Algae ID plz

The friendliest place on the web for anyone with an interest in aquariums or fish keeping!
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.

scarf

Aquarium Advice Activist
Joined
May 17, 2005
Messages
132
Location
Australia
Hi,

Just hoping some1 would confirm my guess that the algae problem I have is cyano.

I have exams atm, fish seem to be fine, so I'm thinking of taking care of the problem (ie check parameters, etc) after the exams

Atm I'm using the stock 50/50 bulb. I have read some posters in the past have attributed algae growth to this. Regardless, I have a 6700K bulb arriving sometime in the mail.

PS This is a succinct version of my post. When I was uploading the pics, my IE crashed on me, and I lost my original post :(
 

Attachments

  • picture-1.jpg
    picture-1.jpg
    148.7 KB · Views: 73
  • picture_001-1.jpg
    picture_001-1.jpg
    108.6 KB · Views: 83
56K warning...LOL. That's funny. I have 56K and it all loaded fine :) Anyway...

I would imagine you're talking about the stuff on the glass. I don't think that's cyano. Get yourself an algae scraper...magnets are great!! (I like Mag-Float). It is important to test the water ASAP. It only takes 10 minutes to do a full test on ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and pH. Pay special attention to nitrate levels. Let us know the results...please provide numbers.

How often do you feed and how much?
How many fish are in what size tank?
How often and how much water do you change?

Depending on what is causing the algae outbreak, may or may not suggest a water quality problem, but it should be the first thing checked out. If everything checks out ok and nitrate levels are below 40ppm, then you can relax a little and just scrape the algae off the glass. If nitrate levels are high, then the tank will need immediate attention. You can do this and get your studies in. One step at a time. Just takes a little time management. Lets first focus on answering questions and testing the water.
 
lol... ops.. I forgot I resized and changed the type of pic from like 800Kb to like 100Kb ;) Thanks for ignoring that warning :)

yea I'm talking about the stuff on the glass. I scrap it every so often (generally once a week with the water change). It's only a 20g so I have one of those algae scrapers with a handle (just reaches bottom).

yea I know, my exams is a poor excuse. I'm actually going to go do some shopping to change my CO2 batch and buy, for eg, a funnel which would help me get the stuff in the CO2 bottle... so I'll just do all that then. after all, its like a few minutes, compared to how much time I've wasted on other distractions

Its my 20g tank with 2 goldfish, still young... I feed them once a day, enough to finish in a few mins, which isn't saying much coz they're like waste disposal units. I generally change the water, on average, once a week.

I'll post the results after I've done em 2mr. These results will probably be around the WORST it will get around, as I haven't changed it for a week and a bit now... So hoping they're not too bad :roll:
 
I can't predict much of what the water quality will turn out to be but I think you are feeding too much and all at once. This can increase a goldfish's capacity to push out even more waste. Goldfish do not have stomachs. Everything literally goes right through them...LOL.

Goldfish don't need so much food. Two minutes worth of food per day, skip a day or two out of the week. Try to split the feeds into two or more portions. So if you feed twice a day...each feed should be what they can consume in a single minute.

The fish will only absorb so much of the food's nutrient value so one large feed can result in a lot more wasted than utilized. It contributes to fowl water and more work for you. If you can find the time to split the feeds into three or four portions, that'd be even better.

I noticed in your sig you have a sailfin pleco in a 9 gallon. That won't be like that for long. He'll even out grow that 20 in no time. May want to think of exchanging him for a bushy nose or wide mouth pleco. They only get about 4" compared to the two feet a sailfin can reach. AND...they make better algae eaters :) They seem to be more proactive in eating the stuff. They are also known to eat brown slime algae, which is something the sailfins usually don't touch.
 
thx for that. yea I know the food goes straight through them. I'll reduce the amount I feed them and increase the frequency ...

yea that sailfin is growing out of that tank. It's only a temperory solution. It's ok for now as he was bought really young, and the bioload of that tank is really small (tetra + betta). I'm just tossing up whether or not I'd be getting a larger tank or yes, I'll prolly end up swapping him for a BN - but in terms of putting it in the goldfish tank, I'm a bit hesistant in case the BN will attack the goldfish in the future
 
I don't think the BN would bother the goldfish. Chinese algae eaters are the ones known for munching on fish. The only time a pleco attacks a live, healthy fish is when it is starving. You'd have more worries about the plecos eating your plants rather than the fish. LOL. So careful.

Good algae eaters for planted tanks are otocinclus, flying foxes, and FW river blennies. American flag fish too but they might nibble on your fantail's tail. These fish are good at eating algae even off from the plants without destroying the plants.

A customer once brought in a whole bucket load of pond plants like parrots feather and anacharis and it was loaded with hair algae. I put some of the plants in the tank with all the little otocinclus and they cleaned up the plants nicely :) Great little cleaners :)
 
And most report than BN do not bother goldfishes. However, other larger varieties have been known to suck on the goldfish's slime coats (which I have personal experience with :( ) And when my pleco was in the tank, it didn't really eat the plants. Nor do my goldfish (except for the delicate ones :roll: ). The rest must be yucky. lol

Otos also have been warned against cause of goldfish trying them as snacks. But I haven't heard as much stories from this as plecos and goldfish.

Btw, out of curiousity, what type of algae could my algae be?
 
First lets discuss the nitrate level. They are border line and the lower you can keep it the better. For a planted tank, you do want some nitrate but usually no more than 10ppm. There are few things you can do to both lower nitrate and reduce algae growth.

I would recommend you do a 10% water change twice a week for the next couple of weeks. Keep feeds at a minimum of two minutes per day...but only three days out of the week until nitrate levels come down some. Retest nitrate weekly to keep tabs on any progress. Once nitrate levels are lowered then return to a normal feed routine as discussed earlier.

Add more plants. Plants are a natural competitor of algae; feeding off the same nutrients.

You can also use a denitrate absorber in your filter. A good medium to put in there is Phos-X by Hagen. It will help reduce nitrates, phosphates, and in turn help control algae. BTW...what kind of filter do you have? HOB? Canister? Undergravel? (Please don't say undergravel).

I don't know all the names to all the different types of algae. I see that it's green and is common on glass, but not necessarily cyano. Cyano is actually a type of bacteria. Controlling nitrates will help control all types of algae.

There are three contributors to algae growth in a tank...light, nitrate, and phosphate. If you get the chance, see if your LFS would do a phosphate test. Phosphates are common in tap water. It's used as a anti rust agent in city water pipes.

Do you have any sunlight hitting the tank?

You don't have a big problem, but you can be on the verge of one, so it's best to get on it now, than to wait till it is a problem.

Know what's cool to have? FW clams and large flower shrimp. So long as you've never treated the tank with copper based medications, they can make unique additions. The clams are short lived and thankfully fairly inexpensive, but they eat nitrate. The flower shrimp are neat. They can reach about 4" and they don't have claws. Instead they have these flower like appendages on their front arms that open and close to catch minuet particles and collect algae to eat...hence 'flower' shrimp.

Now the algae eater issue...

It's possible that the fish he was eating the slime off of was sick whether you knew it or not or the pleco wasn't getting enough food elsewhere.

In my 20+ years of dealing with animals of all types, I've never seen a pleco go after a healthy fish unless it was starving. It is very easy to go without notice. Plecos are bony to begin with and fairly difficult to see them thin out from lack of food. Once these animals are fed well, they leave healthy fish alone, including slow rolly polly fantails...LOL.

Plecos have a largely vegetarian diet with some meat from the occassional carrion and sick fish. Vegetable protein isn't as rich and concentrated as meat protein, so therefore vegetation eaters require a lot more food. If you give a fish that is naturally a vegetation eater a rich meat protein diet, it can make them very ill. It can constipate the fish then they can't pass their waste. It can kill then if left untreated. So you want to provide more vegetation matter.

Best time to feed them is when the lights go off for the night. I personally think feeding them strips of algae or romaine lettuce, cucumber and zuccini is a lot cleaner for the tank than algae wafers, more nutritious and fills them up better. They REALLY like the zuccini and cucumber and beefs them up good. By daytime, what ever remains in the tank, take out. It's also good to have driftwood in the tank for plecos. They eat a fungus that grows on the wood that helps aid their digestion. Some species, it is absolutely required like the sensitive zebra pleco which specializes mostly on feeding off of dead things. Carrion is a requirement in their diet actually (yuk). Glad you're not a scavenger? LOL.

I have seen other types of catfish eat a fish's slime. I once had a synodontis cat that I found after going through three clown knives, was eating on them...and he was not starved...but then again...he wasn't a pleco. Synodontis cats are carnivores; not vegetation nor omnivores. Chinese algae eaters are perhaps the worst when it comes to attacking other fish. This is natural behavior for them as they mature into adults. I only recommend them for African cichlid tanks and tanks with fast fish like minnows and rainbows.

Otocinclus are small and perhaps a curious goldfish might take a try at them, but they are so barbed; they stick to things like velcro. Ever catch one in a net? They're just as bad as pictus cats. The goldfish would have difficulties...LOL. And their fins are sharp and very pointy. They are like daggers. For tiny fish, they're well armed. This doesn't say they don't get eaten, but for a goldfish that have no teeth to grab hold, it wouldn't feel good...LOL.

Good luck on your exams. What are you studying?
 
Ok on the feeding routine. I’ll go do a water change now. Also, while I’m asking, is the AP nitrate test kit what people mainly recommend? I have the Hagen one atm, and sometimes it is quite hard to see the colour differences between the different levels.

I’m literally thinking of doubling my current plants. I just didn’t have enough money before but am fine now. Ordered it this morning, and they should arrive within 2 weeks.

I’ve bought one (Phos-X), and I think it’s that one. I haven’t tried it yet, and was thinking about giving it a go. Just thinking of cleaning all the algae off the glass first before applying it. I have the stock filter with the tank, which is similar to the principles of a HOB. Also supplementing it with a dual sponge filter. No UGF.

I actually have a phosphorus liquid fertilizer. I guess I should stop using that altogether? Found the nitrogen totally useless for a goldfish tank, lol.

Also, yea at times I may get SOME sunlight hitting my tank. My tank is literally in front of a window, and although my blinds “protecting” my fish tank are closed 24/7, I suspect some sunlight is hitting the tank, probably reflecting off the bottom windowsill.

I had a look at the 2 animals you suggested and they look pretty cool. I’ll have a go finding them. Though the variety of aquarium animal life is fairly limited here in Sydney :(

About the pleco and goldfish, I suppose you could be right. Though I have read on forums plecos have a go at the goldfish, esp at night, regardless of the quality and quantity of food offered by them. At least people say it is a small gamble with plecos. Just a few egs I found when I ran the search through yahoo:

http://fishiezoo.com/goldfish/tankmates.html
http://www.goldfishparadise.com/viewArticle.php?articleId=76
http://www.goldfishparadise.com/forum/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=17539&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

lol, with otos, I think the problem was when goldfish do try and injest them, they get stuck in their mouths (barbed) and may lead to the death of one or both of the fish involved.

*sigh* Don’t know what to add. Atm, if I were to pick something it would probably be like the clams or shrimp u suggested. I’ve even heard negative stories of BN and goldfish, and since what happened to my first guy, I couldn’t go through that again. Maybe I'll just give my glass a clean every week.

And I’m studying psychology. Got a stats exam this Thurs and a personality exam this Sat. I haven’t even finished reading though the lecture notes for the stats exam (do that one online since lecture was only on Wed and I crammed all my lectures and tutorials on Mon, lol). cram cram cram!!!!!

Anyways, better get back to studying. Thanks again for your great help and interesting info.
 
Personally I favor AP over Hagen tests anyday. My beef with it isn't the nitrate test though...it's the pH/ammonia chart that gets me...LOL. Most coloring of test results will show accumilations darker than lowerer accumilations, so even if you can make out the exact shade, the darker it is, the more nitrate you have. Hold the test tube up against something white while comparing the colors on the charts.

There are other algae eaters like the flying fox that don't bother anything. They get long...about 5 inches long, but they are slender. Wide mouth plecos AKA thomasi are nice plecos. I kind of like them more than the BNs. They remind me of fossils.

I took psychology in high school. Should've kept with it instead of sticking to the pet industry. More opportunities for financial security. I do independent studies on subjects in relation to psychology and physiology. The 'thing' that connects the two together is what I study on my own. It was always a question I asked myself..."What is it that connects the mind to the brain? The physical with the non physical?" After at least 10 years of study and experience with sleep paralysis and ESP type sensations I think I found it....and the search started with the physical third eye on the heads of some reptiles :) Not any psychic hotline crap type stuff...LOL. This is real. A real hypothesis with a solid foundation for anyone who has the materials and credencials in society to make it a real documented scientific fact. That would be nice. It can help millions of people with all sorts of medical conditions, especially those of sleep, the metabolic system...including diabetes.

The psychological problems described in the medical community are simply underlying behaviors that are suggestive to physical ailments. After all, there is a physiology behind every behavior and behavior is an effect of hormonal activity. Hormonal activity is the responsibility of the metabolic system. The metabolic system is completely dependent on the pineal gland. People learn of the Hypothalamus and the Pituitary glands being the master glands of our very lives, but this is not so. They are messengers instead of the masters. It's all controlled by the pineal gland...including our heartbeat, blood flow and every breath we take. The pineal gland is responsible for the sleep and wake states and the rate which the metabolic system flows. It's stimilation comes from the outer environment...sunlight and darkness. To me, I see this as being the physical connection to the non physical elements of our world and whatever our senses pick up, it is transmitted to every cell in our body, both constructed of solid matter and those that are electro chemical. This has led me to believe that diseases like diabetes originates from something in the environment...like a chemical in a way that the organic chlorine compounds in DDT mimic estrogen and breakdown the reproductive system. Though instead something that hampers digestion and the breakdown of sugars...which is entirely metabolic and you know what? I gotta stop!! LOL. I can keep on going...LOL. Sorry.

Psychology if fascinating.
 
Back
Top Bottom