Unfortunately i have to disagree mr x. I have friends that have very good led fixture and i have not seen the same results as a metal halide. T5 grow sps corals much slower than metal halides and from what i have seen so do leds. I also have a smaller tank that runs on t5 and the growth rate of my sps corals is not the same as my other tank with metal halides. Dont get me wrong i think that leds are great and i know they can grow sps corals good but not at the rate metal halides can. I personally dont think that led tech has reached where it needs to be yet. I believe soon they will be able to get the same results as metal halides but not right now.
Upgrading Lights to T5HO
- Thread starter Lionfish210
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mr_X
Aquarium Advice Addict
You have it wrong. Its not a matter of what type of light you have that makes corals grow, its. How much PAR/PUR you are getting. As long as you have enough usable light, any type of lighting will work. LED lighting is the most efficient to date. Way more efficient than metal halide. As far as technology is concerned, LED puts out the most, with the least amount of energy used, period.
Readingexcalibur
Aquarium Advice Addict
Newbie here, but I agree with mr x. My LEDs often feel like to much light, even for my sps. I think LEDs are at a point now where metal halides are obsolete. Just my opinion. I read an article the other day saying the first led was made in the early 60s. Thats 50years of growth on the tech. (now if I could only stop bleaching my corals, lol)
Sniperhank
Giant Clam Addict
What was stated above is true. Mh is obsolete when you compare par, pur, heat output, and cost. It sometimes might not feel like it, but it's there. I murdered a pink birdsnest because i under estimated my radions.
SWSCJ
Aquarium Advice Freak
When the LED market becomes competitive enough amongst the manufactures to bring the pricing down and all the quirks get ironed out I'll be in the market. For instance, my tank with a 36" depth would have cost me between $4000.00 and $6000.00 for a product that hasn't been out that long. Not worth the risk. We'll see where things are, in the LED industry, when we do our tank build in a few years where the depth will be 84". Until then, "flame on" with the old reliables MHs, T5s, and a used chiller. Cost, right at $1500.00.
Readingexcalibur
Aquarium Advice Addict
SWSCJ said:
I would almost think an LED would be better for depth because the beam of light isn't wide but narrow and straight down. I would think it would travel deeper and maintain its strength. IMO, the expense of the LED is more because there is no replacement cost. My led is advertised at 30% reduction in 10 years. I think they will get cheaper eventually, but not in the next few years to come. I debated on MH and own a T5HO. I love my LEDs.
SWSCJ
Aquarium Advice Freak
Well, just like you said " the beam of light isn't wide but narrow and straight down." Which means I'm going to need a lot of LEDs to get the coverage I need, which means the initial cost is going to be even higher. I'm not necessarily disputing that LEDs aren't the way to go, in fact I wanted to go that way. The other factor is when I upgrade to a larger tank it will be easier to sell my 450 and let the new owner make that decision. My MHs run 4 hrs a day, T5s the rest of the time. My chiller runs a few hrs a day as well. My fish and corals are awesome with color and growth. I stay consistent. But, I would like to see my tank under LEDs.
mr_X
Aquarium Advice Addict
That would entirely depend on what optics you are using. The fixtures I am using have no optics at all, so the spread is very wide. I got away with 3 of them over a 7' tank and everything did very well. These have the same spread as a halide does, if not a little more.
As far as pricing goes, you can do without the bells and whistles and spend a lot less than you think. I am lighting an 8' x 30" footprint for just over $600.00.
As far as pricing goes, you can do without the bells and whistles and spend a lot less than you think. I am lighting an 8' x 30" footprint for just over $600.00.
SWSCJ
Aquarium Advice Freak
Manufacture and specs? I'll check them out.
mr_X
Aquarium Advice Addict
Check my build thread, towards the end. There are links to the ones I have, which aren't dimmable, and also some folks have posted links to newer, dimmable versions. I'm happy with mine but if I had it to do over again, I would want the dimmable option.
SWSCJ
Aquarium Advice Freak
http://aquariumdigest.wordpress.com/2010/04/11/led-aquarium-lights-lighting/
There's more to the LEDs than I had realized. And after speaking to one of my subcontractors today, who is an electrical engineer/designer, he said there is more detail than is let on with regards to LEDs. You get what you pay for and you still need to do the research for "your" tank.
There's more to the LEDs than I had realized. And after speaking to one of my subcontractors today, who is an electrical engineer/designer, he said there is more detail than is let on with regards to LEDs. You get what you pay for and you still need to do the research for "your" tank.
mr_X
Aquarium Advice Addict
That must be some outdated information. They mention only 1 Taotronics fixture which has 220 one watt LEDs. The ones I am using are 55 three watt LEDs pushed to 2 watts a piece. I have done months of research on these as they are growing SPS in my tank that's 30" away from the fixture.
I don't know (no one does, unless they buy a 3 thousand dollar meter) the PUR output, but the PAR numbers easily match a 250 watt metal halide.
I don't know (no one does, unless they buy a 3 thousand dollar meter) the PUR output, but the PAR numbers easily match a 250 watt metal halide.
mr_X
Aquarium Advice Addict
I think my build thread has them, but that was the 31" tank. Not my new tank. The PAR on the sand bed in this tank (25" deep) is around 220.
My only complaint is that I didn't get the dimmable fixtures so I could turn them down a bit.
My only complaint is that I didn't get the dimmable fixtures so I could turn them down a bit.
SWSCJ
Aquarium Advice Freak
http://aquariumopinions.wordpress.com/2012/03/02/taotronics-skyled-led-light-reviews/
Here's a professional review of the 55 x 3w Taotronics fixture dated 3/2/12.
Your stating that no one knows the PUR....direct from the article
" Finally it is important to note that even if this were a reef capable LED fixture, the proportion of Daylight to blue is incorrect for most common aquarium depth requires, so poor PUR is going to be the result! "
It is important to note that an LED (or any light) can test well for PAR using a PAR meter, but still have poor “Useful Light Energy” (PUR)
Here's a professional review of the 55 x 3w Taotronics fixture dated 3/2/12.
Your stating that no one knows the PUR....direct from the article
" Finally it is important to note that even if this were a reef capable LED fixture, the proportion of Daylight to blue is incorrect for most common aquarium depth requires, so poor PUR is going to be the result! "
It is important to note that an LED (or any light) can test well for PAR using a PAR meter, but still have poor “Useful Light Energy” (PUR)
mr_X
Aquarium Advice Addict
Quoting someone from "my aquarium opinions" hardly convinces me of a professional review.
That statement is nonsense btw. The writer doesn't know the PUR output of the fixture, or he would have listed it. It's a guess. The amount of white and blue is of no importance when considering intensity. You should know that quote "the proportion of Daylight to blue is incorrect for most common aquarium depth requires" to be false, due to the countless tanks that use 20k halides over 24" deep tanks. 20,000k is certainly too blue for 24" of water, but the corals don't even know it. It's for your viewing pleasure only.
"I will admit that I have not personally used the TaoTronic LED"
No PUR meter used here.
The proof is on the sand bed, where my amateur eyes witness SPS getting great growth and coloration. As a matter of fact, these fixtures I have are so weak, I just raised 2 of them up another 6" so I could stop bleaching my LPS.
That statement is nonsense btw. The writer doesn't know the PUR output of the fixture, or he would have listed it. It's a guess. The amount of white and blue is of no importance when considering intensity. You should know that quote "the proportion of Daylight to blue is incorrect for most common aquarium depth requires" to be false, due to the countless tanks that use 20k halides over 24" deep tanks. 20,000k is certainly too blue for 24" of water, but the corals don't even know it. It's for your viewing pleasure only.
"I will admit that I have not personally used the TaoTronic LED"
No PUR meter used here.
The proof is on the sand bed, where my amateur eyes witness SPS getting great growth and coloration. As a matter of fact, these fixtures I have are so weak, I just raised 2 of them up another 6" so I could stop bleaching my LPS.
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SWSCJ
Aquarium Advice Freak
The author of that piece has been involved in professional aquarium maintenance since 1987 in Southern California.
The web page mission statement: I will address these subjects in upcoming posts based on my experience, those in the industry that I know have true knowledge of said products, and based factual research of said products.
http://aap.atrixnet.com/?p=338
Maybe this article will clear it up....from the article above
If you are still considering one of these LED knock-offs (that use “off the shelf emitters”), realize the most important light measurement is “Useful Light Energy” or PUR and although most lighting professionals recommend the use of PAR Meters as a measurement of any aquarium lighting fixture, in the end this is still not 100% accurate, especially when one compares the best emitter bins to many of the older emitter bins used by the cheaper Chinese or similar LED light fixtures. Often the “cheap” LEDs produce considerably more useless green/yellow light and are bottom heavy in the Blue Spectrum. It is also noteworthy that a couple of these low price LED makers from China are also using stolen technology emitters and pending lawsuits will likely result in these manufacturers not being around long term for any real customer support.
The purpose of this Aquarium Supplies & Resources is to provide Resources for top notch/researched Aquarium Information.
The web page mission statement: I will address these subjects in upcoming posts based on my experience, those in the industry that I know have true knowledge of said products, and based factual research of said products.
http://aap.atrixnet.com/?p=338
Maybe this article will clear it up....from the article above
If you are still considering one of these LED knock-offs (that use “off the shelf emitters”), realize the most important light measurement is “Useful Light Energy” or PUR and although most lighting professionals recommend the use of PAR Meters as a measurement of any aquarium lighting fixture, in the end this is still not 100% accurate, especially when one compares the best emitter bins to many of the older emitter bins used by the cheaper Chinese or similar LED light fixtures. Often the “cheap” LEDs produce considerably more useless green/yellow light and are bottom heavy in the Blue Spectrum. It is also noteworthy that a couple of these low price LED makers from China are also using stolen technology emitters and pending lawsuits will likely result in these manufacturers not being around long term for any real customer support.
The purpose of this Aquarium Supplies & Resources is to provide Resources for top notch/researched Aquarium Information.
mr_X
Aquarium Advice Addict
Many people have been keeping tanks for 10 years or even 20. It doesn't mean they know anything more than anyone else. The technology 20 years ago is not even used today so that knowledge is worthless here. This guy knows less than me, since all he has to go by is hearsay. What state he lives in is irrelevant.
As for the second article- How do we know these aren't the "stolen" technology and not the weaker technology?
Obviously, the author doesn't know.
Are you missing my comment about being able to grow SPS on the sand bed?
As for the second article- How do we know these aren't the "stolen" technology and not the weaker technology?
Obviously, the author doesn't know.
Are you missing my comment about being able to grow SPS on the sand bed?
mr_X
Aquarium Advice Addict
I am in no way saying these are the same as the ones that cost a thousand dollars, but I'm saying that you can definitely keep a reef tank under these and nothing in the tank is going to lack. Go ahead and purchase the Audi if you want. I'm sticking with my VW Golf for now.
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