Beginner looking for advice in regards to fish and plants

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first of all you sshould raise the temp to 80 or more degrees then get some of this to treat it Kordon Rid Fungus at PETCO if you cant get your hands on this i think melafix at walmart should work i used it to heal ammonia burns and it did great! good luck!!!
 
No worries Hobgob, your comments and everyone else's have not fallen on deaf ears : ). Unfortunately i cant take my fish back at this point so I'm going to have to get my hands dirty so to speak with the fish in cycle. I went out and bought my api master test kit and plan to begin my PWC.

However, I believe an evil turn of events is beginning in my tank. I believe my fish have ich. At fist i thought the white speck on my platy were sand grains from the bottom. Well, a day or two later and there are more white sand grains on my fish's fins. They also seem to be scratching themselves on the sand and plants. And from pics i have seen of ich, this looks like what they might have. I have also read this can be due to bad water quality (hits head into wall).

So, i know that there are meds for this, any recommendations on what I should get to treat them.

Also, since im pretty sure both fish have it, is there any point in isolating them? Or can i just treat the tank? After doing my water changes of course?

Any info on this would be greatly appreciated! And you all have been super helpful!


heat & salt

this was posted by another member here on AA, and allowed me to cpy & paste for future reference (thanks ChiliRelleno)

Read these articles, read the linked articles/documents in their links, the Skeptical Aquarist has some especially good links.
"Knowledge is Power" & "Know thy Enemy", read, read, read, read, read...
SkepticalAquarist article
AquariumAdvice article
Cichlid-Forum article

Lets dispel a common 'Fish Myth' right off the bat...
ICH is NOT always present in the water/fish...
It is not airborne, it doesn't travel by Spores, it will not come in via tap-water during a PWC and it does not lay dormant.
It must be introduced in some way as noted below.

If you follow through on the 'Heat & Salt Treatment' as specified, I practically guarantee the 100% eradication of ICH within your tank...
Unless you re-introduce it thru lack of quarantine/preventative treatment with new fish, unquarantined/untreated transfers of plants, decor, water or by cross contamination thru the use of equipment in multiple tanks.

'Heat & Salt', either of these treatments alone can/will kill the ICH protozoa, together they eradicate ICH very effectively and completely.
This treatment is especially safe with Oscars as they are very tolerant of both heat & salt.
Please be aware that some fish, inverts and plants may not handle heat or salt well and treatment may need to be adjusted to fit their needs.


Temperature:
Raise it slowly, but ASAP, to at least 86'f, preferably 87'-88'f.
One degree (1'f) every twelve (12) hours is the normally recommended interval for increasing heat, but in a emergency like ICH I'd raise as much as one degree (1'f)every six (6) hours.

Duration:
Hold temp for at least two weeks after the last sign of ICH.

Oxygenate:
This is extremely important because water holds less O2 at higher temperatures.
Filter outflow splash, spraybar or powerhead flow directed at surface, airstone/bubblewands are good ways to increase surface agitation.

Salt:
Salt is not required, but it is IMHO very helpful and I recommend the combination of Heat & Salt.
I recommend continuing the 'Salt treatment' for the duration of the 'Heat treatment'.
Use at your discretion.
Be aware that some Cats/Plecos (in particular Corydoras), Tetras, Loaches and etc, can have adverse reactions to salt.
Fishes that navigate by electric fields, like Elephant Noses, Knifefish, certain Eels should never be exposed to salt.
Many plants are intolerant-highly intolerant of salt.
Quote:
By raising salt levels to 2-3 ppt or 1.002-1.003 specific gravity above what one normally keeps the tank at can destroy the Ich parasites. It has a strong effect on osmosis, and dehydrates the parasite to the point the parasite can no longer function and dies. Again, raising levels slowly but not too slowly is key here; raising salt 1 ppt per day is recommended. Generally 7.6 grams of salt per gallon is equal to 2 ppt or 1.002-1.003 specific gravity . However, it?s the chloride ions which are necessary for the treatment, and different salts have different levels of chloride. It?s best to purchase a hydrometer which measures low levels of salt to ensure proper dosage.
2 weeks at those levels sure eradicate all the parasites. Again, be sure all the fish in your tank can deal with those levels of salt. On that note, most scaleless fish CAN handle these levels of salt. Plecos and Loaches especially do fine despite Internet rumors to the contrary. It has been noted some tetras and Cory's do not do well with salt, however.
Quote:
Based on everything that I’ve read to date, I would feel comfortable adding 2-3 tablespoons salt per 5 gallons if I were also using the high temperature treatment outlined above. If I were using salt alone, I would work my way up to 4-5 tablespoons per 5 gallons. We don’t want to skimp on our treatment if we hope to permanently eliminate this pest. Salt should be added slowly over the course of 24-48 hours or so (always dissolve in a small container of tank water first). Keep a close eye on your fish and perform an immediate water change if they show any additional signs of stress (beyond what the Ich is already causing).
For detailed info about salt check this out, SkepticalAquarist- Salt

Here are the conversions/measurements for dosing salt from a reliable source, see page four (4), table 3, units in parentheses.
conversions/measurements
Note; you may want to adjust your dosage +/- as desired.


Water Changes/Vacuuming SubstrateWater changes are very helpful in fighting ICH infestations.
Using a gravel vacuum, do a large water change and thorough vacuuming water on a daily basis.
This eliminates a great number of trophozoites and tomites from the water/substrate.

Other ways to combat ICH
A UVS, Ultraviolet sterilizer when properly setup will kill free-floating ICH.
A Diatom filter will capture and kill ICH too.
Micron filtration depending on the size may perform as Diatom does.


Medications:
I would only recommend the use of standard* medications as a last resort, and used in conjunction with the heat treatment at slightly lower temps, 80'-82'F, these temps will greatly speed up the life-cycle and shorten the time needed to medicate successfully.
IMO this is the last resort, a truly desperate measure for a ICH infestation gone unchecked...
I cannot recommend any of the standard* meds, use at your own risk.
Their effectiveness when used as directed is controversial, despite manufactures claims some still seem to affect a tanks bio-filter and many fish-keepers report undue stress related complications.
Many ICH meds will adversely affect/kill scaleless fishes and inverts.
Many ICH meds will also further deplete oxygen levels, take countermeasures as per above.

*A non standard med, ICH-Attack.
ICH-Attack is a 100% natural remedy that has proven anti-protozoal and anti-fungal properties.
Active ingredient is Naphtoquinone which is not known to be carcinogenic as many standard meds are.
Manufactured by Kordon, available at various retailers.
DrsFosterSmith

If you use standard meds the read this...
Quote:
Do a water change prior to starting treatment and remove the carbon from the filter media; not the entire filter. If the carbon is part of the filter cartridge, make a slit in the side of the filter media and remove the carbon.
Be aware meds will most likely destroy the nitrifying bacterial colonies. Be prepared to measure ammonia and nitrite levels, and reduce the levels if necessary, by water changes or ammonia/nitrite reducers (this is the only time you?ll see me recommend their use!). Water changes likely will affect levels of meds in the tank, and you may need to adjust doses to keep the meds at the levels needed to kill the theronts.
Once treatment is finished, you?ll need to remove the meds from the water. Best way to do this is to run fresh activated carbon in your filter for a couple of days.
** Do note, the directions on the meds are generic; if you remember from the earlier discussion ich has a life cycle with only one stage susceptible to meds. Do not follow the directions when it comes to length of dosing times as some will claim to eradicate Ich in as little as one dose. The first treatment will only kill a percentage of the parasites (remember the Ich life cycle). It?s better to continue treatment till 3 days after seeing the last white spot on your fish; this way you can be fairly sure you have eradicated all the parasites.
AquariumAdvice article
Please realize that ICH like everything else in the world has it's exceptions, however rare.
There has been cases where ICH has been able to complete its full life cycle under the fishes slimecoat/skin, rendering it for all intents untreatable.
There are cases where ICH has survived salt as high as five (5) tablespoon per five (5) gallons. (Not sure as to what this dosage equaled when measured in 'ppm' or 'specific gravity'.)
There is one (That I know of.) reported and documented case where ICH survived temps beyond 87'-88'f.
These are rare exceptions, not the norm.


These are my opinions, this is how I would treat my fish, just my $0.02...
Goodluck!

__________________
 
Thanks for the info! Ok, let me know if this process sounds ok as I am going to be working on the tank today. And of course, with new information i have some additional questions. So after each step in the process, I will add my questions. Oh and Mommytron, seems like the links you had posted arent working, it may be my computer though.

If only I found this site sooner!

Anyway here it goes:

1. First and foremost, vacuum my tank. Or should i test first then vacuum?

2. Use my API master test kit, and complete a water change.

Question: I know you dont need to let your new water sit after adding dechlorinator, but what about water temp? Should i just use slightly warm tap water and be ok to immediately add the new water to the tank?

3. After completing my water change, I should test water again.

Question: The directions say to test weekly, but i know you guys have said to do it perhaps daily while in the cycling process. If my readings are off after the initial water change, should I do another immediate water change?

4. Now, raise my water temp around 2 degrees every 6 hours to begin combating the ich. Its currently at around 76 degrees.

Question: Should I raise it higher than 82 degrees? As I said, i have a red wag platy and a balloon belly molly, are they able to survive at anything higher than 82 degrees?

Question (Several parts): a) I read what has been posted, but nothing concrete about whether I should quarantine these guys as both of my fish seem to be infected. Thoughts? Im thinking just leave them in there.

b) Another dilemma, if i do quarantine both the infected fish, what should i put them in? Should I go buy another 10 gal, with filter etc. ? Or is there a cheaper option? If they stay in the tank, will they just end up getting re-infected? If I dont even need to quarantine them, do you all recommend getting a quarantine tank eventually?

5. (Optional) Next, add some aquarium Salt to do the heat/salt combo to battle the ich.

Question: Before I ever added fish to the tank, I added two tablespoons of aquarium salt (this was around a week ago) Do you think the salt already in there will suffice once i increase the temperature? I know when I do the PWC i will have to replace the salt accordingly. I dont understand what ppt is in regards to salt.

And lastly.....lol am I screwed? I know full well that at any point in this process my fish could die although I am very much trying to prevent that. If they do, i guess it will be lesson learned :(

Never thought this thread would get so lengthy.

Anyway, you guys have been awesome and again i appreciate all the help!
 
when you are cycling a tank with fish, you should be testing at least once daily. do a major PWC if ammonia>.25 or nitrite>.5 or if nitrate>40ppm. do another test after a PWC to make sure all levels are safe.

no sense in QTing since the whole tank is no doubt infected. treat the tank with heat and salt, and make sure to vacuum (this may extend the time it will take to cycle your tank, but your priority now should be fighting the ich).

you should probably do a nice big PWC then add fresh salt. after you have fought off ich, stop using salt. no need for use other than medicating.

you ate not screwed. you ate doing the right thing :) just hang in there, you CAN do this! your hard work will pay off in the end. and if nothing else, you are learning a lot and will be better prepared for next time :)
 
Ok, so it looks like my molly and platy have survived the cycling of my tank (had them in there since early April, will never do that type of cycling again!) Also, they have survived their battle with ich (fought it off with raised temperature and salt). I have been testing my water with the API liquid test kit and it looks like my water is at safe levels across the board.

I was thinking of making some additions to my tank now. As I have said above, I have a balloon belly molly and a reg wag platy in a Top Fin 10 gal aquarium. I know that I am somewhat limited in what I can get so I wanted to see if anyone could give me some recommendations. Was hoping to get some bottom dwellers (corys maybe?) but Im open for suggestions.

Also, some snails have infiltrated my tank after I had bought some anacharis, any recommendations on how to get rid of them? Was thinking of going out and buying an assassin snail.
 
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