150 crash

[150fresh]

hey gang
cant figure this one out. I have a 150 freshwater that has crashed twice. The tank cycled in five weeks according to the local aquarium store. So I added plants and about 12 fish. everything went well for about a month. So I added 4 more they did well for about 2 weeks, then they all died within 2 days. It looked like their skins peeled. Some plants died others are doing well. Did a couple of water changes to clean out debris, about 30 % each over a 4 week span. Added fish yesterday, found the ph @ 6 this morning. Some fish were already dead. Added baking soda to increase ph. Rest of fish died within an hour. Please help if you can. Im stumped

 

[Abiduwhabi]

Have you messed with the filtration system any?Like cleaning the media?
Also, what are your results for Nitrate,nitrite, and ammonia?

 

[Brookster123]

So many variables... Please take some time and surf through as many start up threads as you can today... There is so much that goes into maintaining a tank if that size... We need all the info you can provide on your setup to better assist you! Welcome to AA!!

 

[Mebbid]

Agreed, we need more info.

Water change schedule
Average ph
Ammonia
Nitrite
Nitrate
Source water
Kh
How did you cycle the tank

 

[squirrilah fish]

Sounds like you got hit with nitrite spikes. They strike fast and hard. Your feeding habits would help too.

 

[150fresh]

great questions gang. was trying to do a data dump. Filtration - 2 emperor 400. changed cartridges. never touch the bio wheels. Ph of water is a strong 7.6+. water tested from tap before put in tank. since it is city water also tested for ammonia reading 0. Cycle process took 5-6 weeks. weekly tests at reputable aquarium only store. not locale pet store. Liquid tests were used, not test strips. Nitrite spike is a good question, will test and see results. Thanks for the input

 

[Mebbid]

You really need to buy your own test kit. They can be bought online for less than $30. You also left quite a bit unanswered in my list of questions. Could you fill in the gaps?

 

[squirrilah fish]

Do you rinse the cartridges off before putting them in? Do you change every cartridge at the same time? I like to rinse the old cartridge off onto the new cartridge as I'm rinsing it off to give it a jump start, but if you just take the cartridges out, and put them right in, or if your changing every cartridge at the same time you really weaken the bio, and that can result in the nitrite spike I suspect.

 

[squirrilah fish]

Also are you treating your city water with anything? Ammonia isn't the only concern, it could have chlorine, or chloramine, or heavy metals. All of which are toxic to fish.
Seachems Prime is the best water treatment in mine (and many others) opinion. A $20 bottle will treat like, 2,500 gallons of water. So in perspective it's pretty cheap. A $20 bottle of prime usually lasts me 2-3 months between 3 (sometimes 4 with th QT) tanks.

 

[150fresh]

hey gang.
treating water w/ amquel. I do pre-rinse cartridges
tests taken today
ph 8.4
kh 300
chlor 0
gh 0
nitrite 0
nitrate 0
temp 79-80

 

[venymae]

what is your water change schedule? What is your feeding schedule?

 

[Caliban07]

Sounds like ph or chlorine issue to me from the info so far.

You haven't mentioned anything about water changes. Did you fishless cycle the tank then add fish without doing water changes?

 

[squirrilah fish]

Sounds like ph or chlorine issue to me from the info so far.

You haven't mentioned anything about water changes. Did you fishless cycle the tank then add fish without doing water changes?

Ya so far we've had a ph of 6, 7, and 8.4.

What is the normal PH of your tap water.? And what PH are you trying to buffer too? Do you use anything besides baking soda, and amquel?

 

[Sk3lly]

Consistent pH is a must. Large swings between the pH values you've mentioned may shock your fish and cause deaths.
By swerving the water change questions it leads me to assume your not doing regular weekly water changes. So nitrAte levels may be sky high. You should really try to achieve 50% weekly

 

[squirrilah fish]

I would pick up the following

A test kit, at least a 6-1,
Prime, to treat water going into the tank
Stability, to help eleviate ammonia and nitrite spikes
An official aquarium PH buffer, no more "home remedies"
And wait to add any fish at least a month, until there is some consistency. You can get some cheap goldfish to be canaries so to speak, but I would wait on adding any fish you want to keep.

It any seen expensive buying all this stuff, but it's more expensive replacing all your fish,

Once it stable, all you will need is prime to treat the water going in , unless the ph of your water source is off, then you will need to add that too. But both Prine and a bottle if PH buffer can last a long time
All I use now is prime in my tap water, a $20 bottle lasts me 3-4 months between 4 tanks.
You can also reuse filter cartridges by rinsing them off in room temperature or warm water (too cold/too hot kills the bio) once a month. I usually change my cartridges every 3 months. But I do it staggered.
For example I have 5 different cartridges in my 90, so I replace one a month.

But I rinse all them off once a month,
In fact I do my maintenance every Sunday, I do a. 25-50% water change every week, and a deep clean 50% change once a month.

 

[Rivercats]

Don't waste money on test strips as they are often not reliable. An API Master Test kit is a must.

Now just so you know anytime ph drops to 6 or below biological activity stops and BB actually begins to die off. My guess is your bouncing ph is disrupting your cycle and by not doing daily testing of ammonia and nitrites your having spikes in one or both resulting in fish loss. Have your read how to do a fish in cycle? You have to test water daily for ammonia and nitrites and do 50% WC anytime either reads .25ppm. Even in a 150g tank. Now something else to think about is with a tank that size (I have a 220g so am speaking from experience) you may not be actually adding enough fish to produce enough ammonia to even cycle the tank. There are many factors that could be causing you issues and perhaps you would be best off doing a fishless cycle in which you still need to get a master test kit.

 

[squirrilah fish]

Don't waste money on test strips as they are often not reliable. An API Master Test kit is a must.

Now just so you know anytime ph drops to 6 or below biological activity stops and BB actually begins to die off. My guess is your bouncing ph is disrupting your cycle and by not doing daily testing of ammonia and nitrites your having spikes in one or both resulting in fish loss. Have your read how to do a fish in cycle? You have to test water daily for ammonia and nitrites and do 50% WC anytime either reads .25ppm. Even in a 150g tank. Now something else to think about is with a tank that size (I have a 220g so am speaking from experience) you may not be actually adding enough fish to produce enough ammonia to even cycle the tank. There are many factors that could be causing you issues and perhaps you would be best off doing a fishless cycle in which you still need to get a master test kit.

Yes an API test kit would be the BEST choice, but in the event you can't afford that you need at-least something to test Ammonia, Nitrite, PH, alkalinity, nitrate, and hardness everyday, or MORE.
When I set up a new tank, which I think we are saying yours qualifies as. I test it in the morning and at night.

Like Rivercats said, read up on fish-in cycling vs fish-out cycling.
Fish in is harder, and takes more work
Fish-out takes longer.

 

[Rivercats]

I also do not suggest using a PH buffer if your tap water ph/kh/gh is high. If those readings are high then doing a large weekly WC will aid in keeping buffers in the water so ph remains stable. Its very common for ph to drop a lot at the end of the cycling process which is why one or two large WC's are often needed to readd buffers to raise ph. If you find down the road your ph continually drops even with weekly WC's you can add some crushed coral to your filter or in a media bag under the filter outflow. Also using rocks like Texas Holey Rocks that leach calcium into the water will greatly help keep ph higher.

 

[Rare]

great questions gang. was trying to do a data dump. Filtration - 2 emperor 400. changed cartridges. never touch the bio wheels.

I'm just gonna throw out there for future. The emperor 400 bio-wheel. Not sure about that bio-wheel & how much can it process on what bio-load. Get yourself some matrix, ceramic rings etc in a mesh bag or move up to a big canister type filter will be best.