My shrimp hide and are slowly dying!!!

[andrewcul]

I recently broke my tank stand and had to get a new one, long story short everything including the water and filter is from the previous tank.

My shrimp were completely fine and happy in my old tank, since I got new I changed all the plants and rocks etc and now they are dying about 1-2 a day for the past couple days and no matter what I do they don't get better. My PH is dropping which is probably causing them a lot of stress I do not have a completely accurate it used to be a stable 7.0ish but now my test only goes as low as 6.0 so it could be lower than that.

First of all what type of things can drop the pH like this ( I have clay rocks if that helps ) and what can I use to naturally raise the pH?

I've added a picture simply in case you wanted to see the layout and if you saw anything that shouldn't be in there, like the amount of clay rocks.

ps. if you're wondering where the shrimps are they are all hid behind the filter for some reason. The tank temp is 25C so they can't be cold. Also any more information needed just say and I'll do my best, I'm panicking right now because I hate seeing them die like this.

 

[andrewcul]

My shrimp are dying and I don't really know why!!

I recently broke my tank stand and had to get a new one, long story short everything including the water and filter is from the previous tank.

My shrimp were completely fine and happy in my old tank, since I got new I changed all the plants and rocks etc and now they are dying about 1-2 a day for the past couple days and no matter what I do they don't get better. My PH is dropping which is probably causing them a lot of stress I do not have a completely accurate it used to be a stable 7.0ish but now my test only goes as low as 6.0 so it could be lower than that.

First of all what type of things can drop the pH like this ( I have clay rocks if that helps ) and what can I use to naturally raise the pH?

I've added a picture simply in case you wanted to see the layout and if you saw anything that shouldn't be in there, like the amount of clay rocks. ( I think )

ps. if you're wondering where the shrimps are they are all hid behind the filter for some reason. The tank temp is 25C so they can't be cold. Also any more information needed just say and I'll do my best, I'm panicking right now because I hate seeing them die like this.



This was posted in another thread but got no response.

 

[Laeris]

Are you feeding them? New tanks don't really have a lot of biofilm right off. Bacter AE will help with that. Han Aquatics is the only place I know carries it in the USA. That's the only thing I can think of with them clustering around the filter.

It's hard to say why if that isn't it, which is likely why you haven't received a slew of responses.

 

[andrewcul]

Are you feeding them? New tanks don't really have a lot of biofilm right off. Bacter AE will help with that. Han Aquatics is the only place I know carries it in the USA. That's the only thing I can think of with them clustering around the filter.

It's hard to say why if that isn't it, which is likely why you haven't received a slew of responses.

Yeah they get fed, they do come out and eat but then they go back so they obviously just feel safe behind there. It just makes no sense to me why they are dying, I can only assume its the pH but I can't do anything about that from what I read, any sudden increase will kill them as well.

thanks for the reply though

 

[ScotJudd]

Hi. I think that your Ph is a problem. A low Ph often indicates a very low Kh (Carbonate hardness) which buffers the water and keeps the Ph stable. Anything under 6Kh could cause your tank to become unstable although it is strange that you haven't moved home and used a different water source.
I've try to look up the effect of clay rocks with no luck but if that's the only change in the tank then they could be suspects.
You could bring the Ph up slowly over a few days with some crushed coral in the filter or use bicarbonate of soda but be cautious not to raise the Ph too quickly. My source water has a Kh of less than 1 and I add 2.5 ml of bicarbonate to every 10 litres of water, this raises Kh to about 6.
The drop in Ph is probably the cause of your shrimp loss and increasing the Ph may not initially help matters (yet another Ph change) but I can't really see any alternative.
Let us know what you do and how it works out. Good luck.



Sent from my iPad in West Yorkshire, U.K.

 

[andrewcul]

Hi. I think that your Ph is a problem. A low Ph often indicates a very low Kh (Carbonate hardness) which buffers the water and keeps the Ph stable. Anything under 6Kh could cause your tank to become unstable although it is strange that you haven't moved home and used a different water source.
I've try to look up the effect of clay rocks with no luck but if that's the only change in the tank then they could be suspects.
You could bring the Ph up slowly over a few days with some crushed coral in the filter or use bicarbonate of soda but be cautious not to raise the Ph too quickly. My source water has a Kh of less than 1 and I add 2.5 ml of bicarbonate to every 10 litres of water, this raises Kh to about 6.
The drop in Ph is probably the cause of your shrimp loss and increasing the Ph may not initially help matters (yet another Ph change) but I can't really see any alternative.
Let us know what you do and how it works out. Good luck.



Sent from my iPad in West Yorkshire, U.K.

Thanks, I've bought some crushed coral on the internet and hopefully there won't be too many more deaths.

 

[Delapool]

Hi, the picture didn't make it? Stirring up the tank could of stirred up organic detritus which tank bacteria are now taking advantage of and the increased bacterial activity is chewing through your ph/kh. Have you tested tap water used for water changes to check ph though?


If tap water is suitable, then water changes may get you there otherwise small amounts of baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) will also lift ph. This is fairly quick but something like crushed coral would be a slower way to lift ph/kh as well. Otherwise there are commercial products.


Clay rocks should be fine and won't change ph. Especially if they have been in the tank for some time.

 

[andrewcul]

The picture wasn't that important really, it was only to show its planted and the amount of clay rocks I'm using. I've took another and hopefully it should show. ( I'm new as you can probably tell )

The clay rocks have been in only for a 3weeks now give or take. When buying them it said 'minimal effect on pH' so I don't feel it could be them but I don't know anything else that could cause it.

My tap water comes up as 6.8pH 0.8 Cl2 between 3 and 6 KH and 8 GH


It's really weird because some shrimp seem happy and healthy were some others are hiding and just die in place, they look like statues until something goes past and they fall to their side.

 

[Autumnsky]

Agree with the above as in stirring up muck causing ammonia or Nitrite or Nitrates to get out of line.

Did you put in a new filter pad or clean with tap water, because if so you could have thrown out or killed your BB or most of your BB?

Otherwise it sounds like a pH crash or old tank syndrome.

Do you happen to use Amquel Plus? It will use your KH and tip the balance causing a ph crash in lower hardness and KH water. It is awesome if you have hard water.

I now use marine calcium additive - I have a 0 KH and pretty lowish GH. One guy here recently mentioned Oyster shell grit from the feed store worked fast to get the KH and magnesium up.

Previously I used a pinch of baking soda, approx. heaping tablespoon epsom salt dissolved for 5G. Have also used Cuttlebone that I scraped the soft part out with a bumpy silverware /laser kitchen knife to make a powder and added it to the water.

 

[andrewcul]

Agree with the above as in stirring up muck causing ammonia or Nitrite or Nitrates to get out of line.

Did you put in a new filter pad or clean with tap water, because if so you could have thrown out or killed your BB or most of your BB?

Otherwise it sounds like a pH crash or old tank syndrome.

Do you happen to use Amquel Plus? It will use your KH and tip the balance causing a ph crash in lower hardness and KH water. It is awesome if you have hard water.

I now use marine calcium additive - I have a 0 KH and pretty lowish GH. One guy here recently mentioned Oyster shell grit from the feed store worked fast to get the KH and magnesium up.

Previously I used a pinch of baking soda, approx. heaping tablespoon epsom salt dissolved for 5G. Have also used Cuttlebone that I scraped the soft part out with a bumpy silverware /laser kitchen knife to make a powder and added it to the water.

No new filter pads, new carbon bags though because they recommend you change them every month. Not heard of amquel plus though.


My tests are all fine apart from pH so I'm not sure about old tank syndrome, although I looked it up and it does sound like my issue, I'll give the water changes ago while I wait for my crush coral to arrive in the post.

Thank you

 

[andrewcul]

Alarming news, my pH has dropped to 3.9

I went out and bought a digital water test because this master test kit thing is useless it only goes as low as 6, I assumed it wouldn't be far off 6. The test was calibrated so it isn't wrong. No wonder they are dying really, I should have bought this test a while ago.

I'm going to go and do water changes now and start to try and slowly raise the pH, I can't wait till tuesday for my delivery of coral.

No idea how my pH can drop this much in so little time but this is what I'm dealing with, wish the shrimps luck... I am.

 

[Delapool]

Can you cross check the digital meter on the tap water which I think was 6.8? A value of 3.9 sounds odd imo.

 

[andrewcul]

Can you cross check the digital meter on the tap water which I think was 6.8? A value of 3.9 sounds odd imo.

I was sceptical as well, I did a dip test and liquid test with the water I was collaborating the digital in and all 3 matched up, the digital was off my .1 but still.

The actual fish in the tank are really happy and healthy which I'm shocked about, some have even given birth so there are a load of babies swimming around ( quite big babies now so the birth must have been a while ago )

 

[andrewcul]

update:

The water change has put it up to 5.6 which is a much bigger jump than I wanted but there isn't much I can do about that. I'll just have to keep an eye on them throughout the day and keep checking the pH.


Thanks to all your suggestions and I hope this gets sorted


ps. I do change my water every week, that water change made a big difference like I don't clean my fish, just putting it out there that I do.

 

[Fresh2o]

That is quite a ph drop. Would you list everything you have added (rocks, substrate, etc) to the tank? One thing you can do is take a sample of each (might be difficult with the rocks, depending on the size), place them in separate containers and add either DI or tap water. And set aside either DI or tap water as a control. Basically find out if one of those items is contributing to the ph drop by testing each.


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

 

[andrewcul]

That is quite a ph drop. Would you list everything you have added (rocks, substrate, etc) to the tank? One thing you can do is take a sample of each (might be difficult with the rocks, depending on the size), place them in separate containers and add either DI or tap water. And set aside either DI or tap water as a control. Basically find out if one of those items is contributing to the ph drop by testing each.


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

I use crushed quarts ( apparently, I checked the bag it came in ) for the floor, clay rocks called 'Dragon Stone Rock' which do affect pH but claims to only minimal change, I recently put in a piece of drift wood as I heard it brings up pH. I have finally got two pot shrimp house/tube things.

I do use the correct dosage of liquid carbon, this does lower pH I found when I tested it in a glass of water, it was 7.1 and when I added an extreme amount of carbon, a lot more than I would in the 240 litres in my tank, it only dropped to 6.9.

I'm at a loss on what is causing this, clearly there is something in the tank effecting it, maybe everything which is effecting it just a little is all building up to effecting it a lot. Hopefully if I do mini water changes until my crush coral arrives it will all be fine.

 

[ScotJudd]

Hi Andrew.
As a rough rule of thumb, some rocks and gravels will either have no effect on Ph or will tend to raise Ph whilst any organic decor, like drift wood, roots and bog wood will tend to decrease Ph.
Co2 injection will drop Ph whilst liquid carbon only has a slight tendency to drop Ph.
All of these Ph changes depend almost entirely on Kh, carbonate hardness. A Kh of 6 deg is as low as I would go myself and my tank happily sits at Ph 7, any further increase in Kh raises the Ph. Any lower than a Kh of 3 deg and my Ph becomes unstable and starts to crash.


Sent from my iPad in West Yorkshire, U.K.

 

[Autumnsky]

You should get the measurement of KH and GH. It took me a few months to get mine to stabilize. I was afraid to do anything too dramatic. The fish that lived through it were ok with low PH. You might want to set up an alternative bucket, tub or tank for the shrimp and move some plants or stones in with them.

 

[andrewcul]

My Kh and Gh test has arrived, I did a test and the water turned yellow after one drop So its 1 dKH, my TAP water is 3 dKH

( none of this makes sense to me )

My TAP Gh is 9dH and tank is 11gH ( possibly ten, I lost count as I kept being asked questions ( I can recount if necessary ))

Is this good or bad, this is new territory for me.

 

[Odin]

Take a look at the product saltishrimp gh/kh+, this is a remineraliser which will help.