Upper dwelling fish suggestions?

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Alchemy129

Aquarium Advice Regular
Joined
Jun 22, 2004
Messages
51
Location
Lou, Ky
Hey! This is my first post! Seem to have a good thriving community here. Anyway i recently did a small upgrade from a 3 gallon tank to a better designed/equiped 5 gallon tank that i have now and am itching to get some new fish. The fish i have now are great but most of the time all of them hang out at lowest level of the tank. The betta travels between all ranges (lower,middle,top) and so do the guppy's except when they try to school with the neons that stay at the bottom. Anway that was just some background info, my fish list is in my sig and by the way i have 3 live (small)plants.

My question is what are some options for some attractive,preferably small sized, mainly upper/top dwelling community fish. And also if anybody replying also happens to know a good website to order tropical fish online would add that in.
 
Agreed, your tank is full, I really really really would suggest against adding anymore fish.
 
Overcrowded? The entire bottom row of fish in my sig don't take up any room. as the snail and shrimps dont even count in the equation at all. The frog likes to stay out of sight. The entire top 60% of my tank is empty unused space with only the betta popping up briefly from time to time, lots of free swimming space(almost the whole tank). I was only goin to add a pair of fish in but was looking for help with which pair 2 get for what i wanted. I'm not goin to drop a school of 15 or anyhting. If your worrying about filtration and air quality i have a bio-wheel, 3 live plants and 5 differnt tiny scavengers that devour anyhitng on the bottom, and i clean regualrly and check the water regularly. Also the neons are very small and stick close together, with the guppy's being the same size only thinner. I'm not trying to sound rude in this post or anything so please don't take it like that, just not what i was expecting from u guys, by the way i'll be getting around to posting pics of the tank later when i get ahold of a camera, the corner design gives is alot of open room. Also on the subject of scavengers i reccomend a ghost shrimp or two to any tank, they clean up and eat any leftover food that hits the bottom of ur tank keeping it free of debris and keeping the tank looking clean.
 
Alchemy129, the fish may be small now, but they get big. Those neons can get to be about 2" (correct me if I'm wrong anyone) in size...a school can get large, esp. in a small tank.
 
... ... ........

I was gonna reply. But decided it'd come out wrong. I'll let someone else try to explain the issues here.
 
Alchemy129 said:
Also on the subject of scavengers i reccomend a ghost shrimp or two to any tank, they clean up and eat any leftover food that hits the bottom of ur tank keeping it free of debris and keeping the tank looking clean.

Only line I would really agree with ! I love my ghost shrimp
 
ok this shoudln't be this difficult. 3 different people have replied to my topic and none of come close to suggesting any type of fish or website. Which is cool u can reply or not its up to you,i'm owed nothing and am thankful for your information, I do understand that you were trying to be helpful in another way. But can we bring the subject back to the original post by me instead of spinning off topic onto the science of balancing a aquarium...which is a reasonable subject, but not what i asked at all and for another topic entirely. From now on i will ask questions with as little background info as possible so we can stay on topic. So lets try this again, please ignore everyhitng else i've ever said in this thread except this.
My question is what are some options for some attractive,preferably small sized, mainly upper/ top dwelling community fish. And also if anybody replying also happens to know a good website to order tropical fish online would add that in.
P.S. can't be fin nippers either :wink:
 
Alchemy129 said:
Overcrowded? The entire bottom row of fish in my sig don't take up any room. as the snail and shrimps dont even count in the equation at all. The frog likes to stay out of sight. The entire top 60% of my tank is empty unused space with only the betta popping up briefly from time to time, lots of free swimming space(almost the whole tank).

You don't want your tank to be brimming with fish. Think of it this way: you wouldn't want to have to see another person every time you turned a corner in your house. There is also the bioload issue..

When I had a 5g with a "showpiece" fish (i.e. a betta), I had *one* other organism in there, which was a dwarf frog. My 5g at school housed a single organism- a male paradise fish.

Alchemy129 said:
If your worrying about filtration and air quality i have a bio-wheel, 3 live plants and 5 differnt tiny scavengers that devour anyhitng on the bottom, and i clean regualrly and check the water regularly. Also the neons are very small and stick close together, with the guppy's being the same size only thinner.

You cannot count on ghost shrimp to keep your tank clean, for one. Remember, they are just reprocessing waste and then excreting their own into the system. This is the same problem people have with "cleaner fish" like plecostomus or Chinese algae eaters- in the case of the plecostomus they add far more waste than one might expect, but luckily this is not the case with your shrimp. Plants, while helping, can also not be relied upon to keep your water quality pristine in the quantity you mentioned. It is good to see that you check and clean your tank regularly. Remember that you are aiming for 0 Ammonia and Nitrite, and less than 20 ppm of Nitrates ideally (though some people do let them fluctuate as high as 40 ppm- it depends on the sensitivity of your fish).

Neon tetras and guppies do both reach a good size (with a little variation based on genetics and the quality of their environment), but more importantly, neon tetras need to be in groups of larger than five, and they need more room than a 5g can provide. They should also only be added to *mature* tanks of preferably six months in age, and must be chosen carefully. The hardness and pH of your water can also have a negative effect on these fish, and many are known to waste away over a period of months or develop diseases that quickly spread through their school.

Guppies, depending on what mix of males and females you have (it sounds to me like you have two males, so this shouldn't be as much of a problem), will easily overpopulate such a small tank.

Corydoras aren't the best choice for a 5g because like neons, they need to be in groups (3+), and some species get to a good size. They also need a lot of room to roam around the bottom.

The mystery snail also adds a considerable amount to your bioload- be careful if it dies as well, as they leave behind a very icky carcass.

Alchemy129 said:
I'm not trying to sound rude in this post or anything so please don't take it like that, just not what i was expecting from u guys, by the way i'll be getting around to posting pics of the tank later when i get ahold of a camera, the corner design gives is alot of open room..

What you should expect from this forum is that people will try to give you the best advice possible for helping your fish survive and thrive in your aquarium. That you are getting an unsupportive response for the addition of more fish should indicate to you that it will decrease the quality of life for the fish you have.

I would suggest getting rid of everything but the shrimp, the betta, and the frog (if you are certain that it is in fact a dwarf frog and not the similar African clawed frog). There is no guarantee that your betta might not decide to turn on the frog and/or the shrimp at some point, but the fact that it hasn't yet is a good sign. However, you may also want to return the frog if it is hiding all the time. This may be a sign that it is being picked on by the betta when you aren't watching.

If you are interested in creating a more balanced aquarium with top, midlevel, and bottom-dwelling fish I would suggest you invest in a larger tank. The common 29g aquarium would be a good idea and could host a variety of different topdwellers such as silver and marbled hatchetfish, or some of the smaller gourami species that will spend much of their time in the top- to midlevels.
 
[center:fdbb4ef0aa] :smilecolros: Welcome to AA, Alchemy129!! :n00b: [/center:fdbb4ef0aa]

Just because you can physically fit more fish in the tank, doesn't mean there's room for them.
A few things to consider:
~swimming room
~aeration
~filtration
~cramped quarters lead to aggression
just not what i was expecting from u guys
We advocate responsible aquarium keeping. Many members will tell you that a 5 gal is just large enough for a betta and two to three bottom dwellers.

There are many ways to figure out how many fish can go in your tank. For peaceful fish, the inch (full grown) per gallon method is okay. That means you could have a total of 5 inches of fish. It may seem empty to you, but it is what the fish need.

Take for example, where you live. Since I don't know where you live, I will use my house as an example. My fiance and I rent the main floor of a house. There are two smaller bedrooms, a "larger" bedroom, a kitchen, a small area for a table, a bathroom and a living room. This is great--there's only two of us living in it (plus our pets--see sig), it looks like we can add more people--right?? Okay, our friends come up from the states. One sleeps on the couch and one sleeps in our office between the desk and the 50 gal tank (forget about the other bedroom--too much junk, which for your fish could mean decor, plants, rocks...). Our friends stay for a four day long weekend. By the time they left, I was ready to reclaim my office and living room and S T R E C H O U T.
That's how the fish feel.

Keep in mind, that fish keeping can be a life long hobby. When you are ready for a bigger tank, there will be more choices for what to put in there. Enjoy the fish you have now and allow them the room they have and don't force "company" on them :wink:
 
Alchemy129 said:
From now on i will ask questions with as little background info as possible so we can stay on topic. So lets try this again, please ignore everyhitng else i've ever said in this thread except this.
My question is what are some options for some attractive,preferably small sized, mainly upper/ top dwelling community fish. And also if anybody replying also happens to know a good website to order tropical fish online would add that in.
No one here will recommend putting any more fish in that tank.

If you had not given background, we would have asked for it--that is what being a responsible fish keeper is about. We are trying to help you and your fish.

Take into consideration the house metaphor.

Also, I don't know many people who order on-line. Try looking in the Buy-Sell-Trade forum for reviews.
 
Alchemy129, if you dislike all of that empty space at the top of the tank, filling it with fish is definitely not your only option. Two others that I can think of off the top of my head are a betta 'balcony' and a tall plant.

Many of us on the board have 'balconies' for our bettas - we use those suction cup soap dishes positioned close to the top of the tank. Our betta loved hanging out in there. Your betta would probably appreciate this own space too.

As for a tall plant, you have any number of options. We had a lot of empty space in our 10 gal, so we bought some extra tall plants with broad leaves to fill the space. Not only does it look great, but we often find our cories lounging around on the leaves near the top of the tank...it's almost as if they're sunbathing :)

Anyway, I know that you probably haven't gotten the advice you were looking for in this thread, but I just thought I'd present you with some alternatives that might work out for you instead. HTH!
 
A healthy betta "should" be found near the top of the tank because of their labyrinth fish nature, and for bubble nest building. I like the idea of tall plants or the balcony to provide an area near the top for the betta to feel comfortable.
 
I've decided to jump back into this thread:

1 red betta, 4 neons, 2 Leopard tail guppy's

These fish will fulfill the role you desire. The likely reason they are NOT fulfilling this role is overcrowding, which can cause the fish to behave differently than they would otherwise do.

I've never see guppy over near the bottom, nor bettas. My bettas have always prefered to be around the top actually. Neons as well are generally a middle dweller.

If all these fish are staying mostly towards the bottom, its an indication of some issue within the tank, such as overpopulation.
 
thanks for the ideas and posts Sara + Tankgirl, i'd like to know more about these betta balconies and where to get one as it sounds like a very good idea for what i want. Also my tallest plant is only almost half the height of the aquarium and i do have a large filtering tube i'd like to hide/ place something in front of, maybe something that grows straight up and is the full height of the aquarium,that my betta can also "rest on", any suggestions.
And I don't plan on doing any breeding of any of my fish, not starting any family's. :p But will adding more plants encourage my fish to spawn more then normal, just curious.
Also in reply to ferrets most recent post to clarify something, if u look back at my original/first post you will clearly see that i said that both my guppy's and my betta roam evenly over all ranges of my tank. So they are healthy.
The fish i was asking a suggestion for was for one that would stay around the top/surface say about 80% of time as that would have my display perfectly balanced the way i wanted it.
Oh and also in response to Hypostomus, i did a little thinking and research after i read ur comments on my cory cat and your right that guy is more then twice the size he was when i bought him but he looks well feed + active and healthy but i still am goin to see if i can pass him onto one of buddy's with a larger tank who i beleive has one already.
 
I agree... your tank is overstocked as it is.. I'd stick with what you have if not reduce what you have until you get a bigger tank. Remember not only is it important for your aquarium to look cool, but you want to keep a humane environment for your fish if you want them to thrive.
 
I agree... your tank is overstocked as it is.. I'd stick with what you have if not reduce what you have until you get a bigger tank. Remember not only is it important for your aquarium to look cool, but you want to keep a humane environment for your fish if you want them to thrive.
 
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