Tetra Safe Start and fishless cycle question!

[daniel2509]

Hi guys,

I have intention to re-do my cycle again since my tank was almost 2 weeks and did nothing but keeping the Ammonia stable at 3.0 or 4.0 ppm (no nitrite or nitrate). I have Ace Janitoral Strength bottle, Seachem Prime and Tetra Safe Start ready in my hand, but I think I will need to ask for couple questions and suggestions. Therefore, my cycle will be done asap!

Tank temp: 86f, Ammonia 4.0, nitrite and nitrate 0 ( tested 2 hours ago). Already added 40 ml of TSS 12 hrs before but it didn't drop at all. Prime was add 52 hours before, Pure Ammonia was 3 to 4 drops in tank every single day to keep it at 4.0 ppm. Furthermore, I've used seed material as a Sponge filter (40 hrs ago). Squeezed it until the last drop into my tank!

Questions:

1) Will TSS bacteria be killed with that high level of Ammonia?
2) Should I do a water change with prime and wait for 24 hours? If yes, then how many percent?
3) Did I overdose my tank? If no, then how long should i wait?
4) Can TSS be used with pure Ammonia bottle or better with natural ammonia sources?
5) Should I keep adding bacteria source from spong filter, which i borrow from my friend's pet store?
6) Should I start all over again? Drain my tank completely? If yes, Can u let me know the best steps to redo it?

Thanks,

 

[George9]

Hi guys,

I have intention to re-do my cycle again since my tank was almost 2 weeks and did nothing but keeping the Ammonia stable at 3.0 or 4.0 ppm (no nitrite or nitrate). I have Ace Janitoral Strength bottle, Seachem Prime and Tetra Safe Start ready in my hand, but I think I will need to ask for couple questions and suggestions. Therefore, my cycle will be done asap!

Tank temp: 86f, Ammonia 4.0, nitrite and nitrate 0 ( tested 2 hours ago). Already added 40 ml of TSS 12 hrs before but it didn't drop at all. Prime was add 52 hours before, Pure Ammonia was 3 to 4 drops in tank every single day to keep it at 4.0 ppm. Furthermore, I've used seed material as a Sponge filter (40 hrs ago). Squeezed it until the last drop into my tank!

Questions:

1) Will TSS bacteria be killed with that high level of Ammonia?
2) Should I do a water change with prime and wait for 24 hours? If yes, then how many percent?
3) Did I overdose my tank? If no, then how long should i wait?
4) Can TSS be used with pure Ammonia bottle or better with natural ammonia sources?
5) Should I keep adding bacteria source from spong filter, which i borrow from my friend's pet store?
6) Should I start all over again? Drain my tank completely? If yes, Can u let me know the best steps to redo it?

Thanks,

1. It shouldn't be killed with that high ammonia, but, it may not work since TSS is meant to be used with a fish in cycle and the ammonia slowly rises, rather than drastically rises.

2. If its been 2 weeks and no drop in ammonia or change in nitrite/nitrates, sometimes a water change helps get thing going again. I'd do 25-30%

3. Overdose with ammonia? No, 4 PPM is the recommended amount. You can't overdose on TSS.

4. It is meant to be used with fish. As In, you buy you first fish and then add the TSS. Because the ammonia slowly rises and the bacteria can take care of it. Dr Tim's One And Only is meant for fishless cycles like you're doing and people have had great results

5. Yes!! That will help tremendously. As long as the tanks aren't infected with ich.

6. You shouldn't have to. I think a water change will help the cycle jump start. It sounds like it stalled to me, but some cycles just take longer than usual.

I'd keep going. Do a water change and keep dosing TSS (it can't hurt). There's no set time frame to cycle a tank, some take a month, others take 2-3 weeks. Just keep testing.

 

[daniel2509]

1. It shouldn't be killed with that high ammonia, but, it may not work since TSS is meant to be used with a fish in cycle and the ammonia slowly rises, rather than drastically rises.

2. If its been 2 weeks and no drop in ammonia or change in nitrite/nitrates, sometimes a water change helps get thing going again. I'd do 25-30%

3. Overdose with ammonia? No, 4 PPM is the recommended amount. You can't overdose on TSS.

4. It is meant to be used with fish. As In, you buy you first fish and then add the TSS. Because the ammonia slowly rises and the bacteria can take care of it. Dr Tim's One And Only is meant for fishless cycles like you're doing and people have had great results

5. Yes!! That will help tremendously. As long as the tanks aren't infected with ich.

6. You shouldn't have to. I think a water change will help the cycle jump start. It sounds like it stalled to me, but some cycles just take longer than usual.

I'd keep going. Do a water change and keep dosing TSS (it can't hurt). There's no set time frame to cycle a tank, some take a month, others take 2-3 weeks. Just keep testing.

Ok, thanks! I just did 30% water change and put the whole TTS bottle in. This time i used API stress coat coz it won't take the ammonia out like Prime. Result of the test after wc: Ammonia 2.0 to 3.0, after put the TSS bottle in: water look cloudy. So what should i do in the next 24 hours?

 

[George9]

Ok, thanks! I just did 30% water change and put the whole TTS bottle in. This time i used API stress coat coz it won't take the ammonia out like Prime. Result of the test after wc: Ammonia 2.0 to 3.0, after put the TSS bottle in: water look cloudy. So what should i do in the next 24 hours?

I'd just leave it alone for now and test in 24 hours. Is the nitrite/nitrate still 0?

 

[daniel2509]

I'd just leave it alone for now and test in 24 hours. Is the nitrite/nitrate still 0?

Yes, still 0 for both. Btw, i just notice my water gets more clear after 30 mins. Does it mean that the bacteria already kick in and start absorbing
ammonia?

 

[George9]

Yes, still 0 for both. Btw, i just notice my water gets more clear after 30 mins. Does it mean that the bacteria already kick in and start absorbing
ammonia?

The TSS clouds the water a lot, I don't think it means it's absorbing ammonia, but just clearing on its own.

 

[daniel2509]

The TSS clouds the water a lot, I don't think it means it's absorbing ammonia, but just clearing on its own.

Hmm, 3.0 ammonia lvl in the tank will help the TTS work, won't it? Otherwise, I'll go get more juice from sponge filters from my friend's betta shop. I'm getting very impatient, George!

 

[George9]

Hmm, 3.0 ammonia lvl in the tank will help the TTS work, won't it? Otherwise, I'll go get more juice from sponge filters from my friend's betta shop. I'm getting very impatient, George!

No it might help it work, I just meant the cloudiness going away didn't necessarily mean that the TSS was removing some ammonia.

Hopefully you'll see a drop soon!!

I understand! Cycling sucks especially when it takes longer than usual. One of my tanks took 48 days to completely cycle!

 

[daniel2509]

Oh jezz! I have heard that ppl can cycle with TSS for like 7 days, some got luck in just 3 to 5 days. How possible is it? -.-

 

[George9]

Oh jezz! I have heard that ppl can cycle with TSS for like 7 days, some got luck in just 3 to 5 days. How possible is it? -.-

It's hit and miss with the bacteria in a bottle products. It works for some and not others, it depends on how the bottle was handled before you bought it.

 

[daniel2509]

It's hit and miss with the bacteria in a bottle products. It works for some and not others, it depends on how the bottle was handled before you bought it.

Well, mine are from walmart, not so sure how it was handled. I might end up getting dr.tim like your suggestion, and seems like there's no pet stores have it in stock.

 

[George9]

Well, mine are from walmart, not so sure how it was handled. I might end up getting dr.tim like your suggestion, and seems like there's no pet stores have it in stock.

It's kinda hard to find, but supposedly works well. TSS was developed by the same guy (Dr. Tim) before he left and made his own product. Give the TSS some time to work, I've had good luck with it myself.

 

[daniel2509]

It's kinda hard to find, but supposedly works well. TSS was developed by the same guy (Dr. Tim) before he left and made his own product. Give the TSS some time to work, I've had good luck with it myself.

Jezz, what could make my ammonia lvl increase again? 4.0 OMG!
Test in after 2 hours of TSS, lol

 

[George9]

What the heck!! lol you don't have any fish, right? And you didn't add ammo?

 

[daniel2509]

What the heck!! lol you don't have any fish, right? And you didn't add ammo?

I did't add any ammo at all. 30% water change with API Stress Coat + and a whole bottle of TSS in. Wait 2 hours then re-rest, i got this -.-

 

[daniel2509]

What the heck!! lol you don't have any fish, right? And you didn't add ammo?

I want to give it a try by adding 2 rosy red minnows. A lil bit brutal but this is the only option that I can speed up my cycle with TSS.
From right to left: ammonia, ph, nitrite, nitrate!

 

[George9]

With the ammonia being that high, the fish are gonna die quickly. Check in the morning and we'll go from there

 

[daniel2509]

With the ammonia being that high, the fish are gonna die quickly. Check in the morning and we'll go from there

Well, TSS brought Ammo lvl to 8.0 ppm yesterday night and this morning is 4.0. Nitrate stayed the same at 0. Btw, my 2 minnows are still alive but keep swimming up and down against the glass of my tank.

 

[George9]

Wow, still alive after 8 ppm ammo?! ! Are you sure you're testing right?

 

[daniel2509]

Wow, still alive after 8 ppm ammo?! ! Are you sure you're testing right?

Look at the left tube, lol! Those rosy red minnows are really hardcore. Btw, i just did water change since they keep swimming up and down against my glass tank. Brought the lvl down to 1 and that's what i heard when TSS works best. Now I've to wait 24 hours before dosing TSS again since i used prime. Am i doing right?