pH and nitrAtes dropping.

[Xzap]

Hi all,
New member here from NC , love the site. I've only been fish keeping for 6 mths or so.
I have a question about my water stats.

29 gal community tank, set up 4 mths, low light plants added 1- 2 mths ago.
PMDD X 4 days a week, Flourish X 3 days a week (started 3 weeks ago), 2 wpg, no co2.
I do weekly w/c's and all the fish look & act healthy.

Stats today:
Ammonia 0.0
ites 0.0
ates 0
pH 6 * pH has dropped from 7.0 on 4/22/05
to 6.8 on 5/4/05
to 6.6 on 5/17
6.0 today.

Have the plants taken up all the ates ?
Am I headed for a pH crash that I've read about?

Thx,

Dave

 

[travis simonson]

Hey Dave, welcome aboard

Wow, that is a strange problem. Have you measured your water's pH out of the tap? If you haven't, try doing so and then letting an open bowl of water sit out for 24 hours and measuring the pH again. IME it is very uncommon to see pH drop the way yours has without CO2 injection or phosphate buffering. It could be that the pH of your local water supply has changed over the past month and your water changes have introduced lower pH water at each change but that's complete supposition on my part. There are some serious experts who frequent the plant section here who will hopefully chime in

 

[czcz]

(not one of the experts)
Do you know your kH? You could increase buffering with baking soda, if the problem is low buffer and decaying leaves/etc.

Its likely your plants have taken up your nitrates. Nice glasses

 

[greenmaji]

If your KH is too low this can happen unless your doing large frequent PWC's. In other words unless your doing maintains for discus your PH will drop.. Check your KH and see if it isnt under 3...
Anynone dose with baking soda to bring up the KH? if so how much per gallon brings up the KH a couple of Points? I think that if you can get your KH up a couple of points this will stop.. by using some baking soda or CC in the filter.. otherwise you need to start doing some big frequent water changes to stabilize your PH..
HTH

 

[Xzap]

I don't have a KH test kit, believe or not, my lfs doesn't carry them. I guess that's what mo is for huh ? *lol*

My tap water is 7.2 - 7.6, you know how those color charts are
PWC's are 25 % once a week.

Retested my tank water and it's definitely at 6.0.

So, I should add baking soda to raise the KH and/or do larger pwc's ?

Thx,

Dave

 

[greenmaji]

I would start with pwc's untill you got it closer to the tap water levels.. at a PH of 6 you could end up adding to much baking soda with a over 1 point gap to make up in PH..
You really need a KH test kit... MO or online works for that..LOL.. while your at it make up your wish list to save on shipping and handling!

 

[czcz]

Green, 1.1 tsp raises 50g 1dKh according to http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/Fertilizer/dosing.html

 

[greenmaji]

Then I would try 1 tbs.. 1.914 tbs would bring it up from 0 to 3 but Im quite certain it isnt 0..

 

[czcz]

X - certainly should test kH if possible, if only to make sure it isn't some other issue. I doubt raising hardness a few degrees will hurt anything, as long as you do it gradually, as pH will rise as well

 

[greenmaji]

A long as your doing some water changes the KH should be the issue.. This happens when people dont change there water as well.. Old Tank Syndrome..ACK! If you havnt changed the water in a month or two then forget what I said about the KH!!!

 

[Xzap]

I did a 50% w/c and now it's at 6.4 pH.
What does that tell ya ?

Has any tried this test kit: http://www.bigalsonline.com/catalog/product.xml?product_id=19475;category_id=3111;pcid1=3233;pcid2=
I have an API Master Kit, but as you know, it doesn't include the kh test.

Dave

 

[greenmaji]

It tells me if you do regular water changes that its the KH.. I would slowly add the 1 tbs of baking soda.. It should fix it but you could need a little more depending on how low the KH is.. you really need to get the testkit for KH.. I just got the AP master testkit and bought the AP KH test seperate.. so no I havnt tried that one.. you need the test for KH so you will know how much baking soda you will need to add when you do your water changes as well.

 

[Steve Hampton]

Sounds as though, as others have properly alluded to already, that you have a weak buffer (low KH). Testing your tank and tap water for KH is very important. One of the problems with a setup that has 2 wpg and no CO2 injection is that several plants species will split bicaronate for their carbon needs...algae is very gifted at being able to do this too. So, when you have a situation with 2 wpg plants may use all the available CO2 and split bicarbonate lowering KH slightly...if you have a weak buffer to begin with then the acids from nitrification can cause a large drop in pH like you are seeing. Under really intense lighting without CO2 the opposite situation occurs, called biogenic decalcification where the pH soars to over 9.0...a horrible situation. Anyway, doing weekly 50% water changes should maintain your KH or you can add sodium bicarbonate as alluded to earlier....or add a cuttlebone to your filter. Cuttlebones are calcium carbonate and they will increase you pH, GH, and KH...albeit a bit unpredictably so, but you won't ever have to worry about another pH drop using your current water changing routine. I only recommed the CCor cuttlebone route for non CO2 injected tanks.

 

[Xzap]

Thanks to everyone for the informative replies

I'll add some baking soda today. Do I add it at the rate of 1 tbsp all at once, or 1 tbsp spread out over a period of time?

I'm assuming calcium carbonate can be purchased at lfs in packet form ?

I'm ordering a kh test kit today. Once my ph & kh. are stable, can I get by with 25 % w/c's in the future ?

Anyone use this kit ? http://www.bigalsonline.com/catalog/product.xml?product_id=19509&category_id=3237&pcid1=3233

I have the API Master Kit, any other test kits I need to order while I'm at it?

Thx,

Dave

 

[malkore]

I'd just use the Aquarium Pharm. test kit for general and carbonate hardness...which is included in their master kit (last time I looked).

Steer clear of Nutrafin and 'fasTest/SeaTest'.

 

[Xzap]

The API Master Kit I have doesn't have a kh test. Have they come out with a new one that does ?

Dave

 

[greenmaji]

The new AP Master testkit does not have the KH test.. The older one did.. I have both the old and new AP Master testkits here.. the new one added a NO3 testkit that the old one did not have, no NO3 was very frustrating as well..LOL.
I would add the 1 tbs over a period of time.. a little bit of it at a time...
And a cuttle bone is sold for pet birds.. the off white ovalish thing usually with parakeets on the package..

 

[Xzap]

So I can add a cuttle bone to my filter basket (Fluval304) and that will keep my pH stable?

Dave

 

[greenmaji]

Si I can add a cuttle bone to my filter basket (Fluval304) and that will keep my pH stable?

Dave

Thats what steve said and if he said it I belive it...

 

[czcz]

Just to clarify, if you add baking soda, it should be 1 teaspoon, not 1 tablespoon. (~2tsp will raise 29g 3dkh, following 1.1tsp raises 50g 1dkH.)