PH, nitrates, and RO

[MDDad]

When we bought our house last year, our water test from our revealed that are nitrates were 13 ppm straight from the tap.

Just started cycling my 29 gallon. When I got the ammonia and, I tested the ammonia, and decided to go ahead and test everything else as well.

The pH of my water straight from the tap runs in the mid 6s, the RO water seems to run a couple tenths lower than straight up water.

We do have a neutralizer (our well water is naturally much more acid, about 5.9) but no water softener.

We only have the kitchen sink three stage RO system, not a "whole house" system.

I understand pH will increase some as the CO2 escapes over time, but my pH was 8.4 in my tank!!!! My tank was filled from "non RO" water, primarily because it would take me about four days to get enough water out of that system to fill a 29 gallon.

Yet for some reason, the tank nitrates test around 40-80 ppm and the RO water itself is around 10 ppm. This was at the beginning of cycling.

Seems that either the test is inaccurate, or my nitrates spiked in less than one year in my ground water, and the RO system also isn't working very well.

Could the API tests be wrong?

Should I go through the hassle of trying to use RO water to fill my tank?

If I do that, do you have suggestions for how to store the water? Will it get stagnant over time sitting in a bucket or barrel?

 

[coralbandit]

RO will not go stagnant...I store mine in Rubbermaid garbage cans 32 &44 g....
I would think your filters are dirty or you do not have enough pressure to allow the RO to operate properly???
Have you heard of purigen???

 

[MDDad]

Ok, if so, why the HUGE jump in nitrates?

BTW Water pressure is high.

 

[nirbhao]

When did you start this cycle? Do you have any plants? What is your decor?

 

[MDDad]

I have three Java ferns. Started yesterday. I do have Top Fin gravel from PerSmart.

I'm concern my pH is so high the bacteria won't even be able to function. Since it seems to be well over 8. Also beginning to think the culprit is the gravel, which means I'm apparently going to have to scoop out all the gravel and replace it with another type?

 

[MDDad]

Been reading around that a lot of folks found better pH using sand vs gravel.

 

[TMaier]

Gravel.... I had bought gravel labeled as 'inert'. Over time my ph was sky high and water hard as concrete.

I now use quartz pool sand or glass jelly beans. No more problems. The glass is expensive but I love the way it looks and it doesn't impact my water!


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[MDDad]

RO will not go stagnant...I store mine in Rubbermaid garbage cans 32 &44 g....
I would think your filters are dirty or you do not have enough pressure to allow the RO to operate properly???
Have you heard of purigen???

Yes, but since that destroys nitrIte as well as nitrAte, won't it kill off the BB?


Also - the one potential issue with storing the water is temperature. I'm maintaining my tank at 78F. Stored water would be several degrees colder, whereas from the tap I can usually adjust the faucet to get within a degree or two of the tank temp.

 

[MDDad]

Gravel.... I had bought gravel labeled as 'inert'. Over time my ph was sky high and water hard as concrete.

I now use quartz pool sand or glass jelly beans. No more problems. The glass is expensive but I love the way it looks and it doesn't impact my water!View attachment 290586


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Would standard sand like I'd find at PetSmart be better than the gravel at least? I can try to scoop out all the gravel tonight and replace it with sand and see what happens.

 

[TMaier]

Would standard sand like I'd find at PetSmart be better than the gravel at least? I can try to scoop out all the gravel tonight and replace it with sand and see what happens.

Standard sand is a crap shoot. You don't know what is in it. I have read that the Silicates in some of them can cause other issues. Or iron. The quartz sand was $8 for 20lbs at Ace Hardware.


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[MDDad]

Standard sand is a crap shoot. You don't know what is in it. I have read that the Silicates in some of them can cause other issues. Or iron. The quartz sand was $8 for 20lbs at Ace Hardware.



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What if it's actually labeled as "aquarium sand?"

 

[nirbhao]

Would standard sand like I'd find at PetSmart be better than the gravel at least? I can try to scoop out all the gravel tonight and replace it with sand and see what happens.

Read up on this first. I crashed my cycle by removing too much substrate at once. No good.

 

[MDDad]

Read up on this first. I crashed my cycle by removing too much substrate at once. No good.

Is it going to cycle at all at an 8 something pH?

 

[TMaier]

What if it's actually labeled as "aquarium sand?"

I don't know I was never willing to risk it.


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[nirbhao]

Is it going to cycle at all at an 8 something pH?

They'll be fine until 9!

 

[Caliban07]

A TDS meter for $10 on Amazon will validate the performance of your RO unit. The TDS should be close to 0ppm. If it's not then your RO filter membranes need replacing. If it is then your nitrate test kit is lying through its teeth. It's concerning enough that the scale goes from 40 to 80 yet we can't even distinguish which one we are looking at. Do you see where I am going with this?

The TDS meter will also give you a better idea of what's going on in your tank. If you have high TDS then you can start looking at things that may have increased it as well as the pH like the gravel but a culprit implies a crime and there is no crime here. Unless you don't want the pH that high then that's your call.

Even if everything is true and you have 40-80ppm nitrates and a ph above 8, it would be unwise to tear your tank down because of this. As long as you keep up with regular weekly water changes and have a good tank maintenance routine i.e removing dead leaves and debris, cleaning the filter regularly, you will run in to little problems with this setup.

Hope this helps [emoji846]

 

[MDDad]

I took out the gravel and put another substrate in. Looks like sand but isn't. Guy at the store said it's basically neutral and uses it in his tanks.

The pH dropped almost immediately from 8.4 to 7.2. Weird.

BTW, when doing this I checked the ammonia. It hasn't dropped yet and no nitrites have shown up, it's only been three days so I assume I didn't slow the cycling much.

As a side note, my charcoal filter (came with the aqueon), the floss is BROWN from probably the small particles of gravel etc. Should I change it NOW before it cycles further?

 

[nirbhao]

Those Aqueon cartridges are a scam. I gutted ours and put a bag of BioMax and a bag of purigen in it. It's a secondary filter, so it doesn't have a sponge or floss anymore. It just makes me crazy that people do so much to cycle their tanks and then throw all that work away.

 

[Fresh2o]

Those Aqueon cartridges are a scam. I gutted ours and put a bag of BioMax and a bag of purigen in it. It's a secondary filter, so it doesn't have a sponge or floss anymore. It just makes me crazy that people do so much to cycle their tanks and then throw all that work away.

That is the problem with cartridge style filters.
Even with the setup you described, you will want to rinse it out periodically to prevent clogging and fouling. Biological media works more effectively with water that has passed through mechanical filtration first.

 

[nirbhao]

That is the problem with cartridge style filters.
Even with the setup you described, you will want to rinse it out periodically to prevent clogging and fouling. Biological media works more effectively with water that has passed through mechanical filtration first.

I rinse it with water changes. The purigen gets gross fast.

Edit: I do not mean to derail!