Go Back   Aquarium Advice - Aquarium Forum Community > Freshwater > Freshwater & Brackish - Getting Started
Click Here to Login

Join Aquarium Advice Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on AquariumAdvice.com
 
Old 08-18-2022, 05:21 PM   #1
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Ochelata, OK
Posts: 20
pH question during cycling

Can a pH of 6.0 cause your tank to stop cycling? Tonight I am going to be ordering some crushed coral to see if it will raise my pH.

__________________
bbryant573 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2022, 05:35 PM   #2
Aquarium Advice Addict
Community Moderator
 
Aiken Drum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Derbyshire, UK
Posts: 4,177
Low pH is a sign that your carbonate hardness (KH) might be low. Its not so much the pH being low that would prevent the oxidisation of ammonia, but low KH would. Is your pH that low? Your other thread has it at 7.6.
__________________
Aiken Drum
Community Moderator
Aiken Drum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2022, 06:12 PM   #3
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Ochelata, OK
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aiken Drum View Post
Low pH is a sign that your carbonate hardness (KH) might be low. Its not so much the pH being low that would prevent the oxidisation of ammonia, but low KH would. Is your pH that low? Your other thread has it at 7.6.
The pH in my 55g long is 6.0. I have been trying to get this one to cycle since the end of June. It's at a stand still. Everyday the ammonia and nitrites stay the same. I have one Molly fish in it.
__________________
bbryant573 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2022, 06:24 PM   #4
Aquarium Advice Addict
Community Moderator
 
Aiken Drum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Derbyshire, UK
Posts: 4,177
Are you using the same water for both tanks? Whats the pH of your tap water? To measure pH of tapwater correctly it needs to be left to stand overnight so it has chance to offgas.

If you arent seeing any movement in ammonia and your pH is that low i would get some crushed coral into the filter or a piece of cuttlefish bone in the tank somewhere as you are planning.

Weird how the 2 tanks are different. Something in the tanks is causing that difference. Do you have different rocks and substrate in the 2 tanks?
__________________
Aiken Drum
Community Moderator
Aiken Drum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2022, 06:26 PM   #5
Aquarium Advice Addict
Community Moderator
 
Aiken Drum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Derbyshire, UK
Posts: 4,177
Ill add to this that 1 molly isnt going to produce enough ammonia in a 55g to cycle a tank. What is the ammonia and nitrite readings in that tank?
__________________
Aiken Drum
Community Moderator
Aiken Drum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2022, 09:01 PM   #6
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Ochelata, OK
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aiken Drum View Post
Are you using the same water for both tanks? Whats the pH of your tap water? To measure pH of tapwater correctly it needs to be left to stand overnight so it has chance to offgas.

If you arent seeing any movement in ammonia and your pH is that low i would get some crushed coral into the filter or a piece of cuttlefish bone in the tank somewhere as you are planning.

Weird how the 2 tanks are different. Something in the tanks is causing that difference. Do you have different rocks and substrate in the 2 tanks?
In the 55gallon long we have sand, lava rocks and plants.

In the 55 bow front we have gravel and I took one plant out of the 55 long and put in the bow front.
__________________
bbryant573 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2022, 12:32 PM   #7
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jul 2022
Posts: 15
I am doing a fishless cycle using SeaChem Prime and SeaChem Stability. What I've noticed that although my tap water ph is about 7, once the water has been dechlorinated with SeaChem Prime and in the aquarium, when I test the aquarium water its ph is about 6. I suspect this could be due to SeaChem Prime converting the ammonia (basic) to ammonium (acidic ) thus ph goes down. Would this be a correct assumption?
__________________
saiwong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2022, 01:34 PM   #8
Aquarium Advice Addict
Community Moderator
 
Aiken Drum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Derbyshire, UK
Posts: 4,177
Quote:
Originally Posted by saiwong View Post
I am doing a fishless cycle using SeaChem Prime and SeaChem Stability. What I've noticed that although my tap water ph is about 7, once the water has been dechlorinated with SeaChem Prime and in the aquarium, when I test the aquarium water its ph is about 6. I suspect this could be due to SeaChem Prime converting the ammonia (basic) to ammonium (acidic ) thus ph goes down. Would this be a correct assumption?
No.

Oxidisation of ammonia into nitrate will acidify water over time, but free ammonia transitioning into ammonium will have little to no effect on pH. pH lowering will cause free ammonia to transition to ammonium, it doesnt work in reverse.

A few things that might be happening.

Seachem quite readily tell you Prime will cause inaccurate water test results for a period after use.

Something in your tank is causing your pH to lower.

Or your tap water is low on CO2. When you add it into your tank the CO2 levels will increase over a period of time to an equilibrium with atmospheric CO2 and increasing CO2 will lower pH. Put a jug of water on the countertop overnight before doing your pH test on it. That will give a truer result for the pH of your tapwater.

Your tapwater is low on carbonate hardness (KH). The nitrogen cycle consumes KH and acidifies the water. Once KH is depleted your water can no longer buffer the acid and your pH will crash.
__________________
Aiken Drum
Community Moderator
Aiken Drum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2022, 02:14 PM   #9
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
Caliban07's Avatar


 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Manchester UK
Posts: 6,101
Add some dolomite powder or some JBL aquador or a USA sourced equivalent. Potassium bicarbonate will also work.

Never allow KH to deplete. Itís important for the biofilter, nearly all aquarium plants and some inverts.
__________________
Caliban07 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2022, 09:24 AM   #10
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Ochelata, OK
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caliban07 View Post
Add some dolomite powder or some JBL aquador or a USA sourced equivalent. Potassium bicarbonate will also work.

Never allow KH to deplete. Itís important for the biofilter, nearly all aquarium plants and some inverts.
Can you explain what you just said? What is dolomite powder or jbl aquador. And is potassium bicarbonate baking soda?
__________________
bbryant573 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2022, 09:29 AM   #11
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Ochelata, OK
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aiken Drum View Post
Ill add to this that 1 molly isnt going to produce enough ammonia in a 55g to cycle a tank. What is the ammonia and nitrite readings in that tank?
So I needed to add water to my tanks, so I got a 5 gallon bucket filled it up and added Prime to it and let it set while I tested the tanks. I want to get a reading before I added anything to both tanks.

Here are the results from the 55g long tank that has low pH

The nitrate looks red but it really was an orange color.Click image for larger version

Name:	20220819_181808.jpg
Views:	17
Size:	75.3 KB
ID:	323892
__________________
bbryant573 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2022, 09:46 AM   #12
Aquarium Advice Addict
Community Moderator
 
Aiken Drum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Derbyshire, UK
Posts: 4,177
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbryant573 View Post
So I needed to add water to my tanks, so I got a 5 gallon bucket filled it up and added Prime to it and let it set while I tested the tanks. I want to get a reading before I added anything to both tanks.

Here are the results from the 55g long tank that has low pH

The nitrate looks red but it really was an orange color.Attachment 323892
You need to do a water change. Probably 2 x 50% water changes a couple of hours apart. Whats been your normal water change schedule on this tank?
__________________
Aiken Drum
Community Moderator
Aiken Drum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2022, 06:46 PM   #13
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Ochelata, OK
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aiken Drum View Post
You need to do a water change. Probably 2 x 50% water changes a couple of hours apart. Whats been your normal water change schedule on this tank?


The last time I did a water change on this tank, I crashed the cycle.
__________________
bbryant573 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2022, 06:55 PM   #14
Aquarium Advice Addict
Community Moderator
 
Aiken Drum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Derbyshire, UK
Posts: 4,177
2ppm nitrite will kill your fish. You have to do water changes. Water changes shouldn't crash cycles and even if it did the health of your fish needs to be the priority.
__________________
Aiken Drum
Community Moderator
Aiken Drum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2022, 11:01 PM   #15
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Ochelata, OK
Posts: 20
Ok I tested the 55g long, the one that has the low pH and here are the water parameters. I am FINALLY seeing some major results from nitrites and nitrates. Ammonia is high though.

Click image for larger version

Name:	20220821_213047.jpg
Views:	12
Size:	65.0 KB
ID:	323898
__________________
bbryant573 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-2022, 04:14 AM   #16
Aquarium Advice Addict
Community Moderator
 
Aiken Drum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Derbyshire, UK
Posts: 4,177
Did you do the water changes?

Your other thread said you was getting some more fish. Was that for this tank? Did you get the fish?
__________________
Aiken Drum
Community Moderator
Aiken Drum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-2022, 10:12 AM   #17
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Ochelata, OK
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aiken Drum View Post
Did you do the water changes?

Your other thread said you was getting some more fish. Was that for this tank? Did you get the fish?


This is the tank that has the low pH, and I have been trying to get to cycle since June. We did get fish but they went into the other 55 gallon tank.

I did not do a water change. Just added water to this tank on Friday evening.
__________________
bbryant573 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-2022, 10:52 AM   #18
Aquarium Advice Addict
Community Moderator
 
Aiken Drum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Derbyshire, UK
Posts: 4,177
Changing water is essential for fish in cycles. From your other thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aiken Drum View Post
Your target should be to keep ammonia + nitrite combined no higher than 0.5ppm by changing water whenever your water parameters exceed this target. 0.5ppm combined is a level of waste that is sufficient for your cycle to establish but relatively safe for your fish.

If you see 0.5ppm ammonia and 0.0ppm nitrite (0.5ppm combined) then leave things be. If you see 0.5ppm ammonia and 0.25ppm nitrite (0.75ppm combined) then change 1/3 of the water. If you see 0.25ppm ammonia and 0.75ppm nitrite (1.0ppm combined) then change 1/2 the water. If water parameters get worse than these levels it may require multiple daily 50% water changes to maintain safe water conditions. This is more likely to happen with a fully stocked tank.
Without water changes waste builds up in uncycled tanks until it gets to toxic levels. So your fish need some help from you doing water changes. Both of your tanks need water changes. Topping up following evaporation isnt the same, because evaporated water doesnt take the waste with it. There are 2 parts to a water change. Removing water and waste along with it, and refilling with clean water.
__________________
Aiken Drum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-2022, 12:25 PM   #19
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Ochelata, OK
Posts: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aiken Drum View Post
Changing water is essential for fish in cycles. From your other thread.







Without water changes waste builds up in uncycled tanks until it gets to toxic levels. So your fish need some help from you doing water changes. Both of your tanks need water changes. Topping up following evaporation isnt the same, because evaporated water doesnt take the waste with it. There are 2 parts to a water change. Removing water and waste along with it, and refilling with clean water.
And I have been told that in this tank the one with the low pH not to do a water change that it will ruin and crash the cycle.
__________________
bbryant573 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-2022, 02:14 PM   #20
Aquarium Advice Addict
Community Moderator
 
Aiken Drum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Derbyshire, UK
Posts: 4,177
Presumably you have come here because your other sources werent working for you. But if you prefer to take advice off your FB groups thats entirely up to you.

Ive given you a detailed method for cycling a tank both fish in or fishless. They have worked to get peoples tanks cycled in the past. You can either use them or not.

If a water change crashes your cycle you are doing it wrong. The bacteria responsible for your cycle lives on surfaces like your substrate, the glass, decorations, but mostly in you filter media. A water change isnt removing any of this beneficial bacteria or at least none to any meaningful degree. What it will do is remove waste which will be poisoning your fish. But if the health of your fish isnt a priority then no need to change water.

Anyhows. Im not going to be able to add anything new or different to the topic so im going to duck out from your threads now. Good luck with everything.
__________________
Aiken Drum
Community Moderator
Aiken Drum is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
cycling, question

Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on AquariumAdvice.com

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
water change question during cycling? Travis32 Freshwater & Brackish - Getting Started 1 07-17-2015 11:30 PM
Filter question during cycling picture_117 Freshwater & Brackish - Getting Started 3 09-17-2011 11:29 PM
Water changes during the initial cycling. fishlips12 Saltwater & Reef - Getting Started 10 08-14-2003 02:17 PM
Small water changes during cycling?? Reefaddict Saltwater & Reef - Getting Started 12 08-12-2003 10:20 PM
Is a protien skimmer helpful during cycling? ConanTheLibraia Saltwater & Reef - Getting Started 2 08-04-2003 03:01 AM







» Photo Contest Winners







All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:01 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.