New 38 Gallon Fancy Goldfish Tank

[ryukins]

Need Advice on cycling and PWCs!! New 38 Gallon Fancy Goldfish Tank

Hi,

I am a new member here and hope to gain some advice from you all.

I have a new tank setup (38 gallon, 30.5x22.5x12.5) and currently have 2 baby ryukins (1.5 and 2 inches). It has been running with fish in it for 23 days now (since Dec 28).

Unfortunately I did not read about the fishless cycle until after I bought my fish. Now, I have been busy doing daily pwcs to keep my fish alive!

I would like some advice on my daily water changes. Currently my readings are:
0 ammonia
2-5ppm nitrites (I know it is high but I cannot seem to get them down even after 70% pwcs)

I am using the API freshwater test kit, but I find the nitrite test a little hard to match the colours? Any tips on this?

My fish seem to be doing ok so far even with these high nitrites (they have been this high for about 12 days already with my daily pwcs).

I don't want to stress the fish out too much by doing such large daily water changes (over 50%), so please if you have any advice it is much appreciated.

I have also added some salt to the tank to let my fish breathe a little easier and help keep them alive but I have noticed a little bit of pink around my fish's gills which could be a sign of nitrite poisoning?

Thanks in advance for your comments and advice.



Andrew

 

[HooKooDooKu]

I have found that the API liquid test kit is great for measuring low levels. But once you get to higher levels, you really can't tell what you've got (basically the level is off the scale, but based on the cards, it might look like your level is the 2nd to highest).

This is one place that I found the test strips to be superior, detecting high levels.

It is possible that you've got nitrite levels that are like 10ppm, but the liquid test might make it seem like you have only 2ppm. If you do an 80% water change, you still have a level of 2ppm (and that assumes there isn't any nitrite in your water source).

Since your ammonia levels are zero, it sounds like your tank has cycled with the 1st bacteria (ammonia to nitrite), so any ammonia getting added to the tank is quickly converted to nitrite.

I would first suggest that you test your water supply for nitrites. That way, you will at least know if that is a partial source of your nitrites. Second, if you want to confirm you have really high nitrite levels, buy a set of test strips. Third, I would suggest that you 50% pwcs every couple of hours until you can get a nitrite reading of less than 1 (assuming the nitrites in your water source are <1).

Once you've gotten the nitrite levels way down, test several times through out the day and get a feel for how fast they are rising. Then you can begin to figure out what sort of pwc schedule you will need to try to keep the levels down.

 

[jlk]

Hi,

I am a new member here and hope to gain some advice from you all.

I have a new tank setup (38 gallon, 30.5x22.5x12.5) and currently have 2 baby ryukins (1.5 and 2 inches). It has been running with fish in it for 23 days now (since Dec 28).

Unfortunately I did not read about the fishless cycle until after I bought my fish. Now, I have been busy doing daily pwcs to keep my fish alive!

I would like some advice on my daily water changes. Currently my readings are:
0 ammonia
2-5ppm nitrites (I know it is high but I cannot seem to get them down even after 70% pwcs)

I am using the API freshwater test kit, but I find the nitrite test a little hard to match the colours? Any tips on this?

My fish seem to be doing ok so far even with these high nitrites (they have been this high for about 12 days already with my daily pwcs).

I don't want to stress the fish out too much by doing such large daily water changes (over 50%), so please if you have any advice it is much appreciated.

I have also added some salt to the tank to let my fish breathe a little easier and help keep them alive but I have noticed a little bit of pink around my fish's gills which could be a sign of nitrite poisoning?

Thanks in advance for your comments and advice.



Andrew

Hi Andrew & welcome to AA!!!!! Your off to a good start but we really need to get your nitrites under control. The pink/red color on their gills is indicative of nitrite poisoning- the addition of salt & LOTS of water changes will help with this situation. Have you checked your tap water for ammonia/nitrites/nitrates? This is a good place to start so you know what you are putting in your tank.

Tip on the nitrite test- after waiting 5mins, check the color. ANY color that is not the 'baby' blue on the chart indicates the presence of nitrites. A darker blue thats not quite purple equates to a low nitrite presence (less than .25ppm). Anything purple means nitrites of .25 (or higher) & LOTS of water changes. A stronger nitrite presence is detectable by the purple having a pinkish/violet tinge to it rather than just a plain purple. Nitrites may actually be higher than 5ppm if you see the darkest purple on the chart. Hope this helps!

Do not be afraid of water changes!!! It will keep your fish healthy & alive! Your nitrite is quite high-i would start doing 50% wcs with temperature-matched conditioned water until you nitrites read below .25ppm. It will take multiple wcs. The high nitrite is way more toxic & stressful to your fish than doing the water changes & you will need to stay on top of daily testing & wcs until your tank is fully cycled. Please do not hesitate to ask questions!!!!

 

[ryukins]

I have found that the API liquid test kit is great for measuring low levels. But once you get to higher levels, you really can't tell what you've got (basically the level is off the scale, but based on the cards, it might look like your level is the 2nd to highest).

This is one place that I found the test strips to be superior, detecting high levels.

It is possible that you've got nitrite levels that are like 10ppm, but the liquid test might make it seem like you have only 2ppm. If you do an 80% water change, you still have a level of 2ppm (and that assumes there isn't any nitrite in your water source).

Since your ammonia levels are zero, it sounds like your tank has cycled with the 1st bacteria (ammonia to nitrite), so any ammonia getting added to the tank is quickly converted to nitrite.

I would first suggest that you test your water supply for nitrites. That way, you will at least know if that is a partial source of your nitrites. Second, if you want to confirm you have really high nitrite levels, buy a set of test strips. Third, I would suggest that you 50% pwcs every couple of hours until you can get a nitrite reading of less than 1 (assuming the nitrites in your water source are <1).

Once you've gotten the nitrite levels way down, test several times through out the day and get a feel for how fast they are rising. Then you can begin to figure out what sort of pwc schedule you will need to try to keep the levels down.

I have tested the water from the faucet and it reads 0 nitrites 0 nitrates 0 ammonia so it looks clean

Thanks for the advice, I will try a large water change but I am just worried it causes too much stress for my fish. I use a water changer that connects to my bathroom faucet and I try to match temperatures as closely as possible and dose enough declorinator for the whole tank. Am I doing anything wrong?

 

[Coursair]

I know Goldfish eat plants, but you might try adding Duckweed or Frogbit they are great for soaking up unwanted stuff.
Anubias tied to wood or rock may survive as it may taste bad. It is low light so should be ok.

 

[ryukins]

Hi Andrew & welcome to AA!!!!! Your off to a good start but we really need to get your nitrites under control. The pink/red color on their gills is indicative of nitrite poisoning- the addition of salt & LOTS of water changes will help with this situation. Have you checked your tap water for ammonia/nitrites/nitrates? This is a good place to start so you know what you are putting in your tank.

Tip on the nitrite test- after waiting 5mins, check the color. ANY color that is not the 'baby' blue on the chart indicates the presence of nitrites. A darker blue thats not quite purple equates to a low nitrite presence (less than .25ppm). Anything purple means nitrites of .25 (or higher) & LOTS of water changes. A stronger nitrite presence is detectable by the purple having a pinkish/violet tinge to it rather than just a plain purple. Nitrites may actually be higher than 5ppm if you see the darkest purple on the chart. Hope this helps!

Do not be afraid of water changes!!! It will keep your fish healthy & alive! Your nitrite is quite high-i would start doing 50% wcs with temperature-matched conditioned water until you nitrites read below .25ppm. It will take multiple wcs. The high nitrite is way more toxic & stressful to your fish than doing the water changes & you will need to stay on top of daily testing & wcs until your tank is fully cycled. Please do not hesitate to ask questions!!!!

This is very good advice, thanks I will do more pwcs this evening and let you guys know how it goes. I am really struggling to get it below .25ppm

I hope my tank cycles soon

 

[ryukins]

Hi Andrew & welcome to AA!!!!! Your off to a good start but we really need to get your nitrites under control. The pink/red color on their gills is indicative of nitrite poisoning- the addition of salt & LOTS of water changes will help with this situation. Have you checked your tap water for ammonia/nitrites/nitrates? This is a good place to start so you know what you are putting in your tank.

Tip on the nitrite test- after waiting 5mins, check the color. ANY color that is not the 'baby' blue on the chart indicates the presence of nitrites. A darker blue thats not quite purple equates to a low nitrite presence (less than .25ppm). Anything purple means nitrites of .25 (or higher) & LOTS of water changes. A stronger nitrite presence is detectable by the purple having a pinkish/violet tinge to it rather than just a plain purple. Nitrites may actually be higher than 5ppm if you see the darkest purple on the chart. Hope this helps!

Do not be afraid of water changes!!! It will keep your fish healthy & alive! Your nitrite is quite high-i would start doing 50% wcs with temperature-matched conditioned water until you nitrites read below .25ppm. It will take multiple wcs. The high nitrite is way more toxic & stressful to your fish than doing the water changes & you will need to stay on top of daily testing & wcs until your tank is fully cycled. Please do not hesitate to ask questions!!!!

One other question, should I do the 50% pwcs daily or multiple times in the same day to bring down the nitrites? Is there a limit to how many times I could do wcs in one day?

 

[HooKooDooKu]

Temperature matching strait from the faucet can be difficult, and it obviously puts a little more stress on the fish to add chlorinated water and a dechlorinator to the whole tank than it is to pre-treat the water ahead of time.

So if you are concerned about about large water changes (and yes, I've seen literature for certain species that suggest pwc no greater than 25%), you could try to do several small pwcs in one day.

Are you simply using a declorinator? Or are you specifically using something like PRIME. I seem to recall that PRIME is not only a dechlorinator, but that it also contains some additional additives that detoxifies nitrites.

 

[jlk]

I have tested the water from the faucet and it reads 0 nitrites 0 nitrates 0 ammonia so it looks clean

Thanks for the advice, I will try a large water change but I am just worried it causes too much stress for my fish. I use a water changer that connects to my bathroom faucet and I try to match temperatures as closely as possible and dose enough declorinator for the whole tank. Am I doing anything wrong?

You are correct!!! Keep this in mind when you think water changes are stressing your goldies- chinese/japanese breeders of goldfish (as well as many in the US) practice 100% water changes DAILY to provide optimum water quality for their fish- they dont even consider cycling a necessity. And they have been practicing the art of fancy goldfish for well over a thousand years. Not very practical though for alot of us though!

 

[HooKooDooKu]

I know Goldfish eat plants, but you might try adding Duckweed or Frogbit they are great for soaking up unwanted stuff.
Anubias tied to wood or rock may survive as it may taste bad. It is low light so should be ok.

I've read suggestions that specifically state to stay away from Duckweek (don't know about Frogbit). Duckweek can take over the top layer of the tank, and from what I have read, once it is in your tank, you can never get it all out.

 

[jlk]

One other question, should I do the 50% pwcs daily or multiple times in the same day to bring down the nitrites? Is there a limit to how many times I could do wcs in one day?

You need to get your nitrites under control for the sake of your fish. Theres no limit on the number of water changes this may take!

 

[HooKooDooKu]

You are correct!!! Keep this in mind when you think water changes are stressing your goldies- chinese/japanese breeders of goldfish (as well as many in the US) practice 100% water changes DAILY to provide optimum water quality for their fish- they dont even consider cycling a necessity. And they have been practicing the art of fancy goldfish for well over a thousand years. Not very practical though for alot of us though!

And gold fish are hardier than the species I've read about that recommend only small pwcs.

 

[ryukins]

I am currently using this conditioner from Aqueon:
Aqueon » Tap Water Conditioner | Products

Has anyone had any experience with this product?

 

[ryukins]

You guys are so quick to reply. I like this forum a lot already

 

[jlk]

And gold fish are hardier than the species I've read about that recommend only small pwcs.

This is probably the furthest thing from the truth & its probably one of the greatest misconceptions about goldfish-particularly, fancies!!!! Fancies are actually more difficult to keep than most tropical species of fish & are very suseptible to their water conditions!

 

[jlk]

I know Goldfish eat plants, but you might try adding Duckweed or Frogbit they are great for soaking up unwanted stuff.
Anubias tied to wood or rock may survive as it may taste bad. It is low light so should be ok.

Well-fed goldies do not eat plants- another misconception! I keep goldies & all of my tanks are planted. No problems here!

 

[ryukins]

You need to get your nitrites under control for the sake of your fish. Theres no limit on the number of water changes this may take!

Do you still advise multiple 50% pwcs in the same day if I am using a water changer directly from the tap? Will this cause too much stress for the fish? I am dosing the decholrinator for the whole tank since it is not possible to add it before hand.

 

[jlk]

Temperature matching strait from the faucet can be difficult, and it obviously puts a little more stress on the fish to add chlorinated water and a dechlorinator to the whole tank than it is to pre-treat the water ahead of time.

So if you are concerned about about large water changes (and yes, I've seen literature for certain species that suggest pwc no greater than 25%), you could try to do several small pwcs in one day.

Are you simply using a declorinator? Or are you specifically using something like PRIME. I seem to recall that PRIME is not only a dechlorinator, but that it also contains some additional additives that detoxifies nitrites.

With bigger tanks, pre-treating the tank with a conditioner/dechlorinator before refilling is a necessity. While pretreating indiviual buckets of water before refilling may be ideal, this is impractical when using a hose/water changer/python to refill big tanks. I would give up my big tanks if i had to do all buckets!

 

[jlk]

I am currently using this conditioner from Aqueon:
Aqueon » Tap Water Conditioner | Products

Has anyone had any experience with this product?

No personal experience with this product but it appears to work fine as a dechlorinator. You may want to consider switching to Prime or Amquel Plus which work as both dechlorinators & help to bind ammonia/nitrites/nitrates. These products do not eliminate amm/nitrite/nitrate but the convert them to less toxic forms for a period of @24-36hrs (up to 2ppm for amm/nitrite). Worth considering!

 

[jlk]

Do you still advise multiple 50% pwcs in the same day if I am using a water changer directly from the tap? Will this cause too much stress for the fish? I am dosing the decholrinator for the whole tank since it is not possible to add it before hand.

Yes! We need to get your nitrites lowered. Just add the dose of water conditioner before refilling your tank. Allow the water to sit for @10mins before restarting your filters (always turn everything off when doing wcs!). Then allow the water to circulate for atleast 15-20mins before retesting.