Too much flow in sump?

[want2findnemo]

Well after reading some posts on flow in the tank. I have concluded that it is good to have a lot of flow.

But my question is what about in a sump?

Will too much flow going through my sump result in a decline in performance for my skimmer?

MSX 160. skimmer.


Thanks in advanced.

 

[melosu58]

I dont think it matters in a sump but in a refugium is a different matter.

 

[want2findnemo]

Ok thanks just making sure.

Still working on the sump heh.

Dont want to glue the baffles until im for sure for sure. =p

 

[fijiwigi]

I dont think it matters in a sump but in a refugium is a different matter.

Why??

 

[want2findnemo]

well i know in a refugium less flow is required for proper cultivation of pods and stuff.

 

[fijiwigi]

My Refugium has great flow and Massive amounts of pods. If its designed right the water flow even if intense will just kinda flow over the top portion of the refugium section and the water in the lower part of the Refugium section will be pretty stable.

 

[ccCapt]

Will too much flow going through my sump result in a decline in performance for my skimmer?

No. The skimmer will pull the same amount of water into it no matter how much is flowing thru the sump. That's a great skimmer you have. But, if you have any live rock or lr rubble, or any chemical media (carbon, gfo, etc) in the sump, too much flow will cut their efficiency. The recommended flow thru a sump is 5-10x the tank volume.

 

[want2findnemo]

Ok cool. The LR will be in the refugium and the carbon will be in a two fishes phosphate reactor.

Both controlled by a ballvalve.

I will have a small 3x3 area of LR rubble in the first chamber and the pipe will go in there to prevent salt splash.

(similiar to what you see in the top right of this pic)

http://www.melevsreef.com/acrylics/sumps/a/sump_model_a_1.jpg

 

[fijiwigi]

Ok cool. The LR will be in the refugium and the carbon will be in a two fishes phosphate reactor.

Both controlled by a ballvalve.

I will have a small 3x3 area of LR rubble in the first chamber and the pipe will go in there to prevent salt splash.

(similiar to what you see in the top right of this pic)

http://www.melevsreef.com/acrylics/sumps/a/sump_model_a_1.jpg

'
If you use a ball-valve to minimize the flow on the return line make sure you T off from the pump so it splits the flow back into the return pump section The ball valve goes on the pipe split off from the return line back into the sump. You don't want to restrict the pumps flow at all its hard on the pump and will cause it to break faster and also can create micro bubbles from what I understand.

 

[Ziggy953]

Just as an FYI the flow through a Fuge should be around 300gph. More then that and you are defeating the purpose. Less and you can end up with skum on the surface. I keep mine about 350gph or so. The idea behind a fuge is for your water to linger with the Macro for an extended period of time. This allows the Macro to remove nutrients in the water. The pod growth is an extra benefit of the fuge.

 

[fijiwigi]

Just as an FYI the flow through a Fuge should be around 300gph. More then that and you are defeating the purpose. Less and you can end up with skum on the surface. I keep mine about 350gph or so. The idea behind a fuge is for your water to linger with the Macro for an extended period of time. This allows the Macro to remove nutrients in the water. The pod growth is an extra benefit of the fuge.

I guess I figure if its in the water its absorbing nutrients no matter what. The way my sump is set up the center section is the refugium I have a Mag7 that feeds the sump. The flow is suppose to be around 480gph according to the calculator. My center refugium section when I look at it looks totally still and mellow I can barely tell the water is even moving yet I know it is. When The water flows through it just seems to be fast flowing over the top 10% of that section. Between the baffles of my refugium section the bottom 50% appears to have no flow at all and this is where my Macro grows. And it grows really well. I guess my point is the Baffles keep it calm even when there is a high flow rate

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f11/chaeto-doing-its-job-101517.html

 

[Ziggy953]

Longer reaction times in the Fuge will have better results. Also the size of your fuge plays a role in how well it does it's job. 10%-20% of total display volume is a general rule of thumb. A larger fuge is even better. I have a 120g display and my fuge is 20g about 17% of my total display volume.

What calculator did you use to determine that? I would be interested in tinkering with it and see what numbers I get for my system.

 

[fijiwigi]

What calculator did you use to determine that? I would be interested in tinkering with it and see what numbers I get for my system.

I was just referring to the Return pump Calculator for sump flow Danner Mag-Drive Supreme 7 700 GPH Water Pump, 500-1000 GPH > Submersible > Water Pumps > Saltwater Aquarium Supplies

 

[Ziggy953]

Oh. That is a little different then the fuge. That is more for return/sump ability.

The refugium should be calculated differently then the sump. Since you have a sump with the fuge in the center you are kind of stuck with what ever the flow is from your return pump. Nothing wrong with your setup or anyone elses like it. My point was that for a fuge to really work the most efficiently you want a slower flow rate through it. The longer the water is in contact with the macro the more nutrients will be pulled out.

 

[fijiwigi]

I have never seen a refugium dedicated setup how does the plumbing work with that exactly doesn't there have to be a return pump?

 

[Ziggy953]

Well after reading some posts on flow in the tank. I have concluded that it is good to have a lot of flow.

But my question is what about in a sump?

Will too much flow going through my sump result in a decline in performance for my skimmer?

MSX 160. skimmer.


Thanks in advanced.

Sorry to get off topic on your thread. I agree with the others your skimmer is going to pull the same amount of water no matter how fast the flow is through the sump.

 

[Ziggy953]

I have never seen a refugium dedicated setup how does the plumbing work with that exactly doesn't there have to be a return pump?

I have a dedicated refugium. It is a 20g tall. I have drilled one end and put a bulkhead in. Water flows out of my tank via my overflows and one drain line dumps into the fuge. The water then flows out of the fuge into my sumps. This is not an uncommon setup at all. Many larger sump systems have the fuge setup to allow slower water rates. With smaller sumps it's hard to do that because you just don't have the space or the extra plumbing. Also with smaller setups there isn't as much need for it. Take your tank for example. (46g bow??) you havea mag7 as your return you aren't getting 700gph at the return in the tank so that means you aren't getting too much flow through your sump/fuge. On larger tanks you can split your drain lines and have them feed different areas of your sump. Make sense?

 

[fijiwigi]

I understand thanks for explaining that ziggy953
So you have 2 drain lines on your main display one of which drains into the fuge. So If you have the mag 12 for example @4' thats about 1100gph from your return pump into your tank. But since only half of it is draining threw the one drain line into the fuge its about 550gph Do you then put a ball-valve on the fuge drian line to slow the drain flow down to about 300gph or so? This would be the only time you would want to use a ball-valve on the drain line because the other overflow would still drain whatever amount of water is still being pushed into your tank from the return pump. Is this correct. Sorry to be a pest I like to fully understand everything.

 

[Ziggy953]

I understand thanks for explaining that ziggy953
So you have 2 drain lines on your main display one of which drains into the fuge. So If you have the mag 12 for example @4' thats about 1100gph from your return pump into your tank. But since only half of it is draining threw the one drain line into the fuge its about 550gph Do you then put a ball-valve on the fuge drian line to slow the drain flow down to about 300gph or so? This would be the only time you would want to use a ball-valve on the drain line because the other overflow would still drain whatever amount of water is still being pushed into your tank from the return pump. Is this correct. Sorry to be a pest I like to fully understand everything.

Actually I have 4 drain lines from my tank and I have a little over 2000gph at the top of my tank. I regulate the flow through the sump via a gate valve on that particular return line. All 4 of the drain lines have valves on them. I can shut them off as needed.

 

[fijiwigi]

Holy Cow!!! Thats a really intense setup. Do you need a de-humidifier in your house to help Battle the humidity?