoul your filters be running at this time

2. Do you need an R.O. system for a nano saltwater tank?

3. I gather the basic supplies are: Nano Skimmer, a nano filter (I assume you can use freshwater filters, like a biowheel filter, althought if i get a kit i assume this will come with the kit), a heater (i have one from freshwater tank), lighting (as to what, it depends on the kit), hydrometer,

4. Can anyone recommend a good saltwater kit and a good book (oops you just listed two)?

5. What online relator's do you use for buying tanks / fish

6. What should be my estimated costs? I just want to be sure i am not being ripped off. I know its an expensive hobby... but believe it or not, I have 4 cats,and those 4 cat be expensive little farts when you have to buy them "human grade" food. So i'm not afraid to spend cash, but not more than I need to

i think that's all the questions i can think of


oh and to be honest i don't know what FOWLR, reef or FO means, so, if you can lead me to any definitions, that'd be awsome (which is why i need the books)

[roka64]

1. I think a good general rule is 1 fresh, unseasoned jumbo shrimp per 30G. So you might be good with half of a jumbo shrimp or maybe just a smakker shrimp. As you watch your ammonia raise, you may want to take it out if you hit 5ppm. Some folks use a bag with holes poked in it for easy removal. I just let mine rot away, shell and all. I would also suggest letting your filter run, so it can build up the nitrifying bacteria in it (depending on the media in your filter).

2. No you don't need RO, but RO/DI is best. There is no telling what is in your water source.

3. You can probably use a FW filter. I think most of them are compatible in both FW and SW, just make sure it says for use in SW. You can reuse your old heater, assuming you never had it in a tank that was treated with copper (copper is bad for inverts). Lighting will depend on what corals you want to keep (I'll have to let the more experienced reefers help you on those). Props on the reading, most of the newer folks (myself included, when I first started) didn't even know about refractometers. I wasted my money on a cheap hydrometer.

4. Saltwater kit, as in a test kit? If so, I would look at Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Reef Master Liquid Test Kit . Some folks like seachem test kits.

5. There are tons of sites, including ebay, thatpetplace.com, drsfosterandsmith.com (great for dry goods and they don't charge extra for weight or bulky items), saltwaterfish.com, liveaquaria.com. Those are the ones I generally order from.

[gurnie]

I do have the API kit for testing my home and office aquariums but that's just basic freshwater / salt water. Looks like i'll have to invest in a new kit

No copper treated in my tank b/c i had the shrimps

So what does a refractometer do in an aquarium, just tell you how much the salinity in the water is?

i hear some people use live rock in their filter. is that a common practice?

[roka64]

Originally Posted by gurnie

Looks like i'll have to invest in a new kit

You can just buy separate test kits. Calcium, alk and mag might be what you need for reefs, but I'll digress to the reffers for their advice.

Originally Posted by gurnie

So what does a refractometer do in an aquarium, just tell you how much the salinity in the water is?

You got it, they tend to be more accurate than most hydrometers. A very wise investment.

Originally Posted by gurnie

i hear some people use live rock in their filter. is that a common practice?

I do it in mine. Folks like to remove the bioballs or other media and replace them with LR rubble.

[Devilishturtles]

Just to add

1. You can also use uncured liverock to cycle your tank vs. the shrimp method. It's totally up to you, but if you want to buy uncured rock (rock that is usually directly from the ocean and not sitting in a holding tank for a few weeks to allow die off to occur) vs. cured rock (rock that is collected and held to get the die-off off of it) then I would not add the shrimp. Just another option. There is no one that is better than the other.

2. Test your tap water for the basics like nitrate, nitrite, ammonia, phophate, etc. and see how it is. You may or may not need an RO/DI unit, but like Scott said, one is preferable.

6. It totally depends on what you buy, how much DIY you want to do, etc. But I think a fair estimate is around $1000 after it's all said and done, for a nano. Of course, actual amount can stray pretty far from that number.

As for the difference between FOWLR, FO, and Reef - FOWLR stands for Fish only with live rock, which is just like it sounds. No corals, just some live rock and fish. FO is just a tank with fish, no rock, no coral, etc. Reef is a full out tank with corals, liverock, etc.

A lot of people do not use filters in SW tanks as they would in FW tanks. If you choose to run a filter on your SW tank, I would remove all the filter media (like the pads) and replace it with liverock or carbon/phosban, etc. Filter pads usually accumulate garbage from the tank which can raise nitrate levels quickly, which is bad for the fish/inverts/corals and cause fuel algae, which just sucks.

[gurnie]

I suspect what I wants is a reef, but it looks like I will be visiting my local marine store and looking at their tanks to see what I'll get.

And when you say the number strays, i hope you mean it strays downward

So do you not need a filter if have live rock / coral in your tank? does everything just work together like a cute little eco system? Doesn't having a filter make things a bit easier in the long run?

[roka64]

Personally, I like filters. They give me a place to add media, like purigen, phosban and carbon. There are plenty of folks that don't use a filter. There are others that love skimmers.