potassium chloride home softener system?

[brant]

I have recently purchased a 29 gal tank and am in the prosses of cyciling. I have a home water softener system wich uses potassium chloride and soda ash sulution injection. i asked the local fish store owner and they said it be ok to use my water infact the ph tested and still tests darn neer perfect tank is in its third week of cycyle and I still retain all fish. And also will more often water changes be nessicery to keep water density correct. Thank you in advance for any information.

[jsoong]

You can use the water .... BUT .... you actually are not getting "soft" water as far as the fish is concerned.

Water softener exchanges Na (or in your case K) for Ca/Mg. Removing Ca/Mg gets rid of the hard water ring, makes soap works better, etc. Fish, however, don't see it that way. Fish sees total osmolarity - ie total number of "particles" <technically ions> in the water. Within limits, the fish don't care if the ion is Ca or K. Therefore, you can't really keep soft-water fish using a water softener.

To keep things simple, most people suggests using straight tap water ... or if you need softer water, a mix of tap & RO. Note also that you do need some Ca & Mg in your tank (esp if you have snails & inverts) .... so eliminating all Ca/Mg might have some long term effects.

[brant]

First of all thank you for your reply. Ok I can tap in before the brine mix and get unsalted water but my soda ash solution injects directly into my bladder tank so there is no bypassing that without an entire system change. Will it be ok with just the soda ash added. Thank you for any information.

[jsoong]

I don't know enough about water softener to advice taking water out in the middle of the process!

FAIK, you add soda ash (Na2CO3) to increase your water pH. This is done so there is less corrosion in piping & for water softener to work properly. My city water co does the same (but using [acronym="Sodium hydroxide"]NaOH[/acronym]). Now, I would have no problem with the the water treatment plant adjusting pH. They test frequently & results posted daily on the web - and the pH is kept to within 0.1. I would not have such faith in a home setup. Any change in the Na2CO3 injector or in the incoming water would result in different pH, and for fish, the worst thing is a fluctuating pH - the reason that home hobbyists are adviced to acclimatize their fish to the pH of their tap water rather than doctoring their water themselves.

At any rate, I don't see any reason to take water out after the soda ash injector. Adding Na2CO3 will *increase* the KH (even though the GH is unchanged). For the fish that means harder water than your original tap water. Since the water softener won't soften the water from the fish's standpoint, so it really makes little difference taking water before or after that.

My feeling is, if you have problem taking water before the water softener <note that if you have an outside tap - that is ususally before the softener>, just use the water and don't worry too much about it. Most fish will adapt ..... and if you are keen on some exotic fish that needs real soft water, then you'll need to buy a RO unit. If you are keeping snails & worry about the Ca level, just add some to the tank in the form of crush coral, shells, etc.

[brant]

Thank you again for your advice. As far as the tank goes I have a 29 gal and want to end up with a couple simple cats (probly corys), 1 black ghost,a pair of angels and a few smaller fish which I have for cyciling a few zebra danio,and afew barbs. I know some of the fish like the ghost will out grow my tank but I have a freind with a 125Gal (that is stocked vary sparcly) that said he if I grow em and there healthy he would give em a good home in exchange he would buy me small fish to start over again. If you have any sugestions on what catfish would be a good choice that would be appretiated. Oh my ph has been steady 7.0 from go both tap water and tank as per daily check. thank you and merry chrismas.

[jsoong]

I like cories (though they won't work with my goldies). However, they do better in bigger group - say 5 or 6 - rather than 2. They'll then school & play with each other & great fun to watch.

You can also consider a small pleco - like bristlenose or rubberlip. These don't get too big so can stay in a 29.

[iceywater101]

I noticed in your stocking plans you listed a pair of angels and some barbs. What type of barbs where you thinking abut getting? Most but not all barbs are agressive fin nippers and will not get along with your angels. As for cats I would go with 5 albino cory cats they stay small and a pair of otos to keep your tank clean.

[Crusis]

As a barb keeper, I definitely wouldn't mix barbs with angels. Most species of barbs I wouldn't keep less than 6 in a tank. If they don't have each other to play with, they're more likely to go after other fish. I have my Tiger Barbs in their own tank, they're so aggressive. 16 of them in a school. Their awesome! Rosy and Gold barbs in my community tank get along better with other fish, but I still don't think I'd do angels or any long fin fish. I do have to Gold gouramis in there, but gouramis are willing to educate the barbs about the dangers of fin nipping.

That's a great deal for your friend, btw. You take the risk of the pet store fish, raise the fish to size and health, and then trade it even for another small pet store fish? If I were the local pet store, I'd probably be willing to make you that deal.

Good luck with your tank!