Newbie help!

[coralbandit]

Prime is the best and cheapest (do the math correctly).
I won't say you have too many fish or not.
I will say 2 ppm ammonia is too high and 65%water change(which yielded 50% results) is NOT enough.
You need to keep ammonia under 1ppm not get it to 1ppm.
If I sound stern know and believe I am LIGHT as many don't want ammonia over .25 for 'fish in cycling'!
Fish in cycling can be done almost regardless of stocking if you do proper water changes.
If you replace your lost fish and don't step up on water changes then don't expect different results?

 

[Witt1121]

Got it! Not stern at all, I need to hear this. I will do more changes if needed and keep those levels under .5ppm.

Let me ask, after I do what may be deemed an appropriate water change percentage to keep these levels low how long before I can retest for an accurate reading? Is it immediate?? Once I refill can I test and re-change the water if it's still high? Or is there a time frame to let the water "settle"?

Thanks again in advance, your help is appreciated-

Josh

 

[brennae]

Sometimes if the ammonia is really high you need to change the water more than once a day. Once a fish has ammonia poisoning it's very hard for them to recover from it whether the levels go down or not.

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[Witt1121]

I'll be more diligent from here on out and hopefully the Prime will help me.

 

[Witt1121]

Sometimes if the ammonia is really high you need to change the water more than once a day. Once a fish has ammonia poisoning it's very hard for them to recover from it whether the levels go down or not.

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Good to know, that is what I'm starting to see and realize.

 

[coralbandit]

It really can all be math with less testing.
You know you start at 2ppm.
You do 50% waterchange,you now have 1ppm.
Later that day(maybe only an hour) you change 50% again you would have .5ppm
Most test hours later to allow all to mix/settle.
If you can adust the temp to be correct(same as tank) then large water changes yield the best result(follow);
If you did what I said above you would have changed 100% of tank water.
If you had just changed 75% the first time (with 2ppm) then you would have got to .5 ppm quicker and with 25% less water (and labor).

 

[Witt1121]

It really can all be math with less testing.
You know you start at 2ppm.
You do 50% waterchange,you now have 1ppm.
Later that day(maybe only an hour) you change 50% again you would have .5ppm
Most test hours later to allow all to mix/settle.
If you can adust the temp to be correct(same as tank) then large water changes yield the best result(follow);
If you did what I said above you would have changed 100% of tank water.
If you had just changed 75% the first time (with 2ppm) then you would have got to .5 ppm quicker and with 25% less water (and labor).

Understood!

 

[Witt1121]

Getting out of hand!

So the fish dying are getting ridiculous. Obviously we are still in the cycling stage, but my levels have been spot on. I've tested my water 2-3 times a day and done any water changes necessary to keep ammonia below or at .25ppm and nitrates in check as well.

Saturday we had a Pictus die and the other looked sick. We brought them both back to the LFS and they exchanged both out. The new guys were buddies, energetic and fun. All day yesterday they were fine and then in the evening I did a water change of 50% to get me back down to .25ppm. As soon as the water change was complete their actions changed. They swam at the top in 1 corner the whole night. This morning one of them looked bad and sure enough he died mid day. The other guy isn't looking too good either and I'd expect him to die as well.

So needless to say I'm done replacing them until my tank has cycled. I'm just curious how I can keep water levels nearly perfect and still loose perfectly healthy fish in less than 48 hours?

 

[Witt1121]

So the fish dying are getting ridiculous. Obviously we are still in the cycling stage, but my levels have been spot on. I've tested my water 2-3 times a day and done any water changes necessary to keep ammonia below or at .25ppm and nitrates in check as well.

Saturday we had a Pictus die and the other looked sick. We brought them both back to the LFS and they exchanged both out. The new guys were buddies, energetic and fun. All day yesterday they were fine and then in the evening I did a water change of 50% to get me back down to .25ppm. As soon as the water change was complete their actions changed. They swam at the top in 1 corner the whole night. This morning one of them looked bad and sure enough he died mid day. The other guy isn't looking too good either and I'd expect him to die as well.

So needless to say I'm done replacing them until my tank has cycled. I'm just curious how I can keep water levels nearly perfect and still loose perfectly healthy fish in less than 48 hours?

And wife just confirmed 2nd Pictus is dead. I know people say fish dying from a water change is not possible or rare, but this seems to be a case. The water change seems to have stressed these guys out pretty bad because before the change they were perfect and after the change immediately went crazy and died about 16 hours later.

 

[ImACoolguy]

And wife just confirmed 2nd Pictus is dead. I know people say fish dying from a water change is not possible or rare, but this seems to be a case. The water change seems to have stressed these guys out pretty bad because before the change they were perfect and after the change immediately went crazy and died about 16 hours later.

Back in my time as a newbie I had some pictus cats and they are and rowdy as ever, next day dead. This was because I didn't know about cycling. Certain fish such as pictus cats are just more sensitive to water conditions.

Also, people don't always realize it but GH/KH/pH does play a significant role. Soft water fish can adapt to hard water pretty easily. The other way around, not so much. I don't have a full understanding yet but it has to do with how hard water has a higher mineral content and that's what those fish are use to. When you put those fish into a soft water tank, it's hard for them to adapt because of the lack of minerals normally present in their water.

I don't know the GH/KH/pH of pictus by memory but that could help solve your mystery if not from water quality from the whole cycling tank thing.


Caleb

 

[PoppaRyno]

You say you had to do a WC to get down to.25 ammo... Not good. Its the water, not the change.

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[Witt1121]

Thanks Caleb, that makes sense. I've read Pictus are durable but sensitive too. I didn't think about the pH change, but makes me feel better. I'm curious why Prime hasn't balanced out the pH enough though, or is that not a property of conditioners? Regardless, as I said before I plan to finish out the cycle with what I have left or stay alive and then restock. Luckily Pet Smart will exchange or return money, so I'll take the money and stop killing fish. Hopefully if 3-6 weeks for a cycle is true I won't have much longer.

 

[ImACoolguy]

Thanks Caleb, that makes sense. I've read Pictus are durable but sensitive too. I didn't think about the pH change, but makes me feel better. I'm curious why Prime hasn't balanced out the pH enough though, or is that not a property of conditioners? Regardless, as I said before I plan to finish out the cycle with what I have left or stay alive and then restock. Luckily Pet Smart will exchange or return money, so I'll take the money and stop killing fish. Hopefully if 3-6 weeks for a cycle is true I won't have much longer.

It's not uncommon for pH swings to happen during a cycle before it balances out.


Caleb

 

[Witt1121]

You say you had to do a WC to get down to.25 ammo... Not good. Its the water, not the change.

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Not good? I'm still cycling and to consistently be below that is not feasible. Not sure what you meant, but really can't be at zero all the time during my cycle. Everyone has told me to keep my levels at .25 or below during cycle, so that's what I'm doing.

 

[Witt1121]

It's not uncommon for pH swings to happen during a cycle before it balances out.


Caleb

I'll test my tap water for reference. Never did, but I test pH of tank each day twice and has been at 7.4 to 7.6

 

[PoppaRyno]

Not good? I'm still cycling and to consistently be below that is not feasible. Not sure what you meant, but really can't be at zero all the time during my cycle. Everyone has told me to keep my levels at .25 or below during cycle, so that's what I'm doing.

My bad. Didnt realize you were sstill cycling.

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[buffalochip]

when doing a large water change you should add the prime as soon as you start to refill the water, not wait until tank is full as this exposes fish to chlorine....

 

[Witt1121]

Okay, so curious if it seems that I have gotten to the next level of cycling? My Ammonia seems to be staying around .25ppm or just a smidge higher, but the Nitrates are rising more noticeably. Just curious if I'm progressing and if so is the same parameters of water change where I remove the % of water to keep the levels under or at .5ppm continues until the cycle is done? This evening it tested around .5-1.0ppm, so I did a 50% change to be safe.

Also, I have reason to believe there are beginning signs of ich. So after the water change I increased the heater from 78 up to around 82 and maybe more tomorrow. I also used Super Ick Cure by API, but wondered if the salt route effective and safe for what I have left:

-3 Platy
-2 Molly

I want to nip it in the butt, but not harm the fish. Let me know what you think, thanks-

Josh

 

[Witt1121]

when doing a large water change you should add the prime as soon as you start to refill the water, not wait until tank is full as this exposes fish to chlorine....

I do, I add it into my 1st 5 gallon pail fill back into the tank.

 

[brennae]

Okay, so curious if it seems that I have gotten to the next level of cycling? My Ammonia seems to be staying around .25ppm or just a smidge higher, but the Nitrates are rising more noticeably. Just curious if I'm progressing and if so is the same parameters of water change where I remove the % of water to keep the levels under or at .5ppm continues until the cycle is done? This evening it tested around .5-1.0ppm, so I did a 50% change to be safe.

Also, I have reason to believe there are beginning signs of ich. So after the water change I increased the heater from 78 up to around 82 and maybe more tomorrow. I also used Super Ick Cure by API, but wondered if the salt route effective and safe for what I have left:

-3 Platy
-2 Molly

I want to nip it in the butt, but not harm the fish. Let me know what you think, thanks-

Josh

I have been dealing with a very bad bout of ich
API Super ich cure did nothing. I've heard a product called Quick Cure of much better. Sometimes stress on the fish makes them more susceptible to ich. Some people think ich is always in the water and stress brings it out. I tend to think pet store fish get ich all the time and get sick when you get them home because they aren't in the store tanks long enough to show the symptoms. Just my opinion on ich. Oh and another med not to use is the Kordon herbal ich rid. It also does nothing.

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