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Old 07-05-2004, 08:57 PM   #1
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Lots of Death Update

Well, if you read my most recent post, I believe my cucumber when nuclear. It took out all of the turbos and Astrea snails. It took out several hermits, I don't see any feather dusters, and the cladacora has all gone white.

Positive notes: Condy is on the move, but fine. Yellow Tang and Lawnmower Blenny seem uneffected.

I'm running GAC in my sump now to try to remove any toxins. Anyone have any further suggestions, or any opinion on how long to wait before reintroducing snails back into the system?
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Old 07-05-2004, 09:12 PM   #2
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Re: Lots of Death

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bearfan
Positive notes: Condy is on the move, but fine. Yellow Tang and Lawnmower Blenny seem uneffected.
To be honest I don't think you've nailed the cause of the problem. Inverts will typically live through something like this as long as water quality is repaired soon after. Fish unfortunately are almost immediately affected and pretty much never survive depending on the size of the cuke and tank volume.

You've tested everything?

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Old 07-05-2004, 09:15 PM   #3
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Yep:

SG 1.0245
Temp 80.3
PH 8.1
KH 120ppm
CA 420+
NO3 0
NO2 0
NH3 0

I just don't know what else it could be. I've recently increased flow, but that wouldn't kill off the inverts. The cladacora is white now, so that suggests something chemical. And the cucumber has white lines down his body and is somewhat deflated.

A couple of hermits did survive, and all of the nassarius snails appear to have survived also.
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Old 07-05-2004, 09:28 PM   #4
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Could you post a pic of the cuke?

I would also ask about the household to see if anything airborn was possibley used? Aerosol, carpet fresheners or the like. Tank specs look fine otherwise.

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Old 07-05-2004, 09:28 PM   #5
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What has been introduced recently? How quick did the cladacora go white? Brown jelly is certainly a possibility their.
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Old 07-05-2004, 09:48 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve-s
Could you post a pic of the cuke?

I would also ask about the household to see if anything airborn was possibley used? Aerosol, carpet fresheners or the like. Tank specs look fine otherwise.
I have a picture of him originally in my gallery. I'll get a pic of him now.

The room it is in has wood floors. No new chemicals introduced.

Quote:
Originally Posted by reefrunner69
What has been introduced recently? How quick did the cladacora go white? Brown jelly is certainly a possibility their.
The flow was increased, the yellow tang and lawnmower blenny were introducted.

I'm wondering if the yellow tang picked on the cucumber and it released it's defenses. The yellow tang has pretty much made short work of my yellow sponge that was near it.
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Old 07-05-2004, 10:05 PM   #7
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I can't get a good pic of him in the QT tank he's in.

Basically, he has white lines that run down the length of his body. Most of the knobs were smooth, and are starting to reappear. He appears to be slowly recovering.
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Old 07-05-2004, 10:29 PM   #8
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BTW...cladacora went white almost overnight.
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Old 07-07-2004, 11:45 AM   #9
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Skimmer is seriously working overtime with all of the death. A pleasant side effect...it appears to have killed off all of the aiptasia as well.

Fish appear to be fine, as well as the condy. Hermits appear to be returning to normal, and nassarius snails are active.

Anyone have a suggestion on how long to wait before reintroducing inverts?

All of the tests are normal, still, never did change.
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Old 07-07-2004, 01:24 PM   #10
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Another observation...

The spaghetti worms are back out, and some of the feather dusters are as well. Noticed a bristle worm burried in the sand along the glass. Good signs.

Still have two questions:

1. How long should I wait to reintroduce snails?

2. Will the cladacora regain it's color like it did when I first got it and it was white?
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Old 07-07-2004, 01:44 PM   #11
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how long have ya had the snails that died and how many was it ?? i read that turbos/astreas dont live long in our tanks due the the higher water temps !! it slowly kills them from what ive read !! but if was me id wait a week change out some water and place an order
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Old 07-07-2004, 03:44 PM   #12
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Kinda what I figured. It was the turbos and astreas that bit it.

Anyone know if the cladacora will color up again like it did initially? Is the white a sign of stress or death? It has turned from white to red before in my tank.
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Old 07-07-2004, 06:26 PM   #13
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Sorry Bearfan, don't mean to detract from your topic but I just wanted to express my own observations on this.

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i read that turbos/astreas dont live long in our tanks due the the higher water temps !! it slowly kills them from what ive read !!
While I do not dispute the observation on the Mexican Turbo, this is not true of the whole species. Most Turban sp snails are quite long lived and will tolerate higher temps just fine. I keep several Turbinidae sp (not mexican) that do quite well and have had them for many years. It really comes down to the exact species as to how well they fair.

The problem at hand....

As far as when to add anything back to the tank, the returning visibility of the animals is definately a good sign. I would wait a week or so longer just to be sure. As far as the cladacora, to hard to tell without being sure what truely caused it in the first place. The fact things started looking better after the cuke was removed is definately strong evidence, it could also just be coincidence. LPS coral in general are quite hardy and as long as everything starts looking better and the cladacora starts opening up again it should regain it's color. I have several times purchaced bleached LPS coral that almost always regain some sort of color, although not as vibrant as I would have hoped. I would say better than 80% though as long as it opens up again.

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Old 07-07-2004, 08:57 PM   #14
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Thanks steve-s. Good insight.

I'm a patient person, and will probably wait a couple weeks to make sure everything is all good. I'm doing small water changes (a couple gallons) daily and running GAC as well as my normal skimmer. Things are definately looking up.
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Old 07-08-2004, 09:45 PM   #15
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The cladacora is starting to color up again. The pods are abundant. Some aips are returning , and the hermits are active as ever. Things are back on track.
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Old 07-08-2004, 10:24 PM   #16
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dr. ron has an article that covers turbos in the previous issue of reefkeeping magazine...

"A large number of Trochoideans are sold to reef aquarists despite having little or no chance of long-term survival in a reef tank. Most of these are collected from the northern shores of Baja California. Although it's south of the United States, the marine environment of the northern part of this peninsula is anything but tropical. Its Pacific side is bathed in waters that are quite cool, and is the home of several Trochoideans that are collected for the reef aquarium hobby. These animals typically have a tolerance for warm conditions, and they are often intertidal animals and can withstand quite hot water - for a while. Prolonged exposure to warm conditions, however, kills them."

furthermore, they require acclimation periods that are on the order of five to ten hours. if they survive shorter acclimation times, they may still have internal damage which could kill them weeks later.

here the quote i read !
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Old 07-08-2004, 10:35 PM   #17
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I do not dispute the observation on the Mexican Turbo, this is not true of the whole species.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scuba_steve
Most of these are collected from the northern shores of Baja California.


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Old 07-08-2004, 10:37 PM   #18
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All this and no one is happy that my tank has returned from the brink of destruction?
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Old 07-08-2004, 10:38 PM   #19
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yea i knew that just wanted to add that !! but were did ya get your snails if i may ask ? been using reeftopia but didnt bother with turbos :-/
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Old 07-08-2004, 10:44 PM   #20
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All this and no one is happy that my tank has returned from the brink of destruction?


Does somebody need a hug?... LOL


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