What have I done to my water?

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Shana0310

Aquarium Advice Activist
Joined
Feb 3, 2015
Messages
156
Location
Columbia SC
This is gonna be a long one.

I have a new 10 gallon for my Betta. I moved my cycled sponge filter (rated for 10 gallon use) from my old 5 gallon. I recently went to my LFS asking advise on my Betta's fins. They are tattered and look awful. Doesn't appear to be rot and I've never seen him biting them. LFS recommended turning off the filter and treating with salt. I keep it at a very low bubble but I don't think he believed me. So I turned it off, but kept it in the tank.
That brings me to Sunday. A week after I first disconnected the filter. I took my weekly water samples and they were crazy.

Ph - 7.8
Week before - 7.6

Ammonia - .5
Week before - 0

Nitrite - .5
Week before - 0

Nitrate - @ 2
Week before - @ 5

----------

So I did a 50% water change. Started the filter back up. Added some Stability in hopes of adding some good bacteria (it's always worked before). Then waited 24 hrs.
To test again.

Today my levels are...

Ph - 6 (what happened there?)
Ammonia - .25 (some improvement)
Nitrite - 2.0 (What??)
Nitrate - 2.0

I've never had a ph that low or a nitrite that high.

I'm debating on moving the the Betta to my QT tank but I'm afraid my HOB filter is gonna blow him away.

I'm keeping up the Stability for a week as if I were cycling the tank from scratch. I guess that's the right thing to do.

I'll take any advise. Thanks



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Imho, stop listening to the LFS you went to. They gave you bad advice.

First and foremost the best way to treat fins on a betta is to get the water as clean as possible. 0ppm of both ammonia and nitrite as well as 10ppm or less of nitrate. 9 times out of 10 rotting fins is directly caused by poor water quality and will heal very well when the water is corrected. If the improved water quality doesn't work, then it's time to try the salt but with the filter running. Lastly, if the fins are nearly gone and you've tried the other 2 things first, then it's time to go for a wide spectrum antibiotic.

There are occasions when bettas will nip their own fins (usually in high flow because of the drag) or they will get cut up on plastic plants.

Start with lots of water changes and wait to see how he responds.
 
+1^

If your worried about flow from the HOB... My brother uses a pantyhose to block the output flow on his without sacrificing GPH. The bettas appreciate it.


Caleb
 
I'll pick up the panty hose today and move my qt filter to the Betta tank.

So how much water should I change? Should I do it daily or every other day? How much time should I give it before moving onto salt? How much after that before moving to antibiotics?

No one seems to think its fin rot. But I can't see how it could be currant either. I have a tube covering the airline of the sponge filter so just a few bubbles break at the surface. The water surface barely moves.

Here is a photo. His fins are a bit more torn since this was taken. Still no fluffy white or bloody fins.

ImageUploadedByAquarium Advice1439283330.248225.jpg


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Omg the panty hose trick is genius. I threw some filter media in there for good measure. The surface hardly moves.


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I'll pick up the panty hose today and move my qt filter to the Betta tank.

So how much water should I change? Should I do it daily or every other day? How much time should I give it before moving onto salt? How much after that before moving to antibiotics?

No one seems to think its fin rot. But I can't see how it could be currant either. I have a tube covering the airline of the sponge filter so just a few bubbles break at the surface. The water surface barely moves.

Here is a photo. His fins are a bit more torn since this was taken. Still no fluffy white or bloody fins.

View attachment 276377


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If you're removing the betta, then the only reason you'll need to change water is to get your ph up. It is likely stalling your cycle at 6.
Here's what I recommend..
Do a 50% water change
Keep a regular check on ph, if it drops to 6 at any point, do another 50% wc.
If possible, get some filter media from a trusted lfs and add it to your filter.
Or, you could use a piece of shrimp to get things moving along if you don't have access to pure ammonia.
Your tank is cycling, and although you can do a fish in cycle, I recommend going ahead and putting him in your spare tank while your tank cycles since he is distressed.
Then just wait. When your nitrites and ammonia are consistently at zero you'll be ready :)

Oh, and meanwhile keep the bettas water super clean.
 
Last edited:
If you're removing the betta, then the only reason you'll need to change water is to get your ph up. It is likely stalling your cycle at 6.
Here's what I recommend..
Do a 50% water change
Keep a regular check on ph, if it drops to 6 at any point, do another 50% wc.
If possible, get some filter media from a trusted lfs and add it to your filter.
Or, you could use a piece of shrimp to get things moving along if you don't have access to pure ammonia.
Your tank is cycling, and although you can do a fish in cycle, I recommend going ahead and putting him in your spare tank while your tank cycles since he is distressed.
Then just wait. When your nitrites and ammonia are consistently at zero you'll be ready :)

Oh, and meanwhile keep the bettas water super clean.

If you're removing the betta, then the only reason you'll need to change water is to get your ph up.

Well that and removing those nitrates. Even fishless I would perform changes until nitrates hit 0 if I'm reintroducing the betta to this water.
 
If you're removing the betta, then the only reason you'll need to change water is to get your ph up.

Well that and removing those nitrates. Even fishless I would perform changes until nitrates hit 0 if I'm reintroducing the betta to this water.

Not necessary during the cycle though. When it's complete then the op should do a really large wc to bring nitrate down to a safe level.
 
I should've been more clear, I meant that before reintroducing the betta I would aim for 0 nitrates. Many systems run at 5-15 nitrates, I just meant get them close to 0 before reintroducing as they will spike when an ammonia source is reintroduced and processed.
 
I should've been more clear, I meant that before reintroducing the betta I would aim for 0 nitrates. Many systems run at 5-15 nitrates, I just meant get them close to 0 before reintroducing as they will spike when an ammonia source is reintroduced and processed.


Not sure I understand...nitrates at 5-15 are safe. I don't see the need for them to be at or near zero or the connection between that and a possible ammonia spike.
If pure ammonia or raw shrimp is used to build up the BB colony, then it is very doubtful that reintroducing the betta would create a spike.
Did you mean that nitrates will spike?

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Not sure I understand...nitrates at 5-15 are safe. I don't see the need for them to be at or near zero or the connection between that and a possible ammonia spike.
If pure ammonia or raw shrimp is used to build up the BB colony, then it is very doubtful that reintroducing the betta would create a spike.
Did you mean that nitrates will spike?

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Nitrates have a direct effect on a fishes immune system. The higher the nitrate level, the more the effect. 15ppm of nitrate is safe most of the time, but decreasing it to near 0 is going to help boost the fishes immune system even more which can aid in fighting off infection.

I do believe that a nitrate spike is what was being talked about.
 
Not sure I understand...nitrates at 5-15 are safe. I don't see the need for them to be at or near zero or the connection between that and a possible ammonia spike.
If pure ammonia or raw shrimp is used to build up the BB colony, then it is very doubtful that reintroducing the betta would create a spike.
Did you mean that nitrates will spike?

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Yes when an ammonia source is reintroduced the ammonia will spike, then trites, then nitrates will (I know you know this, just clarifying my post). I was just saying if the fish is going to be reintroduced without pure ammonia dosing to pre-cycle (I didn't see that mentioned, sorry if it was) then I would get the water down to low levels before reintroduction so there is head room with the spikes.

Maybe now on the third post ive made the point I was trying to make clearly.
 
This has gotten a lot more complicated than it needs to...IMO.
Water changes are one or the most important factor here along with a good diet, without over feeding.
The filter should not ever be turned off and meds is the very last resort.



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Yes when an ammonia source is reintroduced the ammonia will spike, then trites, then nitrates will (I know you know this, just clarifying my post). I was just saying if the fish is going to be reintroduced without pure ammonia dosing to pre-cycle (I didn't see that mentioned, sorry if it was) then I would get the water down to low levels before reintroduction so there is head room with the spikes.

Maybe now on the third post ive made the point I was trying to make clearly.


Gotcha! Thanks for clarifying. I didn't know nitrates affected immunity. Good to know! :)


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This has gotten a lot more complicated than it needs to...IMO.
Water changes are one or the most important factor here along with a good diet, without over feeding.
The filter should not ever be turned off and meds is the very last resort.



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Nah...not complicated at all. It's what the forum is for.
I was referring to a fishless cycle, which negates your post


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Thank you all for the information. I'm cycling it now. Wish me luck.


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Thank you all for the information. I'm cycling it now. Wish me luck.


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Cycling with what method? Just wondering.

To me it does look like mild fin rot but prior to reducing filter flow your readings don't look that bad, not nearly enough to cause fin rotting. Have you upped the filter back to capacity and have you found a cause for the severe pH drop? If it even did, possibly a fault in the testing?

Either something odd is going on or some test results got goofed IMO, although I'm not a big advocate of it this might be a rare case where I would suggest a dose of melafix, its hotly contested that it does what it claims but I do believe it could help in this case.
 
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