Severe Persistent Algae Blooms -- ANY ADVICE?

[AmateurAquarist]

Hi, both of my dedicated neocaridina dwarf shrimp aquariums (but NONE of my many others) have longstanding issues with algae, detritus worms, hydra...

The bizarre part is:
(1) I'm not overfeeding, and
(2) I adjusted my light timers nearly 2 months ago to be 100% sure neither of those typical 2 culprits is responsible

I'm using heavy filtration, strictly reverse osmosis water, and a couple of weeks ago even started using the usual carbon dosing (Seachem Flourish Excel) to 'starve' the algae colonies for nutrition --- nothing has worked.

QUESTION
>> Although I've done the research and read the opinions over the years, does anyone here have personal or confident anecdotal advice on what tank-mate(s) I can add [temporarily or permanently] with my neocaridina colonies -- that won't eat/harm the shrimps? *OR at a minimum an algae addict that won't gobble them up aggressively, so I can at least get the cleanliness under control without killing absolutely everything?

[SEE PICTURES]
THANKS!

 

[Delapool]

With no glasses on it looks like hair algae? Copied in a link as different strategies depending on algae type.

http://www.theplantedtank.co.uk/algae.htm

 

[Delapool]

Algae ime is driven by light. I would cut your lights down to 5 hrs a day and halve the intensity (if dimmable switch or with tape). See if that slows growth rates which gives you more time to get on top of the algae.

 

[AmateurAquarist]

Algae ime is driven by light. I would cut your lights down to 5 hrs a day and halve the intensity (if dimmable switch or with tape). See if that slows growth rates which gives you more time to get on top of the algae.

Thanks, Delapool! Back around mid-November I cut my lights from 10 to 6 hours a day, I sort of "feel bad" doing less than that, like I'm shoving my shrimp into a deprivation chamber lol.

Am I able to cut light altogether, since I literally saw 0 improvements after over 2-months of 6hr/daylight? I already felt like 18hrs of 'darkness' was cruel in a weird way, but then again my shrimp and fish and crustaceans are treated better than some princes lol!

-----

PS: *What tank-mate(s) I can add [temporarily or permanently] with my neocaridina colonies -- that won't eat/harm the shrimps? *OR at a minimum an algae addict that won't gobble them up aggressively, so I can at least get the cleanliness under control without killing absolutely everything?

 

[fishwonder]

Algae is tough all over since there are so many kinds.


Click here to learn about algae and hopefully find how to get rid of it.

 

[Delapool]

I’ve had bristlenose catfish with shrimp and kept a good population (planted out with driftwood for bn catfish).

I use catfish and oto’s for cleanup presently. Not sure on oto’s. Snails could be another one but I find they generate a lot of mess.

All of them I guess I use to help out but light is the key for me. I assume there is no sunlight hitting tank? Cleanup crews I find help but won’t solve algae.

I’m not sure how the shrimp will go with liquid carbon dosing. I find it works best on black beard algae but can take time / requires over-dosing. Definitely useful if shrimp can handle it.

I’m assuming it’s hair algae so manual removal and split photo-period help. I’d replace any plants badly over-run with algae. Plants will be fine with split photo-period.

Assuming it’s LED lights then tape over all blue lights and say half white lights. This is bit of an art - on my smaller tanks I’ve progressively taped over LEDs until algae growth slows right down but low-light plants like ferns and Anubias will still grow (lights are also on timers). Block off any light from windows with tank backing, etc (even on sides if needed).

I don’t bother with phosphate removal pads or anything like that. Never tested it. I feel it’s more about balancing between lights vs ferts, CO2 and plants.

UV units do help but best on green water.

So in conclusion I feel you could still have some lights going - it’s a matter of finding that sweet spot. I’ve never bothered trying to control nitrates or phosphates - too much work for me.

 

[Delapool]

Algae is tough all over since there are so many kinds.


Click here to learn about algae and hopefully find how to get rid of it.

Broadly knowing which type of algae I find helps for control methods. Blue-green algae treatment with triple sulpha or furan 2 has worked here but I’d skip it for other algae types.

My high-tech tank maintains a phosphate level but lights, ferts and CO2 are balanced for growth. Black beard algae is the problem and H2O2 used say every two months on it.

I agree tank cleaning for algae every two weeks I’m happy with. One tank gets a clean every two months, the shrimp tank has some green spot algae which I’m cleaning off every week now to discourage it.

Lights sold here are mainly blue and white leds which are great for making colours pop but blue light penetrates water extremely well and is already in white light. Controlling light intensity, spectrum and duration is pretty much my go to method these days as little work (plan number 504 unfortunately lol).

 

[Delapool]

This is for another thread but is the shrimp tank led light taped off to control light intensity. Mostly taped off now but still quite bright with light around edges / through tape lighting tank fine. Java fern growing as well as (sadly) brown algae near eg filter inlet or shells which is hard to get to wipe off and some green spot algae making a determined run. Originally taped just blue LEDs but had to tape more. Example of algae control with light duration, spectrum and intensity.

 

[Caliban07]

I’ve killed all algae by starving it except hair algae. Had to pick that stuff out with pipe cleaners.

You would be surprised how long it takes to bring nutrients down enough to starve algae. It takes weeks.

 

[AmateurAquarist]

Algae is tough all over since there are so many kinds.


Click here to learn about algae and hopefully find how to get rid of it.

Thanks a lot for the link, I like reading materials and refreshing on things like this. I've been fish-keeping pretty seriously for a while, and have a background in research and chemistry, so the great part is people like you are willing to help but the bummer is I've tried all of these techniques a few times over with no improvement.

The weird part is none of my other aquariums, which have quadrupled the light on, exhibit ANY algae problems whatsoever. From the nano beta tanks, to the larger live breeder tanks, to the single-species tanks like the puffer, and even my crayfish breeding tanks... ZERO algae issues.

In fact the water and clarity in my other aquariums are crystalline...

So, ultimately, I'm looking for personal advice pertaining to possible tank mate(s) either temporarily or permanently that will thrive on gobbling my algae up, WITHOUT gobbling my expensive and beloved neocaridina colonies up!

 

[AmateurAquarist]

I’ve had bristlenose catfish with shrimp and kept a good population (planted out with driftwood for bn catfish).

I use catfish and oto’s for cleanup presently. Not sure on oto’s. Snails could be another one but I find they generate a lot of mess.

All of them I guess I use to help out but light is the key for me. I assume there is no sunlight hitting tank? Cleanup crews I find help but won’t solve algae.

I’m not sure how the shrimp will go with liquid carbon dosing. I find it works best on black beard algae but can take time / requires over-dosing. Definitely useful if shrimp can handle it.

I’m assuming it’s hair algae so manual removal and split photo-period help. I’d replace any plants badly over-run with algae. Plants will be fine with split photo-period.

Assuming it’s LED lights then tape over all blue lights and say half white lights. This is bit of an art - on my smaller tanks I’ve progressively taped over LEDs until algae growth slows right down but low-light plants like ferns and Anubias will still grow (lights are also on timers). Block off any light from windows with tank backing, etc (even on sides if needed).

I don’t bother with phosphate removal pads or anything like that. Never tested it. I feel it’s more about balancing between lights vs ferts, CO2 and plants.

UV units do help but best on green water.

So in conclusion I feel you could still have some lights going - it’s a matter of finding that sweet spot. I’ve never bothered trying to control nitrates or phosphates - too much work for me.

GREAT reply, thanks!

I do have several bristlenose plecos/catfish and otocinclus in other aquariums... I'm just hesitant to throw them in -- but at this point, with the severity of the algae overrunning the aquarium, I'd assume it's make-or-break time with either totally resetting the aquarium (or) risking some baby-shrimp being "vacuumed" up by the plecos.

You talked about snails, but each of these 2 neocaridina aquariums have what appears to be hundreds of snails (bladder), to the point I'll be adding in some assassin snails slowly to control populations. *I'm not overfeeding, I just believe with the massive algae food sources, these bladder 'pest' snails are multiplying like magic.

Lastly, I do use Purigen along with the packets of Chemipure Green, and I run a full panel of live bacterias as directed on the label of: Azoo NitriPro Bacteria, and SL-Aqua Magic Powder.

 

[AmateurAquarist]

I’ve killed all algae by starving it except hair algae. Had to pick that stuff out with pipe cleaners.

You would be surprised how long it takes to bring nutrients down enough to starve algae. It takes weeks.

When you say starve do you mean lighting, or are you referring to another method? Thanks!

 

[Delapool]

GREAT reply, thanks!



I do have several bristlenose plecos/catfish and otocinclus in other aquariums... I'm just hesitant to throw them in -- but at this point, with the severity of the algae overrunning the aquarium, I'd assume it's make-or-break time with either totally resetting the aquarium (or) risking some baby-shrimp being "vacuumed" up by the plecos.



You talked about snails, but each of these 2 neocaridina aquariums have what appears to be hundreds of snails (bladder), to the point I'll be adding in some assassin snails slowly to control populations. *I'm not overfeeding, I just believe with the massive algae food sources, these bladder 'pest' snails are multiplying like magic.



Lastly, I do use Purigen along with the packets of Chemipure Green, and I run a full panel of live bacterias as directed on the label of: Azoo NitriPro Bacteria, and SL-Aqua Magic Powder.

Could be to on food source - I was thinking of apple or mystery snails (name here for larger snails) but since pond snails aren’t making a dent... No particular reason for the apple snail suggestion - was perhaps more that the larger ones are easier to see if being useful or not (and possibly a scarred experience of one lot devouring an algae floor that I actually quite liked and was thinking they would do minor pruning haha).

Are those products just nitrifying bacteria? I have found products can encourage algae sometimes, somehow and maybe something to try stopping for few weeks (if possible) to see if any difference.

Are there any algicide products you could try before resetting tank? I don’t really use them (apart from glut I guess) but throwing out thoughts.

 

[Caliban07]

When you say starve do you mean lighting, or are you referring to another method? Thanks!

Not lighting. Nutrients.

I purposely overfed one time to try and improve my plant growth (I don’t use ferts). Two mini sinking wafers a day in fact for 1 week. They were the size of a drawing pin head.

The duckweed went crazy but so too did algae. Rooted plant’s didn’t really respond. I decided to stop the feeding after that first week. I culled a full surface of duckweed around 5 times before it started to slow down and stop growing. Over a month or more had passed by before those nutrients had ran out. After the duckweed slowed down it then took longer to starve the algae off.

I think my point is that input in the average tank is much higher than one would expect and even when correcting, nutrients still hang around for quite a while.

 

[AmateurAquarist]

Are those products just nitrifying bacteria? I have found products can encourage algae sometimes, somehow and maybe something to try stopping for few weeks (if possible) to see if any difference.

Not lighting. Nutrients.

I purposely overfed one time to try and improve my plant growth (I don’t use ferts). Two mini sinking wafers a day in fact for 1 week. They were the size of a drawing pin head.

The duckweed went crazy but so too did algae.

I think my point is that input in the average tank is much higher than one would expect and even when correcting, nutrients still hang around for quite a while.

GREAT POINTS. My breeder tanks are Fluval Specs, and can turnover water at a high rate, which compounds the nutrient abundance since I also use ferts on all my aquariums. I'm going to stop the nitrifying bacteria, fertilizers, and all feeding, opting to in stead let the shrimp feed strictly on the biofilm and algae (along with greatly reduced lighting) for a couple weeks...

Does the above strategy sound wise?

 

[Caliban07]

GREAT POINTS. My breeder tanks are Fluval Specs, and can turnover water at a high rate, which compounds the nutrient abundance since I also use ferts on all my aquariums. I'm going to stop the nitrifying bacteria, fertilizers, and all feeding, opting to in stead let the shrimp feed strictly on the biofilm and algae (along with greatly reduced lighting) for a couple weeks...



Does the above strategy sound wise?

It does. People will tell you nutrients don’t cause algae and I believe that in essence this is true. But it does exacerbate existing algae issues.

I stopped using fish food. If you look closely enough you will find information that over 50% of a fishes natural diet consists of detritus and plant matter and that they can go long periods without protein during the dry seasons. I feed mostly frozen cyclops.

I don’t know why people feed shrimp and snails. If you want these critters to truly be a ‘clean up crew’ then they should be left to live off the tank. I have plenty of biofilm and decaying leaf matter to feed my fish and these guys.

I don’t use a filter personally. Just an airstone for oxygen. I do get mulm build up on the sand because unlike gravel it cannot fall between the cracks and crevices to where the plant roots are. I’ve just employed some Malaysian Trumpet Snails to turn the sand over and hopefully work the mulm down to the bottom layers. This stuff is supposed to be very beneficial. So I think it is pretty useless sat in a filter.

The way I run my tank isn’t desirable for most but I much prefer the hobby now than when I started down the high tech route years ago.

 

[Delapool]

It’s worth a try - I’ve noticed that new bulbs, initial ferts dosing, some of the plant growth products, etc have triggered algae growth. Not very bad but noticeable until it all seems to settle down again.

 

[Aquarium Junkie]

I have great success with “flying fox” fish. They are cleaning up some hairy algae in my aquarium now. Have a 73 gal and bought 4 flying fox a week ago and several ornaments/ plants are clean. I am using a rubber mouth playco for regular algae. Want to get mystery snail to help him out though.

 

[AmateurAquarist]

I have great success with “flying fox” fish. They are cleaning up some hairy algae in my aquarium now. Have a 73 gal and bought 4 flying fox a week ago and several ornaments/ plants are clean. I am using a rubber mouth playco for regular algae. Want to get mystery snail to help him out though.

Thanks! I have some siamese algae eaters, flying foxes are cool too, especially while they're juvenile

 

[pyealands]

Ok newbie 14 months ,
In New Zealand shrimp are illegal so im totally jealous ,
1st suggestion , totally nuke tank, filters ,hoses, substrate, airlines , everything ..replace plants ..

2nd suggestion, semi nuke, catch the shrimp useing traps and put into hospital tank ,
Take the media out of filter and put into main tank ,run the filter in the main tank with no media to flush the hoses and because algea hates fast moving water , add extra submerged water pump or pumps if possible . ,
Or Add as many air stones as possible.
Cover main tank completely, and set lights to 2 hrs
Feed main tank ammonia chloride .
Change water in main tank once a day cause algea won't like the chlorine .