massive "help me!" thread (all input/advice welcome)

[monsterz3ro]

Hi all-

I'm new to this forum (I already went over and made a little introduction post in the "new members" area, or whatever its called). I have been reading through the forum for the last few weeks. I haven't owned an aquarium in about a decade (my last tank was a 27 or 29 gallon, I can't remember which), and in reading through a lot of this, I realized that I apparently was getting pretty lucky with fish health, as there is a lot of care and many considerations that I was fully unaware of...thank goodness for the internet.

I received a 56 gallon "column" aquarium (slightly taller, and more square than the typical long/narrow aquarium - link), with stock lid/light fixture/bulb. I'd like to replace parts as components, little by little (if necessary) instead of upgrading all components at once. I say this with regards to the lamps spectrum (not sure what it is actually but assuming its not so great? Dunno if that info is anywhere on the link page...I'll look around). I have a (slightly underpowered?) over-the-side filter (link) that seemed to be "pushing it" but both of the sales people said it was a good filter and would be sufficient, especially with live plants (which I plan to have), and one even said that she had the same filter in the same aquarium and things were going along swimmingly. Bad pun. I purchased stress-zyme and stress-coat) to get the water at least started in the right direction. I do not have a heater (hoping that the 71ish degree air temperature will be sufficient for what I would like to do, though I have no issue purchasing a heater if needed). I have 35 lbs of medium-sized gravel (little smoothed rocks, not the painted stuff), to which I plan to add today or tomorrow another 10 lbs or so- which may be slightly less than is "recommended" but I am hoping that given the surface area, it will suffice.

So. I cleaned the inside and outside of the aquarium thoroughly, including spending a good bit of time scrubbing off wayward bits of silicon, as I was reluctant to use a razor...rinsed the whole thing, rinsed the gravel, added the gravel, filled the tank, added the appropriate "start up" proportions of the stress-zyme and stess-coat, activated the filter components and started running the filter. I have left the light on since I first filled the tank, hoping that 24/7 light might speed up the cycle process a little (read some places that this could help, and other places that this is a ridiculous notion, so...not sure...). The tank has been up and running for about 56 hours now in this configuration.

I'd like to aquascape this pretty heavily, and am hoping to find some balance between aquarium size/plants/lighting/fish that will allow me to avoid the whole Co2 management thing (though clearly I will as necessary). I have read that the light I have, and dimensions of the aquarium, may or may not be an issue (read enough from others with similar circumstances who are having no problem growing that I am going to at least give current configuration a shot before I go out and replace lighting). I'd like to add some creeping/moss type plants, though I'm not a fan of java moss (have been looking a lot at plantgeek) intermixed with some larger, vertical plants (found some interesting "flowering" plants that seem to be fine with cooler water/lower light).

Plant Q's
1. Can anyone give me any general direction to go in terms of plant selection that is attractive, diverse, low-light acceptable (if need be) and generally "low maintenance" in terms of Co2? I am aware of
java fern, anubias, and hornwort, and am not a fan of any of them. Looking for some alternatives.

2. With regards to said plants, I would like to avoid having to put air stones into the aquarium. I am embarrassed to ask this, but, is using air stones the same as adding Co2, or do these two achieve different goals? Given aquarium dimensions/set up, are there plants that can be used extensively that will not require addition of air stones?

3. Given the info above (tank with stress-coat/stress-zyme/filter running/24-7 light, for the last 56 hours), is it too soon to begin adding in plants?

Cycling Qs
1. I would like to avoid using fish to cycle the aquarium, unless there's some incredibly compelling reason to do so. I do not want to manually add ammonia. I am unsure if the stress-zyme and stress-coat are sufficient for cycling. If I am able to add plants now/soon, will this aid the cycling speed or have no effect? My goal is to finish the aquascaping first, and take my time deciding on exactly which breeds I'd like to populate with. In spite of the tank size, I will probably be targeting only 5 - 8 very small fish (small hatchetfish, perhaps), unless it is advised to add more fish to balance a heavily-planted aquarium. I have read that I should add fish food itself to the aquarium to help cycling. Is this true? When should I do so? Should I add once daily, or more? How much should I add?


Fish Qs
1. How long should I cycle this water, given the current scenario, before adding fish? I have read some varying information regarding this.



I know that there is information on most if not all of the questions I have asked here, already in the forum. However, I have seen some conflicting information, and am hoping that I can get a consolidated round-up of answers here, possibly working out some kinks in the conflicting info.

I apologize for such a huge post. I am hoping there are at least a few of you not put-off/irritated by my long, somewhat multi-topic post, that wouldn't mind spending some time helping me out.

I pre-emptive-ly appreciate any/all responses.

Thanks forum =)

 

[maxst2]

AH... well I'll be honest i didnt read thru everything. I just got to some key phases that was questioned.

Most important one being that you want to cycle this tank via a fishless method.

Step 1) get a API freshwater master kit. Its awesome and you'll always use it!

Step 2) Locate Ace Hardware store, You want to get some ammonia hydroxide. It'll be labeled as Ammonia, industrial strength cleaner or the likes.

THIS IS IMPORTANT > You want ammonia hydroxide to be the only ingredient on the bottle... get the 10% strength.

Step 3) Get a notebook/excel sheet open and get a baseline test. Following the instructions, get a ammonia,nitrite, and nitrate test done... while your at it, test the ph - while you don't really need to make your tank at X pH... you want to make it STAY at one pH. Stability is key. Fish are rather hardy and do adjust within reason.

Step 4) Since your tank is about the same gallon wise as mine I can tell you to dose ammonia in one cap full once every 24 hours. This should give you a reading of about 4ppm on your ammonia test - test it about an hour or two AFTER you dose. This will allow it to mix in with your tank.

Setting up a cycle is NOT fast. You have to be patient with this.

Keep the light off and your filter running. Personally if you have a HOB filter, get a fluval pre-filter sponge, once you start feeding and etc, it'll catch anything BEFORE it gets to the filter and clogs that up. Then all you have to worry about is to clean the pre filter. You want to keep that filter/carbon filter in that hob for a looong time. At least 3 months. This hold all your good bacteria. If it gets clogged, in dechlorinated water or water you pull out from a water change scrub it a little to clean it up. Also keep the heater on around 75-80*F

You will have to test the water every 24 hours, and if the ammonia goes down, add a cap full. It will take awhile... BUT eventually you'll see nitrItes spike and it'll stay there for awhile too. Then that'll go down pretty quick. Once in a 24 hour period your ammonia goes to 0 and your nitrites go to 0, check your nitrates. If you have 20ppm or less your good to go! Any higher do a BIG water change to knock it down to 20 or less.

My cycle took about a month and a half.

Thats it in a nutshell.. if you have questions im in the chat mostly all the time and you and PM me. Im always around... I work for datacenter so im always online lol.


Plants.. you've ruled out alot of the main and common low light plants lol. BUT you can add plants at any time. I suggest getting some root tabs for ferts. I have a cool plant called an Onion plant, it grows tall, and I planted it as a bulb...with co2, high lighting and fertilizer/supplements that thing took off so fast!

Air stones = oxygen. They are connected to an air pump which then pumps air through them and it makes pretty bubbles...which oxygenates the water.

Co2 - either via pressurized bottle or DIY method of sugar and yeast = and delivered thru a defuser = commonly an air stone or a glass defuser which is made for breaking up co2 gas into micro bubbles.

Lastly, to dechlorinate your tap water, I suggest Prime. It is AWESOME stuff. AND unless you have to dose with medications.. that is the ONLY chemical you should be putting in your water

 

[fort384]

Plant Q's
1. Can anyone give me any general direction to go in terms of plant selection that is attractive, diverse, low-light acceptable (if need be) and generally "low maintenance" in terms of Co2?

The best place to start for selection:
PlantGeek.net - Your Aquatic Plant Resource
In the plant guide, sort by lighting requirements and check out low light. The best plants to start out with are things like anubias, java fern, java moss, hornwort, etc. Check out the plantgeek website to see other low light alternatives, but these are the most common.

2. With regards to said plants, I would like to avoid having to put air stones into the aquarium. I am embarrassed to ask this, but, is using air stones the same as adding Co2, or do these two achieve different goals? Given aquarium dimensions/set up, are there plants that can be used extensively that will not require addition of air stones?

CO2 injection is a great way to give some extra umphh to you planted tank, but it isn't required until you get into the realm of high light plants. It still provides benefits to low light tanks, but it is by no means a requirement.

Adding an airstone to a tank that is not being injected with CO2 has some benefits for plants, but again, it is not required. Without injecting CO2, your tank will basically remain at equilibrium with the air.

To see the different methods and read up on CO2, check out these threads:
http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f20/1-4-diy-3-4-purchased-co2-system-136350.html

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f24/co2-help-136297.html#post1176824

CO2 injection is not the same as airstones... very different things. In fact, running airstones while you are trying to inject CO2 would be counter productive. You want the CO2 to stay in the water... airstones would help off gas it instead of keeping it in the water column.

3. Given the info above (tank with stress-coat/stress-zyme/filter running/24-7 light, for the last 56 hours), is it too soon to begin adding in plants?

Nope. You can add plants any time... in fact they may help you cycle the tank more quickly, and are great to have in there when you first add fish. The plants benefit from all forms of N in the N Cycle... ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. The only thing is, you dont want to run the light 24/7. Best to reduce that to about 10 hrs a day.

 

[BigJim]

I received a 56 gallon "column" aquarium (slightly taller, and more square than the typical long/narrow aquarium with stock lid/light fixture/bulb. - Good start. I prefer longer tanks to taller tanks because they can support more fish and they're easier to light, but it's good to start with a decent water volume.

I have a (slightly underpowered?) over-the-side filter that seemed to be "pushing it" but both of the sales people said it was a good filter and would be sufficient, especially with live plants (which I plan to have), and one even said that she had the same filter in the same aquarium and things were going along swimmingly. - If you've only got an AC20 on that tank, you're drastically underfiltered, even with plants. I'd go with a minimum of an AC70, probably an AC110.

I purchased Stress-zyme to get the water at least started in the right direction. - Don't be surprised if this doesn't work.

I do not have a heater (hoping that the 71ish degree air temperature will be sufficient for what I would like to do, though I have no issue purchasing a heater if needed). - Adding a heater is still a good idea. Tropical fish generally do better at 75-80 degrees. A few degrees makes a difference. I tried turning my tanks down to 72 to save some energy, but the fish are much happier and more active at 75, so I turned the heaters back up.

I have 35 lbs of medium-sized gravel (little smoothed rocks, not the painted stuff), to which I plan to add today or tomorrow another 10 lbs or so- which may be slightly less than is "recommended" but I am hoping that given the surface area, it will suffice. - If you want plants, aim for about 3" of gravel to support root systems.

So. I cleaned the inside and outside of the aquarium thoroughly, including spending a good bit of time scrubbing off wayward bits of silicon, as I was reluctant to use a razor...rinsed the whole thing, rinsed the gravel, added the gravel, filled the tank, added the appropriate "start up" proportions of the stress-zyme and stess-coat, activated the filter components and started running the filter. - If you haven't done so, read up on "fishless cycling" here on AA. Simply running the tank for a few days won't accomplish anything. You need an ammonia source, a water test kit, and some time.

I have left the light on since I first filled the tank, hoping that 24/7 light might speed up the cycle process a little (read some places that this could help, and other places that this is a ridiculous notion, so...not sure...). The tank has been up and running for about 56 hours now in this configuration. - If you're fishless cycling the tank correctly with ammonia, leaving the light on all day is begging for an algae bloom. If you're not cycling with ammonia, see my previous comment.

I'd like to aquascape this pretty heavily, and am hoping to find some balance between aquarium size/plants/lighting/fish that will allow me to avoid the whole Co2 management thing (though clearly I will as necessary). I have read that the light I have, and dimensions of the aquarium may or may not be an issue (read enough from others with similar circumstances who are having no problem growing that I am going to at least give current configuration a shot before I go out and replace lighting). I'd like to add some creeping/moss type plants, though I'm not a fan of java moss (have been looking a lot at plantgeek) intermixed with some larger, vertical plants (found some interesting "flowering" plants that seem to be fine with cooler water/lower light). - Stock lighting usually isn't good for much besides allowing you to see the fish, especially on a tall tank. If you're serious about plants, look at upgrading to T5HO or LED lights. If you're handy, you can retrofit your hood with LEDs or CFLs pretty easily. Lighting is usually the limiting factor for plants. Once you exceed about 2W per gallon, pressurized CO2 is pretty much necessary to prevent algae.

Plant Q's
1. Can anyone give me any general direction to go in terms of plant selection that is attractive, diverse, low-light acceptable (if need be) and generally "low maintenance" in terms of Co2? I am aware of
java fern, anubias, and hornwort, and am not a fan of any of them. Looking for some alternatives. - Vals, anacharis, and crypts can do ok in low light. There are also a variety of mosses out there. Java moss is just the most common. Other than those and your list, there's not too many low-light plants.

2. With regards to said plants, I would like to avoid having to put air stones into the aquarium. I am embarrassed to ask this, but, is using air stones the same as adding Co2, or do these two achieve different goals? Given aquarium dimensions/set up, are there plants that can be used extensively that will not require addition of air stones? - Air stones are used to add oxygen to the tank. Some of the air dissolves as it bubbles up, but mostly it's the surface agitation created by the bubbles that adds oxygen to the water. Surface agitation will actually cause CO2 in your water to off-gas, so lots of agitation is bad in a planted tank.

3. Given the info above (tank with stress-coat/stress-zyme/filter running/24-7 light, for the last 56 hours), is it too soon to begin adding in plants? - You can add plants. Live plants actually like the fishless cycle. They use the ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates as food.

Cycling Qs
1. I would like to avoid using fish to cycle the aquarium, unless there's some incredibly compelling reason to do so. I do not want to manually add ammonia. I am unsure if the stress-zyme and stress-coat are sufficient for cycling. - Beneficial bacteria need an ammonia source to survive. They feed on it. In a stocked tank, the bacteria get the ammonia from the fish waste. It's really not hard to add the ammonia. I got my ammonia from Walmart for about $1. A couple tablespoons will get your tank started and you'll have to add a tablespoon once in a while after the cycle has started, but hasn't finished.

If I am able to add plants now/soon, will this aid the cycling speed or have no effect? My goal is to finish the aquascaping first, and take my time deciding on exactly which breeds I'd like to populate with. - Adding plants really neither helps nor hinders the cycle. The plants will use some ammonia, but they don't add any beneficial bacteria.

In spite of the tank size, I will probably be targeting only 5 - 8 very small fish (small hatchetfish, perhaps), unless it is advised to add more fish to balance a heavily-planted aquarium. I have read that I should add fish food itself to the aquarium to help cycling. Is this true? When should I do so? Should I add once daily, or more? How much should I add? - Hatchets stay at the top of the tank. Consider a school of cardinal tetras and a male betta. The fish food rots and provides your ammonia. It's much cleaner and faster to just add some ammonia.


Fish Qs
1. How long should I cycle this water, given the current scenario, before adding fish? I have read some varying information regarding this. - You need to cycle the tank before adding fish. Letting it run really isn't doing much. You need an ammonia source. After you've added the ammonia, you need to test your water and monitor the ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate levels. Once your tank is capable of processing 2-4ppm of ammonia all the way to nitrate in 24 hours, your tank is cycled and ready for fish.

I know that there is information on most if not all of the questions I have asked here, already in the forum. However, I have seen some conflicting information, and am hoping that I can get a consolidated round-up of answers here, possibly working out some kinks in the conflicting info. - If you're confused by what you're reading, don't hesitate to ask a question for clarification or PM a mentor or mod.

Comments above in blue.

 

[monsterz3ro]

Thank you all for all the feedback!

I've regressed slightly and am now debating returning this aquarium with gift receipt for an acrylic tank, though I don't know that they have them in so large a format, and I'd like to keep it bigger 1. for all the obvious benefits, and 2. to give myself more of a buffer while I get acclimated to all the science involved here.

It sounds from various comments that I can add plants at-will, even during the ammonia stage of the process. Is this correct?

If I upgrade the lighting and bite the bullet (go the Co2 route) will that permit me any significant increase in latitude in terms of choice of plants?

 

[BigJim]

Big tanks are often acrylic for weight considerations.

As for your questions, yes and yes.