What is this film covering my water?

[src]

As some of you may recall, I originally started my cycle with a bad batch of ammonia - it had soap in it. I used 3-4 caps full of the ammonia before I discovered my mistake. I flushed my tank out MANY times with new water, including letting it stand overnight a couple of times, and have started my new cycle.

I've been getting a film on the top of the water, and at first I figured that it was some of the soap that had been trapped in my substrate (I just couldn't bring myself to throw out 100lbs of Eco-Complete), but I had flushed the substrate thoroughly.

I just used the Python to "skim" the latest batch off the top, and I can't believe that this is still caused by the tiny amount of soap in the original cycle. What else could this be?

The plants are doing very well (except for the moneywort, which melted due to the low light), and I have a bumper crop of snails that seem to be thriving.

Here are a couple of pictures from this evening:







In the last picture, I ran my finger through the scum, and the white bits that are not bubbles are actually solids that will precipitate if the film is disturbed too much. Fortunately, my skimming technique is pretty good now, but I'm about to build a surface skimmer just to try to keep up.

Any ideas?

 

[Ky'smommy]

just a little bit of soap caused that??
that seems a bit excessive and even with regular water changes it should be alot less.
sort of like diluting it.
im not really sure cuz i have never seen anything like that. but i would have to say only alot of soap would do that. goodluck

 

[src]

Yeah, when I bought the aquarium it was filled, and looked good. Since then I have washed it down with chlorine, vineger, lots of water, then filled, put 3-4 caps of contaminated ammonia, drained, flushed more than 8 times, filled and partially drained several more times, and now am doing 20-30% PWCs every couple of days to remove the film. This last batch formed in 3 days. It's really driving me nuts!

 

[tropicfishman]

could just be the ammonia for some reason, maybe reacting with some minerals in the water or something

 

[Guest]

If I wouldn't of known about the wacky ammonia that was put in the tank I would of thought that film was due to lack of surface agitation, but I dont know with all the water changes you said you have done. You could try the paper towel method to remove some of that film on the top. I used to battle it with the python, but the paper towel seems to work a little better if you want to try that. Just lay it on top and it soaks it up.

 

[MattAquaBio]

What are your water parameters and fish load?

 

[src]

PH was around 7.6 last time I tested, at the start of the cycle. I'm 7 days into a fishless cycle, using some media seeded in my 29G tank to try to kick-start things. Ammonia just dropped to zero today (was .25 last night), down from an initial load of 6ppm and 2+ppm 3 days ago. I just re-loaded ammonia, so I don't know what the current PPM is. Nitrites are between 2 and 5 on the chart, but I don't trust the high end of the readings - I think it is higher. I'm using the AP Freshwater Master test kit.

Those numbers were all taken after my PWC, about 20% tonight. Other than the film, the water is crystal clear.

I did dose some Flourish (not excel, just plain flourish) the first couple of days during the cycle, but I stopped that 3-4 days ago. There just aren't enough plants to need dosing right now.

I have some wisteria, anachris and a whole bunch of opportunistic snails in the tank. Until 2 days ago, it had direct sunlight from an east facing window, as well as 2 40W strip lights over half the tank. I found some BGA on a couple of leaves, so I pruned the affected parts and I've closed the blinds, so it's not getting any sun anymore. I have also have removed the lights for convenience while I build my canopy (almost done, yay!).

Thanks for pondering this one with me. I'm beginning to feel that this tank is cursed.

 

[RogerMcAllen]

I will second the paper towel method. I have had something similar happen to me with an uncovered tank that had little surface agitation. I think I may have just been dust in my case.

 

[SCFatz]

My 50 hex started to do that after start up....maybe not quite that bad...but it was there....

All I did was added a bubble wall and presto changeo it was no more.

A little surface agitation goes a long way IME.

 

[JeffreyL]

film

I think you are on the right track with PWC and paper towels. that is way too much surface film for a bit of soap after all the flushing you did. I had something similar, but not nearly so bad, when I was adding garlic extract to the fishfood during an ich bout. Don't know if it helped, but it can't hurt. lol Mine cleared up with paper towels, a bit more surface aggitation and of course no more garlic!! Good luck!!

 

[jcarlilesiu]

your tank looks pretty stocked with live plants, and you dont seem to have any surface aggitation. Most likely it is disolved organic matter and protein. This is the reason that salt water people have protein skimmers. This isn't going to be harmful to your fish or your plants, but it is unsightly and also will block some of the light your plants need as well as oxygenation for your water for your fish (if you have any yet).

Double check the ammonia you are dosing again and make sure it is pure. Shake the bottle and if you see foam or bubbles its no good.

Increase surface aggitation and make sure you have enough filtering for your tank. Slow down dosing because of plants and up your water changes.

If you ever see stagnant water in a pot hole, it always has this (or algae).

HTH

 

[src]

Thanks for all of the advice and reassurance. Regarding surface agitation, I deliberately directed the output from the XP3 down, so that the surface was still, so that I could remove the film more easilly. I'll change that tonight. In hindsight, the film has been worse since I did that. I'm now thinking that the melting moneywort might have contributed to this batch, if it is disolved organics.

The ammonia is the pure janitorial strength from Ace - no bubbles when shaken vigorously, no film when put in still water (I checked).

Thanks again!

 

[hc8719]

is it possible that theres not enough circulation it the upper tank?

my clawed frog had the same problem when i took his airrator out (it was to powerful, and made noise, he hated it)

 

[src]

Actually, the circulation is great on half the tank. The output from the XP3 is currently aimed forward and slightly down. You can see things (like the biostars from the LFS) follow the current to the front of the tank, then down to the bottom, then to the back and back up. The other half (where the input is) is pretty still. I'm going to rearrange things so the output is on the end wall of the tank, and aimed slightly up to create good surface activity. This should help get the water at the other end moving as well.

 

[Alshain]

If your goal is to not outgas CO2, then try bouncing the filter output off the glass at an upward angle. This will create minor surface aggitation to alleviate the problem and still outgas little CO2

 

[src]

If your goal is to not outgas CO2, then try bouncing the filter output off the glass at an upward angle. This will create minor surface aggitation to alleviate the problem and still outgas little CO2

That's the way I had it configured at first, and the film still formed. That's when I changed it to keep the surface still - I thought it was a contaminant and wanted it to collect on the surface so I could skim it off. Now I'll have to go for more aggitation, and am still considering making some form of skimmer.

I'll be adding another filter later (XP2 or 3), and that will allow me to deal with any remaining circulation issues. For now, it's just a big relief to hear that this isn't going to interrupt my cycle yet again.

 

[BillD]

To me it looks like a layer of bacteria, which is quite common in a new setup, especially if there isn't enough surface agitation. If you stir it up with your hand, does it break up into white "flakes"? I have used the gravel vac, inverted, to skim the surface, also.

 

[src]

To me it looks like a layer of bacteria, which is quite common in a new setup, especially if there isn't enough surface agitation. If you stir it up with your hand, does it break up into white "flakes"? I have used the gravel vac, inverted, to skim the surface, also.

That's exactly what it does. The white flakes made me think it was precipitating solids like soap does when it scums.

Keep talking, guys - the more you say, the better I feel!

Thanks again for all the input.