serious question about nitrates

[Lifeoffroad]

Okay real quick im not a newb to tanks and I know what each chemical does to your fish so I don't need responses on that.

My question is I have a fluval 205 that I use strictly for bio filter, however, my nitrates have gotten high and daily gravel cleans and pwc have do not seem to lower it much.

It was my understanding that you don't clean the biofilters that much otherwise you kill the beneficial bacteria that is supposed to control nitrates. Could my spike in nitrates be from a dirty biofilter? If so what is the best way to clean it without destroying beneficial bacteria. Can I use filtered water from my sink filter? I've tried the bucket of tank water and ut just doesn't do a good job.

 

[Cichlid Kid]

Using any water besides the actual water the bb had established itself in is taking a chance even if it were dechlorinated.

 

[revchristinejday]

Dear Lifeoffroad,

Some additional information might help: stock, size of aquarium whether it's planted or not and percentage of pwc. For example if you have more 2 fancy goldfish in a 30 gallon and only the 205, you don't have enough filteration (Goldfish need 1 gallon size/hour.) Likewise many goldfish owners do a 50% pwc because that halves one's nitrates. One can even do back to back 50% pwc to bring levels down faster. PWCs are the only non-chemical way to reduce the levels. Use of Prime will render nitrates harmless for only a short period of time. Addition of plants, a lot of plants reduces nitrates. Floating plants eat more nitrate.

Cichild Kid was correct to point out using sink water would remove all BB. I wouldn't worrying about getting the biofilters sparkling clean, you need the BB. Rinsing in tank water should preserve the BB and remove gunk.

Also check you tap water for nitrate levels. Sometimes they are high depending on where one lives.

Chris

 

[George9]

Okay real quick im not a newb to tanks and I know what each chemical does to your fish so I don't need responses on that.

My question is I have a fluval 205 that I use strictly for bio filter, however, my nitrates have gotten high and daily gravel cleans and pwc have do not seem to lower it much.

It was my understanding that you don't clean the biofilters that much otherwise you kill the beneficial bacteria that is supposed to control nitrates. Could my spike in nitrates be from a dirty biofilter? If so what is the best way to clean it without destroying beneficial bacteria. Can I use filtered water from my sink filter? I've tried the bucket of tank water and ut just doesn't do a good job.

Use old tank water. Fill the bucket up and swish swish swish. Get all the gunk out and stuff. The media is not going to be nice and white after this, you'll never get it nice and white again. I guess it is possible that you get a spike from a dirty filter. But more importantly, what does your pwc schedule look like?

 

[Lifeoffroad]

Great information everyone. I apologize I always forget tank stats:

55 gallon
1 aquaclear 70 with foam, charcoal, and bio cubes

1 fluval 205 with foam, prefilter media, remaining trays have biocubes

1 aquaclear 30 with fine media for sparkling clear water

Fake plants, real rocks, driftwood

1 gold gourami full size
2 Boseman rainbows almost full size
1 australian rainbow almost full size
1 neon blue rainbow half size
3 jaguar danios
1 Bolivian ram half size
1 kribensis full size
1 6" pleaco full size
2 corys full size
2 clown loaches about 1" each and not growing very fast at all. They have been this size for about 2 years.

That's it. Oh I do have an outbreak in those little white snails, however, the clowns keep them at bay very well. The only thing I noticed is the clowns suck the snails out so im wondering if the left over shells have bits in them still. They are hard to suction out.

Thanks for the feedback you've already given.

 

[Lifeoffroad]

Great information everyone. I apologize I always forget tank stats:

55 gallon
1 aquaclear 70 with foam, charcoal, and bio cubes

1 fluval 205 with foam, prefilter media, remaining trays have biocubes

1 aquaclear 30 with fine media for sparkling clear water

Fake plants, real rocks, driftwood

1 gold gourami full size
2 Boseman rainbows almost full size
1 australian rainbow almost full size
1 neon blue rainbow half size
3 jaguar danios
1 Bolivian ram half size
1 kribensis full size
1 6" pleaco full size
2 corys full size
2 clown loaches about 1" each and not growing very fast at all. They have been this size for about 2 years.

That's it. Oh I do have an outbreak in those little white snails, however, the clowns keep them at bay very well. The only thing I noticed is the clowns suck the snails out so im wondering if the left over shells have bits in them still. They are hard to suction out.

Thanks for the feedback you've already given.

Sorry forgot. My pwcs are once a week 20%

If I ever do it back to back its still 20%

Most I did was 2 50% in one week.

Also
Ammonia is at 0
Nitrites are at 0

My tape water only measured high in ph.
One question about the nitrate test. How long do you let it change color before taking the reading? Will it get darker if I just let it sit?

 

[George9]

Sorry forgot. My pwcs are once a week 20%

If I ever do it back to back its still 20%

Most I did was 2 50% in one week.

Also
Ammonia is at 0
Nitrites are at 0

My tape water only measured high in ph.
One question about the nitrate test. How long do you let it change color before taking the reading? Will it get darker if I just let it sit?

You shake then wait 5 mins to take reading. I'd bump up the weekly pwc to 40 or 50% weekly. The 20% pwc could be contributing to high nitrate because you aren't removing a lot of it when you do such small changes.

 

[Alkane]

The bacteria in your bio filter convert ammonia and nitrites into nitrates and then you remove the nitrates with water changes and/or plants.

If you are using the API nitrate test kit you really have to shake bottle number 2. If you forget to shake it the reagents become unbalanced and will cause the test kit to permanently cause false results.

To test properly rinse the tube with the water from the tank being tested, fill it up mix bottle #1 add drops(hold reagent bottle completely vertical), cap the tube (do not use your finger) invert the tube. shake bottle 2 for 30 seconds at least. add the drops invert tube and then wait 5 min.s. read results against a white back ground. Test your tap water or distilled water (0 nitrates) to compare if you are unsure of the color.

I would take a sample into you your LFS and have them test it or buy a new nitrate kit and see what it says.

If you are having a nitrate problem then one large water change is better than frequent small ones. If you are doing 20% WCs weekly and your nitrate is still high then you may have a dead fish somewhere, are overfeeding, or are overstocked (your stock list looks ok).

Good luck

 

[Lifeoffroad]

The bacteria in your bio filter convert ammonia and nitrites into nitrates and then you remove the nitrates with water changes and/or plants.

If you are using the API nitrate test kit you really have to shake bottle number 2. If you forget to shake it the reagents become unbalanced and will cause the test kit to permanently cause false results.

To test properly rinse the tube with the water from the tank being tested, fill it up mix bottle #1 add drops(hold reagent bottle completely vertical), cap the tube (do not use your finger) invert the tube. shake bottle 2 for 30 seconds at least. add the drops invert tube and then wait 5 min.s. read results against a white back ground. Test your tap water or distilled water (0 nitrates) to compare if you are unsure of the color.

I would take a sample into you your LFS and have them test it or buy a new nitrate kit and see what it says.

If you are having a nitrate problem then one large water change is better than frequent small ones. If you are doing 20% WCs weekly and your nitrate is still high then you may have a dead fish somewhere, are overfeeding, or are overstocked (your stock list looks ok).

Good luck

Thanks I give them all a really good shake but I never used to until recently. That is a good point that I may have ruined that bottle by not being consistent with my shakes. Im almost out of all the tests with the exception of ph and high range ph so maybe ill just restock that. Ill probably do a 30% pwc weekly to. Im thinking maybe 20 is to little for my stock.

No dead fish only snails. And I only feed twice a day typically 2 cubes of blood worms or brine shrimp. Sometimes 3 cubes of my ram gets a hold if one cube he usually gulps it down. When I feed flake food whatever is not eaten is usually clean by morning from the corys, pleaco and clowns. I bet my kit is wrecked. Thanks for that tidbit. Im gonna get a new one tomorrow. Ill keep y'all posted.

 

[Lifeoffroad]

You shake then wait 5 mins to take reading. I'd bump up the weekly pwc to 40 or 50% weekly. The 20% pwc could be contributing to high nitrate because you aren't removing a lot of it when you do such small changes.

Yeah im thinking that to but I always thought more would make my ph out of whack. I think im safe at 30 to 40 and that should start to reduce it. If you read my response to the other poster I think my api test kit might be bad. Im going to go ahead and get new stuff as im almost put anyway. I found out late in my testing experience how rigorous you need to be with some of those bottles.

 

[Terrance]

Your nitrates are high because you overfeed.

 

[Lifeoffroad]

Your nitrates are high because you overfeed.

And your basing that on what. There's no way I overfeed. 2 feedings a day and everything is gone in les than a minute. Let's not make determinations about something you cannot determine.

 

[Lifeoffroad]

So interesting thing I found out yesterday. My tap water IS high in nitrates! Not terribly but the odds have already been against me with every water change. That being said, I still think its a strong possibility that my test kit needs to be renewed. I am going to do 30% to 40% changes a week now. I really dont want to go chemicals. I did a 50% yesterday and it brought things into a much better range. Im glad you guys responded I would have never thought.

Thanks all.

 

[Mrc8858]

He is right you are over feeding and the cubes if dropped into the tank release all them juices which is really bad for a tank...always thaw and strain frozen foods

 

[Lifeoffroad]

He is right you are over feeding and the cubes if dropped into the tank release all them juices which is really bad for a tank...always thaw and strain frozen foods

Im not even entertaining your responses. There is no way you can make a blanket statement like that without knowing my exact feeding habits and there is so much more to consider when talking about overfeeding. I already found what the issue is and its not overfeeding. Really??? The juices?? Come on.

 

[Mrc8858]

Yes the juices..I'm not here to argue with you I'm just stating facts which I keep fresh and salt water tanks and when dealing with corals you have to be even more aware of what you add to your tank and the juice in the frozen cubes will produce a lot of ammo which obviously is gonna become nitrates...you have to remember you are working with a closed system so anything you add to the tank must be removed by you unless you run a large refugium..if you don't want to take my advice that is perfectly fine I'm not here to make you do things my way just to offer solutions to your problems

 

[Lifeoffroad]

Yes the juices..I'm not here to argue with you I'm just stating facts which I keep fresh and salt water tanks and when dealing with corals you have to be even more aware of what you add to your tank and the juice in the frozen cubes will produce a lot of ammo which obviously is gonna become nitrates...you have to remember you are working with a closed system so anything you add to the tank must be removed by you unless you run a large refugium..if you don't want to take my advice that is perfectly fine I'm not here to make you do things my way just to offer solutions to your problems

Your comparing apples to oranges. Do you have proof of this statement? The only reason I have ever read to defrost food is the

 

[Lifeoffroad]

Your comparing apples to oranges. Do you have proof of this statement? The only reason I have ever read to defrost food is the

Sensitive stomachs fish have. They prefer warm food. You may even be depriving your fish of nutrients by not giving the "juices" do you believe the juices are made from something other than what they are frozen with? i.e. blood worms or brine shrimp? Also, don't saltwater fish have special foods that tropical fish don't eat? If you have salt water fish you should be in the salt water posts.

 

[Gingimaru]

really confused where people have got the overfeeding from. i would say it is your nitrates in your tap water. i have the same issue with my tank, nitrates are always at about 40ppm. i just cant get it any lower. my fish seem to be fine, all other readings are fine (ammo 0ppm, nitrites 0ppm, ph7.5-8) its just nitrates. only solution i've been told that will lower my nitrates is to use RO water. but after researching it, the cost, the amount of work moving RO water around (i dont have a car) and the fact you need to add nutrients back into means a few things. a lot of money needed, a lot of paitence, a lot of care when adding nutrients and also acclimatising your fish to you using RO water.

one of the best pieces of advice that i have gotten from this forum and i would say this to anyone, its better to try keep your paramaters stable, than it is to start messing around with RO water, PH uppers and downers etc

 

[Lifeoffroad]

really confused where people have got the overfeeding from. i would say it is your nitrates in your tap water. i have the same issue with my tank, nitrates are always at about 40ppm. i just cant get it any lower. my fish seem to be fine, all other readings are fine (ammo 0ppm, nitrites 0ppm, ph7.5-8) its just nitrates. only solution i've been told that will lower my nitrates is to use RO water. but after researching it, the cost, the amount of work moving RO water around (i dont have a car) and the fact you need to add nutrients back into means a few things. a lot of money needed, a lot of paitence, a lot of care when adding nutrients and also acclimatising your fish to you using RO water.

one of the best pieces of advice that i have gotten from this forum and i would say this to anyone, its better to try keep your paramaters stable, than it is to start messing around with RO water, PH uppers and downers etc

Agreed. The 40 range isn't to bad. Your always going to have some I believe. I am just going to go with large water changes so it doesn't go above the "regular water" level. Mine isn't quite as bad as yours. The tap water is around the 20 range on mine. Im just gonna have to pull extra duty to keep it at least at that range.

What about the tetra smart balances? Those are supposed to regulate nitrates? Anyone tell you to get that?

Thanks. Finally some to back me up on this overfeeding nonsense. : - )