Death, Death, and more Death.
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coralbandit
Aquarium Advice Addict
No even with prime "neutralizing " the ammonia it will still register for a couple of days I believe.
jarrod0987
Aquarium Advice FINatic
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An API test kit will still show the Ammonia weather or not Prime "Locked" it. You are correct
I'm no expert either but I have read multiple articles stating that you can keep goldfish at 74 degree or just under and they will survive okay. Correct me if I'm wrong but during the cycling process it's better to keep my aquarium as warm as the fish will allow to promote bacterial growth from everything I've read.
To a point but your tank will still cycle anyway. But with new, young fish in a new tank all bets are off on what the fish will tolerate.
Better off imo looking after fish first, tank second. My thoughts anyways.
The main risk is that if your fish get too stressed and catch a bacterial infection, all of a sudden you have an infected tank which is still cycling. Any meds use may dent the nitrifying bacteria still trying to establish while the infection is also in the water column so buying new fish is an interesting adventure.
An API test kit will still show the Ammonia weather or not Prime "Locked" it. You are correct
That's good to know. So here's the thing. I went to Petco last night. Siri told me they closed at 8PM, however, Petco's sign on their door when I got there at 7:05pm and it said they closed at 7pm. SO, I went to the last place I knew would be open on a Sunday evening.......Wal*Mart
I was able to find some chemicals by Tetra that are supposed to neutralize chlorine and chloramines as well. I ended up buying 15 gallons of spring water and decided to setup my old 20 gallon aquarium with that until I can figure out what the heck is going on with my tap water. I'm not sure if my old water conditioner simply stopped working or what but I'm going to try to set the 40 gallon up using the tetra chemicals and see if my fish survive. My last fish died at hour 6 last night despite all of my levels being correct.I purchased a couple of small koi from Wal*Mart to put in the spring water aquarium. I used the gravel from my previous 40 gallon death tank as well and ran a water quality check.
My test strip with the spring water showed amazing quality (much as you would expect) but I was surprised to see that it picked up about 15ppm - 20ppm nitrate levels right out of the jug. I also ran an ammonia test on the aquarium to which it came back 0ppm.
So, I have two happy koi in the 20. I will drain the 40 gallon AGAIN today and set it up using the tetra product and see how it goes from there. I can monitor them closely and make sure they are okay and if something still isn't right move them back to the 20 right?
So would 68 degrees still be a good temp even for bacterial growth?
What is your room temp?
I have AC at home and my gold fish tank is always between 70-74°F. It usually does the trick for me.
Also, if you are getting ammonia right at the start of your tank, might as well let it cycle itself. I mean, isn't that what is needed to cycle a tank?
You can also try to just let your water rest a day or 2, so the chlorine gasses off before you add fishes. I'm not sure if it is the same with chloramine though.
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TMRC Exotics
Aquarium Advice Addict
Still going to have to cycle at some point which means a whole lot of water changes with 2 koi in a 20 on a fish in cycle....
ImACoolguy
Aquarium Advice Addict
I've been reading this thread and wonder.. Why the koi? Why not just fishless cycle the tank since you keep having all these fish die... Just buy a $5 bottle of ammonia, dose it, and call it a day. No more fish deaths till the matter is resolved. Simple as that.
Caleb
Caleb
Salukie
Aquarium Advice Freak
Chloramine does not "gas off". The water would have to sit for months, maybe even years before the chloramine dissapeared.
You must use a dechlorinator for chloramines.
Actually, the first time I setup my 20 gallon it was with 4 small koi. It ran fine for about a month and began building up a GREAT biological filter. I ended up using some API chemicals to boost the process and it appeared to be working. nitrate levels were rising, nitrite was lowering, and everyone was happy. Until we wanted to get some more fish. That's when I decided to move to the 40. So, the nitrogen cycle that people keep mentioning really has nothing to do with my post. I think that horse has been beat to death...over and over again... Before someone ELSE says, "yeah but the ammonia in the nitrogen cycle kills fish fast!" please actually read the entire thread to understand what it's about.
Why the koi? Because:
1 - That's what I like
2 - they will be moved to my koi pond when they reach about 6 inches which I have previously stated.
3 - That's what I want in my aquarium for now.
Is 4 koi a lot? Well, that depends on the size of the koi now doesn't it... Are 4 koi that are 2 inches in length going to produce the same amount of waste that 4 koi of 6 inches will produce? Why no, they aren't. Did I plan on keeping them all until they reached 6 inches? No, I didn't. Does my preference for koi or what I planned on doing with them in the future matter for this thread at all? No, it doesn't. Please follow along with this thread and if you would like to contribute let's stay on topic.
Yes, it will require a lot of PWC which I have said before... I don't mind the maintenance. Is there anyone else that would like to mention how much maintenance this will be? If you guys are that bored we can completely turn this thread around and just talk about the nitrogen cycle and how much work it is with fish or we can stay on topic.
We are just seeing you, trying to get your water right, but still won't give up buying fishes before you find what's wrong with your water.For all the people that ARE staying on topic:
We (at least me and Caleb) think you should at least cycle the tank before anything else.
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Clayman
Aquarium Advice Freak
I thought the topic of this thread was death of fish again and again.
Yes, I understand what you are trying to do. However, There is evidence of possible contamination somewhere due to the speed at which they begin acting strange and begin dying. Would a fishless cycle remove a foreign contamination? Would there even be a proper cycle if the aquarium is contaminated somehow? Please keep in mind these goldfish are not some little child's pet Nemo. These are the fish people use as feeders and bait to catch bigger fish which they then proceed to stuff and put up on their wall... So, if ALL my tests show the water is great, the only way to know if it really isn't contaminated after that is to put fish in... Right?
PoppaRyno
Aquarium Advice Addict
Tetra bad, prime good. Prime great. Ive been reading this, and i gotta say most are staying on topic. I worry abt the cycle for the unstable factor. So wishy washy it could be the issue if its weak stock koi. I worry abt the gravel because because you stated it was chipping the color off when rinsing. I worry abt the fish cause i cant tell if you have koi or comets. Both have been stated. I worry because i keep a koi pond as well as many fish tanks, and i agree thats an awfully sudden death. But with no other Xs and Ys, it has to be the cycle or your local water. Prime prime prime if its water. I would buy stock in prime if i could. Ive seen it save fish. If prime cant fix it then there haz to be an issue with the cycle process. Good luck and im gonna keep racking my brain abt this as its got me intrigued. Just take it easy on us, were tryin to help avoid death, death, and more death.
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Death over the course of several days due to ammonia and nitrite build up or death occurring very rapidly (starting in 30 minutes) with water that checks out great? Those two differences would lead the thread in two different directions... "fish continually dying" isn't specific enough and I believe I was a lot more clear than that in all of my posts.
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