Starting A New Small Pond. . . Any suggestions?

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honmol

Aquarium Advice Activist
Joined
Oct 23, 2005
Messages
105
Location
Seattle & San Diego USA
This summer I'm going to make a small pond. It's going to have a waterfall and I want to have small fish in it. It'll have floating plants to provide protection from any predators and I need to keep in mind that it gets cold in the winter (not really cold, and not for very long, but I still need to keep it in mind) I was thinking of maybe white cloud mountain minnows but am not sure of other fish to put in. Any ideas would be appreciated. I don't want an ordinary pond with goldfish and koi. I had an idea (not sure it would work. . . but, here it is)

The area where the waterfall would have to be is a realatively small area and the boulder from which the water will fall takes up about half of the space. So, instead of just having a tiny pond, I was thinking of digging a hole under the path that would limit the size of the pond and putting piping or tubing in to create a tunnel from this Area to another, bigger area. It would let me at least triple the size of the pond. Would this work?
 
Should work, but if the current in the pipe is too swift, the fish will eventually all migrate to the lower pond. Try to use the largest pipe possible, maybe two of them.
 
Thanks. What types of fish should I put in? I just moved from a more tropical climate to a cooler one so I'm not exactly sure what will live or die here. I can add a heater and some people say that you don't need one that'll cover the whole pond, just part, the fish will crowd around that. Does that work? The pipe connecting the two sections of pond would be as big as I can get because it would also provide cover from predators. Can you do a fishless cycle for a pond? What differences would you make for that? I've also before used large container type things to make ponds before but this would be different because of the shape and design of it. Nobody makes containers like that. So how do I build a pond? Is it okay to use concrete? Should I use a substrate? If so, what? I have wetlands and stuff near my house (down the street) Will I get tadpoles? If not, what types of tadpoles (if any) would work?
 
Fish species: Most everyone up here has catfish and goldfish. I wouldn't know what else to try, but anything that can tolerate temperatures down to 36 or so should be fine. They slow down thier metabolisim for winter, can survive without food or filtration, and just need enough oxygen. Just don't let the pond freeze to the bottom, and keep an open space at the top. (The deeper the better to prevent bottom freezing.)

Heat: If you get a cold tolerant species, you only need to heat a small area of surface water to melt the ice for gas exchange. They make little floating heaters for this purpose. Given there is no insulation on the surface of the water, you wouldn't want to try heating the whole pond, at least not with conventional technology.

Fishless cycle: Sure! I suggest you do your plantings first, some compost in the plant's soil should be all you need to cycle. If you don't see an ammonia spike, and want to be sure it's cycled, throw in some fresh compost like your bannana peels or such and try testing again. The plants will also take up ammonia directly, so you may not see a spike without a really large ammonia input..

Construction: You can do a quick test to see how well the soil absorbs water in your yard. Dig a hole two feet deep, fill it with water. Check on it the next day. If the water goes down, you need a pond liner. (Most people do.)

Find out what sizes of pond liner are available in your area. Plan your pond out so that the width of the liner will go down one side, across, and back up the other side, with a good sized flap sticking out on all sides. Dig out a hole in the shape you want. If digging a deep pond, it may be a good idea to have a shallower ledge around the edge for planting shallow water plants. If your soil is rocky or has lots of roots, you could go for the concrete, or put down a couple inches of sand. You don't want anything puncturing your pond liner when you fill it. Lay down your liner, pleating where necessary to make it lay down against all parts of your hole. Use rocks or concrete forms to hold down the edge of your liner.

Your tube idea is somewhat difficult. If you could, I'd dig the whole pond as a single unit, put in your pipe on top of the liner, then fill in your rocks and soil to form the path over the top. This way you don't have to worry about leaks around the pipe where it goes through the liner.

If you need to leave the path untouched during construction, you will have to find an adhesive that works with the pool liner and adhere the liner to the pipe.

You could use concrete, but it is likely to fiddle with the chemistry of your water. You could use concrete with a pond liner or pool liner.

Substrate: to major choices, soil, or no substrate with all the rooted plants in pots. Pots make it easier to maintain the plants, but soil means you can put in some fast growth plants and cover the bottom fairly cheaply/easily.

Tadpoles: You'd have to study the current life forms present to find out. Be very careful about importing any amphibious critters into your pond, they are likely to get out into the wild population, and possibly cause problems. Talk to your county's cooperative extension office, or a biologist at your local high school or collage. They should be able to tell you what species are native to the area, and if they are likely to migrate into your pond.
 
I have 2 6 year olds that want "their own pets". They don't want their pets to be with the other people's pets either. I was thinking of making a 10 gallon pond for them. Obviously, this would be easier to heat and maintain. I might even let them have tropical fish. We might have to bring them inside when it gets coldest, but I think that it would work. I have an old breeding tank that they could live in when it got colder. One of the reasons that they agreed to fish instead of dogs and cats was that dogs and cats are much harder to breed. Are there any easy to breed, easy to care for, hardy fish that I could get them?
 
10 gallons is awfully small for a pond. If you want to keep it small, you might go for those water barrel gardens. I think they are around 25 gallons.

Goldfish are very hardy, I have heard of them breeding well in pond conditoins, but not in something that small.

White Cloud Mountian fish are cold hardy, I have not heard much about breeding them.

Guppies and mollies are probably the easiest to breed. They will need to be taken inside when it gets cold though. Guppies are hardier than mollies. "Feeder" guppies may be more hardy than fancy guppies, but fancy guppies are more interesting to breed, as you can try to invluence color/fin patterns over the generations.

Whatever fish you select, most fish need to be seperated from thier own children if the children are to survive. For example: a mother guppy has her appitite supprest for a few hours after giving birth, but afterwards is likely to eat her own children. That indoor aquarium might be used for growing out the fry until they are large enough to go back to the pond.

Unless your kids are into the gardening aspect of having a pond, they might be happier with indoor aquariums. It is much easier to observe the fish that way, and a little 10 gallon setup shouldn't be too expensive.
 
We don't really have much space indoors. The "pond" would be more like a small tank, just outside. I've shown them some pictures of guppies and they like them. They also like tetras, ottocinclus, and glassfish. I was thinking of getting as few guppies as possible (maybe just a female if she'd be okay without others of her own kind because even starting with one female I'll have lots of fry before I know it, if not, either 2 females or a trio) First I'll get the guppies, let them get settled in, and see if ottos would work. I don't think that I'll get glassfish but I'll look into the tetras. It'll probably turn out to be just the guppies and ottos though, I don't like to separate the fish because the lfs only takes the more colorful, mature guppies so I'd have tons while waiting for them to grow. I'll provide some plants and hiding spaces for fry and they should do well. Would it be ok just to get the female guppy and the ottos to start with?
 
I love ottos! They can be hard to keep though, are you familiar with thier dietary requirements?

I definately agree with the guppy plan.
 
Yes, I know about ottos. I haven't had them before but researched them before showing them to the kids because I don't want them to get to really want a fish and then tell them that they can't have it because It wouldn't work in the pond. I'm supposed to heat a slice of cucumber covered in water in the microwave for 30 seconds then attach it to some type of weight so that it'll sink in the pond for them, right? I don't know how often I should do this though.So the 1 female guppy is okay?Or do I need 2 or a trio? Should I get snails and shrimp? I'm not worried about snail infestation. Could I keep shrimp in the pond too? If so, is there any shrimp that's easier to breed? My lfs will buy shrimp. They put them in some of their tanks and find that shrimp are easy to sell. Do I need to separate the females and male guppy fry? How can I sex them at a young age? Will the males be aggressive towards each other? (some people say that they'll be peaceful together, others say they will fisht)
 
honmol said:
I'm supposed to heat a slice of cucumber covered in water in the microwave for 30 seconds then attach it to some type of weight so that it'll sink in the pond for them, right?
That works good. You can try a variety of vegtables in the squash/melon family. You can try out cooked and fresh, diffrent fish prefer diffrent ones. If you can observe the ottos, they should have chubby bellies and poop constantly, that's when they're getting enough food. They're getting too much if the vegtable starts turning nasty before they eat it. Bull uneaten food out after a day or two.
honmol said:
So the 1 female guppy is okay?Or do I need 2 or a trio?
1 female guppy will be ok. They are very social, but she won't be alone for long. She's almost guarrenteed to be pregnant when you get her.
honmol said:
Should I get snails and shrimp? I'm not worried about snail infestation. Could I keep shrimp in the pond too? If so, is there any shrimp that's easier to breed? ?
I would. I personally like them. I havn't had any luck with shrimp breeding, you might want to do some research.
honmol said:
Do I need to separate the females and male guppy fry? ?
I've never heard of that, besides the fact that it's hard to sex them before they grow up a little bit.
honmol said:
How can I sex them at a young age? Will the males be aggressive towards each other? (some people say that they'll be peaceful together, others say they will fisht)
The sex of the fry is influenced by the pH of the water, but it's not really possible to tell until after they grow a bit what sex they are. The males will chase each other and the females, but I've never seen them do damage to each other.
 
ok. I was asking because I've heard that the guppies will breed at a very young age and would like to have more controlled breeding. That way I can inbreed more safely. Maybe once the babies are born I'll remove the mother so that she won't breed with her youmg

Maybe I'll put her into the family pond (no other guppies present) and put her into the smaller pond for breeding. I could even put the females into the larger pond with her once they are large enough not to get eaten. The pond that she'd originally be in would just be for the little kids (There are 5 kids, of which they are the smallest) and it could even be like a fry raising pond, that way they'd get to have their fish, (the males would grow up in their pond(I might need to expand their pond to be bigger, though.) so they would get to see the colorful tails) and the females wouldn't be harrassed by the males.
 
They will breed at a very young age. You won't likely see the offspring of such unions survive though unless you separate them from the parents. Removing the mother is a very good idea. I used to use a floating breeder box that is shaped to encourage the fry to swim down away from their mother into a safe zone where she can't get to them.

As far as females being harassed by the males, this may be a human perspective. I felt sorry for this one female, and put her on the other side of a divider from the males that were harassing her. The entire time she was on the far side of the divider, she was swimming back and forth, trying to reach the other guppies. I eventually put her back in with her friends.
 
I was talking about separating the females from the males. This way I can breed selectively. Then the little kids would have the males with the huge and colorful tails to look after. What about dome dwarf cories? I'm getting the guppies and ottos but maybe a school of dwarf cories too. Any other fish? What about sparkling gouramis? What about the larger pond? Any suggestions for that?
 
I don't know what your weather is like, but I'd be hesitant to put any but the most hardy fish in an outdoor pond here. It will be more subject to temperature swings, contamination, and intense lighting than an aquarium.

I don't know much about gouramis or cories, hopefully someone else here can chime in on how hardy they are.

I suggest you work into this slowly, pick up only one species (a few fish) at a time, and give the pond a few weeks to adjust to each addition before adding another group of fish.
 
My weather is ALWAYS warm. We only have one season instead of the usual 4 and that's summer. If neccesary I will put a small heater in the pond but I probably won't need it. Cories are pretty hardy but tell you when your water conditions are bad so they're good sort of early warning signs of later problems. As far as the gouramis, pygmys are supposed to be okay. They'd be some of the last to come in. I'll leave a few males in with the females in the pond. I am the first to admit that the best and most beautiful fish can be the result of accidental breeding.
 
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