Sulky Betta

[fyrclwn]

okay, this'll probably give y'all a chuckle, but i have a very annoying betta problem. just brought home a rather young male betta Friday night (Nov. 26th), and he seemed VERY pleased to find himself in a 20-gal tank, as opposed to the extremely cramped thing he was in @ the LFS. as he was exploring, he noticed a quite large (about 1/3 larger than him) female guppy, with his same basic coloration--silverish with lavender and silver tail and fins). he started showing his interest in her, she snubbed him, and he has now gone into a deep depression. won't eat (shows complete indifference, or spits it back out, depending upon his mood); won't "menace" the betta in his mirror (actually seems to have formed an aversion to his mirror--completely avoids that side of the tank, etc.); keeps his fins closed--although they are not "clamped", just droopy; spends most of his time either hiding in a corner of the tank or just floating at the top (blowing occasional bubbles) or laying on the bottom. he is exhibiting no signs of infection, parasites, injury, etc., except for his behavior. had a molly with swim bladder disease, so treated the tank with a broad-spectrum anti-fungal/anti-bacterial, and although the molly is flourishing, my betta is still in his funk. have removed the mirror to see if that helps with his aversion to the right side of the tank, but since i obviously can't help him with his guppy lady-love, i am totally stumped on what else to do for him. he will occasionally scrounge around the gravel for food after the lights are off, and seems to graze on the bits of algae growing on the caves (otos keep the growth pretty sporadic), but he refuses all food at "feeding time". i have read that a betta may sulk up to 10 days after moving to a new environment, but i really don't want to wait that long to act, if there is something i can do now. i have started considering getting him a female, but really don't want to get into breeding, etc......also, i have no way to keep them apart when they aren't breeding--unless i were to place one in the spawing tank that hangs in the aquarium---REALLY don't want to do that, as i don't want to confine one of them, while the others all swim free. i also wonder if a failed first attempt at "courtship" might cause him to shy from courting a "real" betta female, y'know?

second Q for you---although i have never seen offspring, i have heard that guppies and mollies can cross-breed. is this true? i ask, because since i added mollies to the tank, they and the guppies have been showing quite a bit of interest in each other.

BTW---i've noticed this always happens in my tank, but has anyone else noticed that adding new fish causes an immediate increase in breeding activities among _all_ the fish in the tank?

thanks for any and all help, suggestions, and feedback! never had a betta problem like this before, and really don't have a clue what to do about it.

fireclown

 

[Menagerie]

[center:cee38a5092] Welcome to AA, fyrclwn!! [/center:cee38a5092]
Frist, check your water parameters (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, temp, and pH). Please post back the exact numbers.

had a molly with swim bladder disease, so treated the tank with a broad-spectrum anti-fungal/anti-bacterial, and although the molly is flourishing, my betta is still in his funk.

Was the treatment going on while the betta was in there? How long was the treatment going on with the betta present? Many medications cannot be given to bettas, but I am not sure of the one that was used. Please post the name of the med.

has anyone else noticed that adding new fish causes an immediate increase in breeding activities among _all_ the fish in the tank?

:? no

 

[An t-iasg]

Hi fyrclwn,
Yes, please post your water parameters and the med you used in the tank. I don't really think the betta is love-struck with the guppy (but then again, I am not a male betta ) Congrats on putting the betta in a tank and not in a small bowl! What are some of his other tankmates? Are there any male guppies? As he and the guppies mature, there may be some aggression among them. The betta may mistake the guppies' fairly long and colorful fins for another betta. If this happens you'll probably have to put the betta in his own tank. My bettas are in their own 5 gallon tanks, which can be set up cheaply and easily.

My bettas, when new, didn't eat for a whole week! Try giving yours bloodworms a few times a week. I like the Hikari freeze-dried ones. My bettas also like the Hikari Betta Gold pellets. Sometimes if a piece of food is too big for the betta's mouth, they will spit it out. Betta foods are small enough for them. Maybe your betta is spitting out the food meant for the other fish. Sometimes my bettas pick at the gravel too. They may be seeing a very small crustacean that we can't see. I do have some diatom algae in my tank. Diatoms are very small crustaceans. They look like a brown spot on the glass. If you have any of this, as long as it's not a big outbreak, it's ok. We can't eliminate algae 100% from our tanks, and with the otos, you don't want to!

If your parameters are ok, and no other tankmates are causing any aggression, then the betta will perk up. The other behaviors that you describe are normal for bettas. Lying on the bottom is fine; my betta often rests on the gravel. As long as it's a little nap and he isn't there all day, it's fine. I have seen my betta pick at the algae around the heater suction cups. Just remember to vary his food; picking at the algae occasionally won't hurt him (plus you really can't make him stop anyway!) especially since the otos get to most of it first. Bettas are not fast swimmers -- they often do swim slowly and kind of randomly, and rest a lot. If you can, get a clump of java moss for him to rest on. This plant doesn't require any special lighting, and the betta will love it. One of my bettas guards his clump like a pit bull!

Blowing bubbles is a good sign -- it means he is happy and healthy, and maybe he will build a bubble nest. Building a bubble nest does not mean that you have to get a female for him -- he is just doing what his instint tells him to do. He and a female will fight, most likely to the death of one of them, if kept together all the time. He may or may not get a nest to stay together with other tankmates and the filter current. The filter current could be what is keeping him from the right side of the tank. Bettas don't like currents, so make sure he has a place on the other side of the tank to get away from it.

Bettas often do take a week or so to become comfortable in their new tank, but don't worry just yet. Post your parameters, tankmates and what food you're giving him now, and we'll go from there!

 

[FishLover14]

try feeding blackworms fish luv em,

Dan

 

[fyrclwn]

first, thanks for the welcome! although i'm new as a registered member, i've been browsing the forum for about a year now, and have been an aquarist since the late 80s.

as for the tank---has been established for over a year now, pH remains a steady 7.6, temp is a constant 80F, appropriate level of aquarium salt was added at beginning, and is replaced as needed at water changes (started putting it in the filter with the carbon & ammo chips so it dissipates gradually). all chemical parameters have been fine since the original cycling finished. filtration is done with both undergravel & a whisper hanging filter, i alternate Amquel and Easy Balance once a month to maintain nitrate/trite and ammonia balance, add Start Right with water changes, add Stress Coat when introducing new fish, and always use double the carbon and ammo chips in my filter, since i never know how many fish i'm going to have at any one time with the live-bearers. ; ) also, normally use a Nitrazorb pack in my filter, but need to get a new one, so am currently without. had a "hairy algae" bloom along in the summer, after a k-mycin treatment for "guppy problems" (highly resistent, eczema-looking skin problem which NOTHING seemed to affect), but that has long-since ceased to be a problem. green algae grows in a very thin layer on the cave decos--none on the glass (thank you, otos!)--and is really not an issue. deco---3 caves, clump of floating plants. and of course, there is netting over the open areas to keep the dojos in the aquarium. : )

tank mates---2 mature male guppies, 4 females--2 very large and mature, 2 small and juvenile; 2 gold mollies---1 of each sex, both mature (had 4, but 2 have since died of swim bladder disease. never have had any luck with mollies, but decided to try once again. bleh.); 3 otos; 1 kuhli loach (mature); 3 dojo loaches (mature).

meds---actually, used Jungle's tank buddies tabs, which uses nitrofurazone and furazolidone, which has always worked fast & fine till now. however, am contemplating doing a full course of Maracyn-2 after my next water change (end of the week), since the "guppy problems" have returned, and i've now had 2 (new) mollies die of swim bladder disease. and yes, the betta was in the tank at the time of med usage.

this is my second betta, the original fella having died from old age. : ( and am using the same foods he liked---AquaCulture's Betta Micro-pellets, Wardley Brine Shrimp, and of course, the algae wafers and flake food for the other fish. Glory pretty much ate anything i put in the tank...all the above, plus the peas i would give the loaches as an occasional treat. Ammie (short for Amethyst) ignores the pellets, spits out the shrimp (cubes which i powder, mostly use for the live-bearers' fry, but thought i'd try it with the betta), occasionally picks at the flake food, and noses the wafers. he has been a bit more interested in things today---fins still droopy, but occasionally allowing the tail and lower fins to spread while he swims. funny thing....the female guppy in question has started swimming and just hanging out next to him in fish buddy fashion. i think this may be one of things that has perked him up a bit. he still isn't eating or moving much around the tank, but at least he seems a little more involved....he's stopped trying to hide behind the undergravel filter exhaust tubes, plants, and heater, and actually is out at the front of the tank.

except for the one female guppy, he has shown absolutely no interest at all in the other fish. to be honest, he seems somewhat nervous being allowed to free-swim in a tank with other fish. i think he must be a very timid (for now, at least) fella (still avoids the side of the tank where the mirror was originally set up). hopefully, as he becomes accustomed to his new home, he will be more comfortable with the other fish. Glory had a ball being in a populated tank (would sit on the loaches, swim so his fins would brush over the other fish, etc.), and since he was my first, i guess i just figured all bettas were like that. ah well. personality is the reason we like enjoy them so much, right?! : )

hope that all helps you understand my tank a bit better. sorry about the vaguery in the first post---am battling the flu & my brain hurts! : /

fireclown

 

[fyrclwn]

Amethyst died. did a 1/4 water change & Start Right treatment, and removed the plants---thought their movement might be spooking him, and that really seemed to perk him up. he started swimming the entire tank, instead of staying in one corner (away from plants), and started fanning his fins. looked like things were pretty well solved. 3 hours later, his entire head was covered with a whitish-beige substance--started at the mouth and went backwards from there, even covering his eyes. he was swimming in a panic, being obviously blinded. based on the look of things, started immediate treatment for columnaris, but within an hour after that he was dead. i have never seen anything blow up that fast before---anyone have any ideas? all other fish are symptom-free, but plan on continuing the full course of treatment, just to be safe. on examination, it looked like he had a sort of ridge across his forehead, under the skin, which seemed to be a part of the infection. no open sores or injuries, no discoloration of fins, gills or scales, no red streaks, etc. just the ridge and the kind of lumpy-looking stuff (not slimy, tho) on his head, mouth and eyes.

anyway, thanks for the input.

fireclown