Acclimating Fish Kept in FW to BW?

[Legacy]

Here's my situation:

I'm starting a new 40G Brackish Mangrove Swamp Tank that is ready for water and livestock. I'm going to be stocking it with 5 juvenille archerfish that are currently being kept in Freshwater at the LFS. I will also be cycling the tank with Bio-Spira and the 5 fish all at once so I don't have to worry about killing any existing bacteria since there isn't any in there.

What is the best way to approach this?

I was thinking that this weekend I would go and buy about 30G of RO/DI water and mix it with Instant Ocean to get a SG of 1.005 then add the fish and bio-spira into that. Then maybe slowly raise the SG as they mature.

Any Suggestions?

[tecwzrd]

First of all imo a 40 gal is a bit too small for 5 Archerfish in the long run (plus I assume you might want something else besides the one type of fish). They range in size from 9� up to 12+� and would need a 100+ gal tank to accommodate 5 of them without aggression issues as adults. 2 would be fine in a 40 gal along with a few other types of small fish. They mostly eat live foods exclusively (mostly small insects & worms) and feeding them frozen or flake might not work although some have been able to train them to take it.

Some good profile links.
http://freshaquarium.about.com/cs/qa/f/faq0014.htm
http://www.naturia.per.sg/buloh/verts/archer_fish.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archerfish
http://fish.mongabay.com/species/Toxotes_chataeus.html
http://www.aquariacentral.com/specie...h&uid=default&ID=0574&view_records=1

I’ve used the SW (they make a FW version also) Bio-Spira with mixed results. I still had a mini cycle so I would do a fishless cycle before adding any fish to be on the safe side.
http://www.aquariumadvice.com/showqu...q=2&fldAuto=15

Once the tank has fully cycled, use the drip method in a 5 gal bucket till the total water volume has tripled (about 2-3 drops a second, this will take anywhere from 2 to 4 hours depending on starting water volume.)
http://saltaquarium.about.com/librar...y/aa111802.htm

You don’t need to raise the SG much beyond 1.008 until they grow larger for now. Anymore might create too high of a PH as they prefer PH around 7.5 About 1 to 2 cups of marine salt mix per 5 gal should get you close. Use a good hydrometer.

Have you considered African Cichlids? Extremely hardy, colorful & entertaining and will eat just about anything. http://www.cichlids.com/

[Legacy]

That's what I hear every time I say I have a 40G and plan to have 5 archers... but nobody really knows that the plan is to move these archers(1.5-2") into a 180G with live mangroves. I'm actually planning to keep only the archers and make it a species only tank unless I can either get the SG up high enough from Monos or enough beach area with shallow water for mudskippers. That is still like a year away from now an still in the works.

I put the water in last night and I have a SG of 1.008 which is too high. I'd like to start them out at about 1.003 and gradually build them up to a higher SG as they mature. Water temp is about 80 degrees. Water level of 10".

I'll be feeding them them crickets/mealworms/bloodworms and I'll try to get them on freeze dried or frozen krill... and maybe freeze dried crickets.

thanks for the advice, I'll try the bucket method. =)

[tecwzrd]

A 180 gal would be plenty of room down the road and you should have about 2-3 years before they outgrow that 40 gal. Also if you are using a tank size of 36� long 18� wide with 10� of water you have 28 gal in their currently.

The drip method works best for acclimating any fish, especially when going from FW to one with any SG. It’s a shame your lfs doesn’t keep them in brackish tanks Do you use ro\di water or tap? Have you tested your tap for NO3?

Are you going to cycle your tank first without the fish or dump them in with the Bio-Spira? Being that the tank is brackish I’m not 100% sure either the FW or SW versions of Bio-Spira would work because of the bacteria being designed for one or the other. I’d go with the SW version personally since you are closer to that SG.

You will still probably have a mini cycle for a couple of weeks so watch your NH3 & NO2 closely as even small quantities can kill/sicken them quickly.

When doing pwc make sure you premix your water in a clean bucket overnight or for at least 8 hours prior to using with a PH. Most SW mixes will dissolve quickly but the chemicals can be caustic to the fish when not properly mixed thoroughly.

Best of luck to you getting your archers to eat frozen or dried

[Legacy]

Yeah, bummed that the LFS doesn't have brackish tanks. They're all setup to one water supply as are most of the LFS in the So Cal area. Strictly fresh or salt.

I actually used Conditioned Tap. I haven't tested the tap for NO3, didn't even think about that. So far all I've tested is the PH which is about 7.8.

A lot of the brackish people on Fish Geeks said they've all had success with bio-spira in brackish. I'll probably lower the SG from 1.008 all the way down to 1.002-3 so it's really low end brackish for the initial cycle and grow upon that .002 every week or so until I get it where I want it.

Haha! Not keeping my fingers crossed on the frozen or dried goods. =)

[Legacy]

Originally Posted by tecwzrd

Have you tested your tap for NO3?

Just tested the tap water for NO3 and read 20.

[flamingonhot]

Just start out with freshwater, add the bio-spira, and raise the salinity slowly over a period of days.

Don't add the bio-spira and fish at the same time. Bio-spira is good but it's not a miracle worker. Let the bacteria cling to the substrate and stuff so it can get a little more established.

[Legacy]

Originally Posted by flamingonhot

Just start out with freshwater, add the bio-spira, and raise the salinity slowly over a period of days.

Don't add the bio-spira and fish at the same time. Bio-spira is good but it's not a miracle worker. Let the bacteria cling to the substrate and stuff so it can get a little more established.

How much time before the fish should I add the Bio-spira? All the directions indicate to use it with a full bio-load of fish or else chances are it wont work to it's full potential. The water shouldn't be harmful to the fish imediately either, right?, Because there won't be any toxins present until the wish start leaving waste?

Can the bacteria survive without ammonia in the water to eat? Won't the bacteria cling to my bio-media in my Aquaclear110?

Sorry about all the questions all at once.

[Legacy]

Oh, and I just lowered my SG from 1.008 to 1.002-3.

[greenmaji]

salinity is a tricky subject.. .002 a week is what I normaly advise for acclimating.. it sounds like your salinity might be changeing too quickly for the bacteria and the fish..

[Menagerie]

When I converted an established FW to BW, we allowed weeks to pass as we slowly raised the salinity. It's not just the fish that are adapting, but the bacteria in the filter.

[Legacy]

Originally Posted by Menagerie

When I converted an established FW to BW, we allowed weeks to pass as we slowly raised the salinity. It's not just the fish that are adapting, but the bacteria in the filter.

Menagerie, I always look forward to your posts since I know you've had a lot of brackish experience.

My tank isn't established yet. 1.003 SG without any bacteria yet. My fish are paciently waiting to go in the tank... just floating at the moment.


Straight chillin'....

[flamingonhot]

yes it'll cling to the filter mediaBut it's needs time to do that and get established a little. You could add a little piece of shrimp, but since the fish are practically almost in there they should have enough ammonia to live.

[Legacy]

Originally Posted by greenmaji

salinity is a tricky subject.. .002 a week is what I normaly advise for acclimating.. it sounds like your salinity might be changeing too quickly for the bacteria and the fish..

Greenmaji, you're right it's way to drastic of a change for bacteria and fish, but wasn't either of those when I made the change. It's going to stay at low brackish for a few weeks to let the bacteria and fish settle in and then I'll start moving it up very slowly when I'm sure the occupants are ready.

The archers should enjoy the low SG brackish since they're still juvenilles. A little more salt than the freshwater they were being kept in, yet not too salty to upset them...

I HOPE!

[Legacy]

Originally Posted by flamingonhot

yes it'll cling to the filter mediaBut it's needs time to do that and get established a little. You could add a little piece of shrimp, but since the fish are practically almost in there they should have enough ammonia to live.

When researching the acclimation process it said to NEVER use the water the fish were shipped in... however, mine we're shipped. The water came out of the LFS about 2hours ago.

Seems like the ammonia that built up in the bag with the fish would be good for the bacteria to feed on... toss it anyway just for good measure?

[rich311k]

I would not use the water in the bag. You have no idea what is in it.

[Legacy]

I poured the fish out of the bag and into a 5G bucket and kept the water just in case someone said to use it. I'll just dump the water now. I moved them over into the tank with a net. Added Bio-spira a few minutes before I added the fish.

The lights are off and the fish are exploring every corner. My wife has already started to name them. The largest is only 2" and the smallest is about 1.5" so they have what seems to be a ridiculous amount of swimming area.

The LFS got the Bio-spira in this week so it's fresh. I took it from their fridge and put it straight into an ice chest I had ready waiting in the car. So hopefully the 4 T. Jaculatrix will produce enough ammonia to feed the bacteria.

How soon should I start testing the water parameters? I'll post some pictures in a new thread in the appropriate forum in a few hours when I can start up the light.

You all have been a HUGE help... I'll be back for more if this whole thing takes a downward spiral out of control.

[rich311k]

Start testing tomorrow. Good luck.

[Legacy]

Ah, well that explains why only an hour later my readings are:

NH3 - 8.0ppm
NO2 - 0ppm
NO3 - 0ppm

I freaked when I saw how high the ammonia is. I hope it starts going down fast.

[azn_fishy55]

I had a problem with this,acclimating my Bumble Bee Gobies to BW since my lFS kept them in FW. I added about 1/8 teaspoon of salt every week when I did a water change, but my water eventually turned cloudy and all the gobies died .My implication is that all the beneficial bacteria died and the water params. went crazy. So you really have to be careful in acclimating the archers,start at FW and every two weeks or so add a teaspoon of salt.