Dead fish

[Teri]

Hi, Well I had a problem with ick and all my fish died. So my question is I have snails and was wondering if they could get the ick? They look ok. I have treated the fish, guess I did something wrong, wish I knew what that was.....I am doing the heat treatment, getting the temp up to around 85 right now it is at 80. So if I get the temp up and add salt the ick will die in about 2 weeks, right or maybe faster. I want to get more fish, Im going to wait but I don't know if the snails can get it and the ick will stay in my tank. I really don't want to infect the new fish when I get them.
My fish may have had something else too, because it started last Thursday I noticed little white spots and they were not eating and sitting down on the bottom. I went to get aquarium salt and ick meds on friday and yesterday my last fish died. I had 4 goldfish and they died pretty fast. I don't know if the meds stressed them too much or what. I just don't want my tank to still be infested when I get my new fish. ( that won't be for about another month unless you tell me differently)
Any advise would be appreciated. Thanks

[mitche8359]

Hi Teri and welcome to AA... first time poster... 100 Kudos to you...

How big is the tank?
How long has it been set up?
Did you only have goldfish in the tank?

Have you had the water parameters checked?

Not sure if snails can get ich... someone else will be able to tell you for sure.

[Teri]

Thanks!
My tank is a 29 I had 4 goldfish and about 8 little snails. The tank has been set up for a little over a year I would say and have never had any problems, so I don't know what happened.
I still have to get the water checked, I don't have the stuff to check it yet, so Im bad. I do the water changes like im suppose to usually every other day about a 25% change and I add a few drops of Prime to the water.
One of the gold fish wasn't mine I was keeping it for a friend for the winter, she had it in a little pond outside. But that was in like October I would say. So I don't know what happened. Thanks for your help!

[JohnPaul]

I don't know about ich infecting snails...I have never heard of that happening, but at the same time, I also don't see any biological reason why it couldn't.

If you are going to do heat treatment for ich, get your tank temp up to 86*F and keep it there a full week. That should be more than enough to eradicate any ich from the tank.

If I had to guess, there was some water parameter issue. Getting a test kit is a must--be sure to get one of the liquid reagent ones. Especially in an established tank, fish typically only succumb to ich if the are stressed. Since none of the fish were new, that tells me that it is likely a water quality issue that caused the stress. No guarantee...that is just my best guess.

I assume you add the Prime to the water *before* you put the water in your tank, correct?

Also, you don't want to go too long without adding more fish. If your tank is cycled, if you suddenly go a full month without the bioload of any fish, I fear your bacterial colonies are going to start to die off.

Last, try to look on the bright side. You now have a 29 gal tank that you can do just about anything you want with it. If you want more goldfish, you can have the joy of starting over with them. If you want to expand, get a heater, and turn it into a tropical community tank or something like that, now is the time to do it. The sky is the limit! 8)

WELCOME TO AA !!!

[Teri]

Well thanks for all that! I put the prime in while Im putting the new water in. Wrong?
So I shouldn't wait a whole month, I will just get the temp up and wait a week then, I just didn't want to infect my new fish.
I have soooo many ideas for what kind of fish to put in there, too many to choose from. I was thinking to buy about 6 bettas to put in there but they could fight if more than one male, right? SO do you know how to sex them? Oh I don't know. I was also thinking about getting Cobalt blue lobster, they are really pretty, but I don't know what else I could put in there with him. SO Im still thinking, but now since you said that I better hurry up and make up my mind. Thanks guys for your help!

[RoK]

The male bettas are sold in little cups and the females, if they have any, are usually in the tanks. The males have much longer fins and yes, they will fight and even kill each other if there is more than one male. If you want more than 1 betta I'd suggest only getting females because the males may even attack them.

[Teri]

Ok Thanks for that. I did get a Betta and it is a male Wish I would have read this before I bought him. Opps I just bought one, to see if he would die. Just incase the ick was still there, and he is doing fine right now. Next week I will buy probably buy one more. If they do fight I have a couple 10 gallons I can put them in. And just buy something else for the 29. But thanks for the info!

[rubysoho]

Male bettas will fight to the death, there is no argueing that. do not get another male betta to go in that tank. Also, a male and female betta will not get along either and someone will end up dead. Female bettas are the only ones that can be kept in groups, still with caution. My 3 girls lived really well together, but some people can't even have two in a 55 gallon without them tearing eachother apart.

I am more curious about the source of the Ich infestation. You say your tank has been set up for over a year, but when was the last time you added any new fish? For Ich to appear after a year of being dormant (so to speak) is very odd. Perhaps your friend's fish had Ich?

Also, heat + goldfish = bad combination.

[Teri]

Well I had her fish in my tank since last year, when it started getting cold, so I really don't think that he was the problem. He was the newest fish that I have had. I bought the other three together. And until they got sick I didn't have a heater in there. It was when I seen a sign of illiness that I put the heat in. It may have not been ick, but they did have little white spots and they were just sitting at the bottom and so I was told it was ick, and/or dropsy. So I don't know.
But the Betta is doing fine so far and hope it stays that way.

I wonder why the little devils are so mean.

But since you say that about the Betta's. I will just put the one that I bought in a 10 gallon and just buy something else. I knew not to put 2 males together, but I didn't know that the male and females would probably fight too. Thanks. Plus I was wondering if they are so mean to each other why are there so many? Someone's getting along some where lol (Im not saying they are not mean lol just started thinking about this and had to add it) :P

[fishfirst]

I don't know if this was mentioned but snails cannot get ich... ich is a host specific parasite and needs a FISH host... a snail isn't a fish... also most copper based meds will kill snails.

[Teri]

Ok no I don't think any one answered that, so thanks I kinda figured that now because my snails are fine. But I did use an ick treatment Wardleys Ick Away is what I used. Hopefully I didn't hurt them with that, but they seem fine. I knew it was a fish host but I didn't know about the ick floating down to the bottom and then attaching to the snails and somehow they maybe able to get sick from that. But it doesn't look like it so far.

[RoK]

How many gallons is the tank the goldfish were in? Do you what temperature the water was (when they got the ich)?

[Teri]

They were in a 29 gallon and the temp was 72 before they got the ick.

[RoK]

Was there a significant change in temp or almost always was at that temp?

[Teri]

Well i wouldn't say significant, but at night it does get cooler in here, but not much.

[Teri]

Well just wanted you guys to know that now my Betta has little white spots. I tried to take a picture but didn't turn out very well.
I don't know what to do, don't want to kill my snails which have eggs on the side of the tank now, so I don't know if the meds will kill the eggs or not.
I keep putting meds in there and salt, I don't know how the ick is still there. I guess I will try to save this betta but if I can't I guess I will just have snails because I don't want to kill anyone else. I have been told not to get the heat up to 86 with the betta because he could also die from that, I have it now to 80, but that won't kill the ick will it? You would think the salt and the meds would kill pretty much everything.

You can do one of a few things:

Isolate the Betta in his own tank and treat for Ich using the method of your choice. This way no harm can come to the snails for certain.

If that is not possible, obtain some Rid-Ich+ and use as directed. Keep the temperature at 80F while you treat for Ich. The emphasis is on using an Ich medication that does NOT contain and use copper as its active ingredient. Copper will kill your snails.

[RoK]

I don't think the betta will die from the heat. Bettas should be always be kept in high 70s to medium 80s F. They can live their whole lives in mid 80s F water and do great.
Check this link:
http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/p...cfm?pCatId=990
The thing is you have to raise the temp slowly, a quick change in temp can possibly hurt/kill it. Who told you that the higher temp will kill it? If it was from someone at a pet store you probably shoudn't rely on them.

[Jchillin]

Surprised that no one mentioned it yet so I will. The heat/salt treatment will require additional aeration. Lower the water level to increase surface oxgenization. The addition of an airstone is also a good idea. Also, the increased salt/heat can affect your snail(s) as they are usually foraging along the bottom of the tank. Removing the betta and treating him alone seems to be your best option.