I Know, Everyone has Algae Problems, but...

[Porksound]

Mine is awfull... I can't win, and have no idea what's up!

Here goes...

It's dark maroon and if I allow it to grow it gets long strands (hair? Filament?)... it is smothering my live rock, where I clean it off the LR is bleached white, ugh. I've got some ideas about what might be causing but I can't get it to stop... the crabs won't touch it, my lawnmower blennie doesn't want anything to do with it, in fact the only thing I've seen eat it was a cerith snail that went up a tank wall and left a trail...

I'm not skimming (new tank, old skimmer no longer works, I'm buying a new one this week) but the growth so fast and huge (long strands, covering everything in 3 days) that I don't expect that a skimmer would help a lot... I did a 30% water change with no noticeable change in growth rate. All the fish/crabs are doing fine, no corals/anemonies yet... I want to figure this out before I start killing stuff!

The water I use is from the Natural Foods Co-op, I checked with the vendor and they assure me that it's reverse osmosis, and filtered... I tested it myself for Nitrates and they are 0, but... could this be silicon? Or, phosphate? I don't have a test for those yet. (maybe I should, heheh)... I'm going to be really put out if my hippie water is made by liars!!!

Anyway, any help would be greatly appreciated... this has been the easiest set up I've ever done (0 ammonia within 2 weeks, 0 nitrate within 3 weeks, GASP) but now, suddenly it's the late night horror show we all fear!!!

40 gallon (including sump)
45 lbs LR
40 lbs Arragonite
Hamilton VHO 10000k & true actinic (10 hours of white, 12 hours of actinic)
15 ceriths
5 nasas
2 bumble bees
15 hermits
1 green chromis
1 lawnmower blennie

HELP!!

P

[biotoxin]

you only checked nitrates? what about calcium? ph? alk? how long do you leave your lights on? what is your lighting anyway? Dark red algae could be coralline but hard to say without seeing a pic. Check all tank levels first.

[Porksound]

I only checked nitrates on the source water I've been using (the aforementioned "hippie water" I'm getting from the natural foods store).

In the tank

amm 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 5ppm
PH 8.2

It's NOT coraline... I've done this before, had a few reefs in the past... seen this stuff before, usualy short blooms that last a few days... this is just going on for weeks now, and it's making it hard on my coraline to grow... Not to mention being obscenely unnatractive

Thanks for the reply

p

[hoveboy]

Sounds like a bad case of the dreaded cyano to me
I have a problem with the stuff for about 2 months now.
Mine started just like yours at first, covering just about everything and multipying to monstrous proportions, forming filaments/strands and everything. I do have a skimmer (Red Sea Prism) and phosphate filter media but this didn't seem to help me at first. It was just so confusing as all my water perams were good.

This stuff is a pain and the only thing that will get it under control is time, patience, regular water changes (syphoning as much of the stuff out as you go), also keep an eye on the amount you are feeding...nutrients can soon build up if uneaten food is left to decomp. Lighting also seems to be a factor and I am still trying to work this one out....my cyano seems to 'develop' during the day with lights on and seems to 'die back' during the night. Some advice on this would be appreciated....

I spoke to my LFS only yesterday and he suggested lowering my water temp to around 75 (all his tanks are at that temp and he doesn't have so much as a sniff of the stuff!!). I have now lowered my temp and keeping my fingers crossed that this helps.
BTW, I have also tried the chemical approach and this didn't even touch the stuff.

Keep us posted on how you get on, it would be interesting to hear how a fellow sufferer is coping. 8)

HTH
Stu

[fishfreek]

Phosphate is a very good possibility as far as one of the fuels for this type of algae. Another thing is that its a new tank. New tanks go thru this as part of the maturing phase.

One thing you can do that will help is to syphon it out using a 1/2" diamater hose when you do your water changes. THis will remove it from your tank physically and help get it under control.

Another thing to do would be to get that skimmer working since one of the things that is fuiling the algae is the excess disolved organics in the water.

Agreed with the above info but the water source is a concern.

Originally Posted by Porksound

The water I use is from the Natural Foods Co-op, I checked with the vendor and they assure me that it's reverse osmosis, and filtered... I tested it myself for Nitrates and they are 0, but... could this be silicon? Or, phosphate? I don't have a test for those yet. (maybe I should, heheh)... I'm going to be really put out if my hippie water is made by liars!!!

Many commercial RO waters meant for human consumption are "re-mineralized" to prevent vitamin/mineral depletion in the human body. None are actually sold as what we would call pure water. Might wanna look into what's in it or demand an analysis from the seller. They should be required by law to perform a lab check on every run.

Cheers
Steve

[e-cat]

too get rid of it you can use erythromycin, im not sure if you can use it in a reef tank or not but fowlr it will be fine, its no cure for cyano bacteria but it will get ride of it, you best bet in my opinion is too get a skimmer and do water changes and find the source for the problem and correct it there.

[ohio reefer]

would a sally-light-foot crab help?

i had green hair algae and it took care of it.

i don't know if that would help.

mark

Probabley not. The only real crab that has even a small chance of eating it would (might) be a reg legged species of hermit Cilibanarius sp.

Cheers
Steve

[NightSpirit]

Originally Posted by e-cat

too get rid of it you can use erythromycin, im not sure if you can use it in a reef tank or not but fowlr it will be fine, its no cure for cyano bacteria but it will get ride of it, you best bet in my opinion is too get a skimmer and do water changes and find the source for the problem and correct it there.

However if he has an underlying problem, and uses erythromycin,
he will eventually end up with super, erythromycin resistent, cyano.

edited for spelling

[Hara]

I have alot of experience with cyano. I have 6 tanks currently in salt and all have had their share of cyano. I agree with the post from hoveboy, patience and constant perseverance are the cures to this. Please do yourself a favor and stay away from the chemicals and antibiotics as you will be just treating the symptoms and not the problem. One other thing that will help, if you can do it, (I am not sure what the contents of your tank is), is turning all lights off for 4 to 5 days. That will help. Get a good skimmer running online, continue to siphon daily, cut your feeding, no matter what it is, down by half. This will all help to cure it within a month or two.

The other thing to remember is we have all gone through this, and along with hair algae, it is the most frustrating thing that there is.

HTH.

[wseaton]

This is a cynano bloom, and that stuff loves warm lighting combined with nitrate.

The reason the nitrate levels are low in this tank is because the cyano is eating it as fast as it's produced. I bet as soon as the cyano is removed, the nitrate levels will increase, and hence you'll get another cyano bloom to compensate.

Get the skimmer working, and check your lighting. Chemical warfare is futile on this stuff and can do more harm than good.

Some conchs will eat cyano, but the cyano usually grows faster than they can consume it.

[Porksound]

Cheers everyone... thanks for all the help...

I understand that we really want to stop the cause not the condition, so I'm not going to try to medicate it. I have no corals/anemone's in this tank yet, so i'm not tooo worried about it except that it is having it's way with the fine coraline algae that's already on the LR.

I plan to look into the water quality, I've spoken already with the water vendor and they didn't mention anything about re-mineralizing, but then why would they?

My Nitrates were at 10ppm steady for 2weeks leading up to the bloom, and then dropped, so I suspect you're all right about that. It's a young tank, I'm hoping that within the next few weeks my society of Nitrate destroying bacteria will develop and this wn't be such a problem... I'm just afraid they'll never develop with this algae scarfing up all the nitrates...

I lowered my photoperiod to only 4 hours of white light (I don't want to stress the fish with no light at all) and feeding has been halved... we shall see...

thanks again.

p

[Lance126]

Will turning all the lights off for 4 to 5 days kill my corals? Also having Cyano Bloom

Originally Posted by Lance126

Will turning all the lights off for 4 to 5 days kill my corals? Also having Cyano Bloom

That would greatly depend on the corals but for the most part I would not suggest it. If there are no high light demanding SPS or clams, you could opt for just running the actinics instead without the white lighting and reduce the photoperiod to about 6 hrs/day. Please post your coral types to be sure though...

Manually removing the cyano via syphoning will also help immensely.

Cheers
Steve

[Porksound]

just as an update...

my local hippie water guy (he really is a hippie) swears that they do not remineralize and that they have no measureable silicates, nitrates etc... my own tests have confirmed this... in fact, he says he has several customers who buy bulk water from him for fishkeeping... shrug

I lowered my photoperiod, got some more cerith snails (who seem to eat it when it's in their path) and halved my feedings. It slowed a bit, but has not gone away!!!

So, yesterday I did a 20% Water Change with water bought at my LFS (their awesome, very knowledgeable... and they do tests regularly) and cleaned out as much of the offensive stuff as I could get to and BOOM! I get a massive bloom the next day. This with less light and less feeding... and my nitrates are still around 5 ppm or less (which I'm blaming on the cyano!)...

Honestly this stuff of mine doesn't play by the rules...

I finally got a skimmer (some things came up that prevented my being able to afford one when I wanted to get one)... I suspect the skimmer will work!

BUT... (and thanks to those who've read this far... I know I rattle on) could this be the result of poor lights? I've got (GASP) coralife bulbs... they came with my new fixture and well, I just didn't want to replace them if they'd work. I know these can be a little dishonest when they say "10,000 K" etc... so, if the spectrum is off, could it cause my woe and pain? (I think I already know the answer to this!!!)

thanks again everyone....

p

Originally Posted by Porksound

BUT... (and thanks to those who've read this far... I know I rattle on) could this be the result of poor lights? I've got (GASP) coralife bulbs... they came with my new fixture and well, I just didn't want to replace them if they'd work. I know these can be a little dishonest when they say "10,000 K" etc... so, if the spectrum is off, could it cause my woe and pain? (I think I already know the answer to this!!!)

Getting rid of cyano is not something that can be dealt with as an overnight "remedy". It can take a bit of time and diligence. Continual manual removal and the other things you have been doing will help in time. As to the lighting, it will depend on how long you've had them. Coralife makes great cost effective hood but I am not a fan of their bulbs. IME, they do not last as long as you'd think and generally need replacing about every 8ish months depending on how long they are run each day. If available, I would switch to CSL if it's time to switch. The spectrum is much better, they should last a few months longer and if I'm not mistaken are a similar cost.

Cheers
Steve