Evil Yellow Tang (Vegetarian Gone BAD!)

[zuzecawi]

So I had the two tanks running... the 55 reef and the 58 reef. Well, the 55 reef was bought from some lady who "Lost interest" and let the fish degrade terribly. So when I sold the 55 reef, after cherry picking the corals out for the 58, I didn't sell the yellow tang with it, because it was in such poor shape. (This was night before last) Instead I threw it in my 58 for temporary residence until its fins grew back. WHAT A MISTAKE!!! This fish turned out to be so agressive I couldn't even get near it. It tried to spike everything in sight, including corals. It terrorized my poor little 5 line wrasse, and the blenny went into hiding so deep I thought it was dead until I saw its tail move today down in the rockwork. So last night, I saw my six line down in the rocks, hiding out. Perfectly fine, a little tattered on the fins, but no real signs of damage. Then this morning, I woke up, went to check the tank, and found... my six line wrasse. Dead. Spiked through the face. And there's no doubt it was the yellow tang... it was obviously damaged from tang not predator, and I haven't had any mantis shrimp in over a year. And the tank is fine, all parameters just running great, no inverts in distress, everything normal but the dead fish. (it was so freshly killed its eyes weren't even glazed, I think the lights coming on might have been a point in it happening, cuz the wrasse would often dart around when the lights kicked on, maybe it darted by the tang and got nailed)

So the tang is on time out in the sump, I'm going to email the guy who bought the 55 and offer it to him first, then if he don't want it, take it to the LFS and have Ryan throw it in his gigantic sump.

As a tail note to this... I have around 2lbs of gracilaria in my 58, green ulva, and a few other macros, and I kept nori and purple sea veggies clipped in there too. There was no lack of appropriate food for this dang tang. This was just the freakiest thing... I can tell you, I like tangs, but this really turned me off on yellow tangs. That six line had survived so much!!! To be killed by a sea cow! What an ignominous ending! Then again, many the buffalo tangled its horns in a would be hunter. But the 6 Line was no danger to that hurkin big yellow guy. GRRR.

 

[AndyH5512]

I have never had a yellow tang, and this seals the deal for me. I will find other ways to deal with algae if it ever becomes an issue. I am sorry to hear about that.

 

[cd5]

I didn't sell the yellow tang with it, because it was in such poor shape.

In this case I would ask myself do you blame the tang becuase he is so mean, or the person that led him to be mean

 

[zuzecawi]

Okay, for one, I don't think there's much psychology in a fish. They have a pretty basic sense of instincts... eat... fight... screw... swim away... get new territory. This fish was in the get new territory and fight mode. I don't "Blame" the fish. I don't "like" or "dislike" the fish. I recognize the fish for what it is... an obnoxiously aggressive yellow tang. I don't think too highly of the woman the fish came from, or of anybody who lets live animals suffer, and believe me, if you saw this tang, you'd be pretty outraged too. I don't believe that the fish has motives of revenge though, or of "being mean." It's an aggressive fish, and it showed aggressive behaviors. So it's leaving my tank. Simple, cut and dry, and completely devoid of attributing human like behaviors to a small brained animal. Lets draw the line between instinctual behavior and psychological processing of motive and reaction. I don't however, hold the last lady to own the fish responsible for the attack. If anybody is half way responsible, it's me, for feeling bad for the fish, and trying to rehab it instead of putting it in the freezer. It's plenty fattened up, it's been gaining fin back at a really good rate, so it's not that the fish was currently starving. It's just, flat out, an aggressive fish. And I don't have room in my tank for aggressive fish. I thought I was Doing The Right Thing by keeping hold of it and getting it back in shape, but whether or not I was, it's beside the point. The fish is causing harm to my other charges, and so it needs to go somewhere else to rehab.

 

[Brenden]

I have 3 yellow tangs in my tank without issues. :?

 

[zuzecawi]

yeah, honestly, I've seen some aggressive tangs, but never THIS aggro. It tripped me out. It didn't seem that way in the 55. Maybe it was just the change of scenery. Maybe the new fish. It had a tank mate, a clarkii clown, the clown got fattened nicely and went with the 55, but I guess there hadn't been any other fish with them for oh, 3 years. The ex-owner had the system for 5 years, then got bored with it about half through last year. She didn't do any changes, checks, or maintenance in the final six months, and the fish were half starved to death when I got the tank. I had it just a couple months, and got all the water params back under control, the fish fed, and thought it was lookin good again. Sold it with a bunch of base rock from my 58's sump, some aquacultured live rock, and a massive bunch of mushrooms. This was just WEIRD. Does anybody else have any tales of murdering tangs? Maybe Steve-s out there has some insight?

 

[melosu58]

I think he will be OK once he gets used to his surroundings. I have a pretty big yellow tang and never had issues like that. and Andy ,dont let one yellow seal the deal. Most yellows are good fish and have a good attitude. Dont let one bad apple ruin the lot.

 

[TheRealFF]

I love yellow tangs. They are so friendly to other fishes. A few times when my dottyback attacked my fire gobi, my yellow tang with swim right between them to scare away the dottyback. It wasn't an coincidence because it happened quite often

Your tang is probably a hybrid XD jk

 

[BeGiNeR_7]

I have a yellow tang and his tank mate is also a clarkii clown. He has his moments but all in all he is a great fish. The clown fish will even put him in his place from time to time which is actually quite funny to see. He is a bit of a show off and likes to swim right in front of where ever you happen to be looking. Which makes it hard to look at much else when he is hungry or wants attention. It sounds like this other tang just had a bad owner who neglected it. It's just like with any other animal that has been neglected; it needs some time to adjust and learn to trust again. Then it should be okay. If you have a quarantine tank I would quarantine him though because stress could really overcome him.

 

[zuzecawi]

I have a quarantine tank, but it is much too small for a tang. It's only 38 gallons, and this is no small fish. I feel bad enough about it being in my 58 (which is only 36"x18"x24") without throwing it in the quarantine. Also, since it doesn't have any diseases, and it's healthy other than looking like crap and probably having the fish version of osteoporosis, I really just don't know about throwin it in a bare tank. The q tank doesn't have the best of water quality for a already stressed fish, and sure, I could do water changes from my main to it, but I'm a little nervous about throwing the tang in the q when the q hasn't been in use for months. I feel better about it stayin in the sump a couple days until either the guy who bought the other tank takes it, or I farm it out to Ryan's 100gallon sump. I will probably get the q running if I can't farm this guy out in a couple days though. Good suggestion.

You know, I have just never seen a yellow soooo aggressive. Even in the sump this guy lashes his tail at everything that moves. Bizarre. Like I said... vegetarian gone bad. Heh. I gotta flick some of my vegan friends some crap over this!

 

[cd5]

Okay, for one, I don't think there's much psychology in a fish. They have a pretty basic sense of instincts... eat... fight... screw... swim away... get new territory.

Don't forget feel pain

I don't however, hold the last lady to own the fish responsible for the attack.

That is an interesting statement considering she as stated

The ex-owner had the system for 5 years, then got bored with it about half through last year. She didn't do any changes, checks, or maintenance in the final six months, and the fish were half starved to death when I got the tank.

Can we assume that for example if we abuse a dog and make that dog mean we are held responsible for that dog temperment, A fish which I believe has a simplier mind even though similiar in ways to a dog, can hold the same ability to create there mean temperment which the same abuse?

 

[zuzecawi]

There is no way I would equate the intelligence of a fish to that of a dog. Dogs are capable of having advanced internalizations of their outer world, possibly even having abstract thought processes of cause and consequence. I do not believe this to be true of fish. And yes, stimulus such as pain and pleasure are "felt" by fish, in a neurological manner. But that doesn't indicate that the fish "remembers" it, and then is driven by motive to change it's actions in a retributionary manner. You are anthropomorphizing here, and while that goes over great on the big screen (hence, Finding Nemo,) it doesn't pan out in the real world. Fish don't hold grudges or take out revenge on the world because of past treatment. They flat out don't have the brain capapcity to support that kind of advanced behavior. If you wanted to argue that the fish had an "angry soul" that would probably be easier to prove than arguing that the fish is retaliating out of anger at past abuse like an abandoned child torturing the neighbors cat. Sure, fish can react in a predictable manner to certain stimulus, like appearing at the front of the tank when they're hungry, but I don't think that the fish is going to go "Well I appeared and nobody fed me so now I'm going to plot for six months and kill my new owner's small goby/wrasse/kitten/etc." While this is a great debate, and I'd be pleased to site references for you and direct you to some of my colleagues for further debate of this issue, it doesn't really need to be continued on the open forum. I'd be happy to continue it on IM though. Really, this thread was posted more to find out if anybody else had experienced something similar than to expound on whether or not fish are capable of advanced inner dialogue.

 

[pkremer]

Hehe! I am with you on this one zuzecawi. I had a friend once that thought maybe if I "punished" my gourami he would stop chasing my swordtails..Just doesn't work like that. Fish can respond to stimuli and perhaps learn a light and feeding schedule just like the ocean, but I don't believe you can "train" a fish to ignore his instinct.

You can train a dog to hold a treat on his nose for minutes until you give him permission to eat it....good luck doing that with a fish! hehe!

In any case, I agree, probably don't want to get a huge debate going, so I won't add any more fuel to the fire.

 

[CMD26]

I actually have a fairly aggressive yellow tang myself. When he was added to the tank there wern't many inhabitants so luckily he never managed to kill anything, though he did try quite eagerly to stab the heck out of his own reflection. He's calmed down somewhat but I still always have to watch him when I'm doing maintenence because occasionally he will try to stab me if I get to near his territory.

I recently acquired another yellow tang from a friend of mine that was in very bad shape. He has pretty severe HLLE and wasn't taken very good care of at all. I have him in his own tank where I'm trying to nurse him back to health. The funny thing is that he is about as docile as they come.

I really think it's just a fish by fish thing. Some have the agressive switch flipped on I guess. =)

 

[zuzecawi]

Well, the kid who bought the tank came and got the tang, I showed him how to do drip acclimation, and the tang and the clown are now reunited. Gave him a bunch of red and green nori, some formula two frozen food, and sent him on his way. And my tank is now safe again! That sucker tried to stab me while I was bagging it up, I triple bagged it in heavy duty freezer bags and told the kid not to put his hands too close to the fish's tail.

I guess I pulled a consolation prize out of this though, with my 6 line gone I finally got myself a target mandarine goby/dragonet. And I saw a really nice crimson red ricordea which I snatched up from the LFS. The goby is doing fine, it was in solitary at the LFS for around 3 months, looks a little skinny but was happily hunting away in my live rock labyrinth. I always wanted one of these guys, but never wanted the 6 line to out compete it, and I felt a little nervous about having both fish in just a 58 gallon tank, 180lbs lr to the side, that's not much space for two pod eating fish.