Go Back   Aquarium Advice - Aquarium Forum Community > Freshwater > Freshwater & Brackish - Getting Started
Click Here to Login

Join Aquarium Advice Today
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on AquariumAdvice.com
 
Old 08-21-2011, 11:14 PM   #1321
Aquarium Advice FINatic
 
Rhino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Cookeville, TN
Posts: 744
So question...I have been cycling my 36 gallon bowfront aquarium for about 2.5 weeks now. I was using this guide as the guidelines for my fishless cycle. Everything was going fine yesterday I tested with my api kit and had ammonia 0.25, nitrite off chart, nitrate about 120 ppm, and ph 7.5. I dosed ammo back up to 4ppm and that was it. Tonight ammo is 0.25, nitrite 0, and nitrate 140, ph seems to have gone up a little. Any ideas what is happening or what I should do??

__________________
Rhino is offline  
Old 08-21-2011, 11:25 PM   #1322
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
eco23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
Posts: 6,316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan_waite
So question...I have been cycling my 36 gallon bowfront aquarium for about 2.5 weeks now. I was using this guide as the guidelines for my fishless cycle. Everything was going fine yesterday I tested with my api kit and had ammonia 0.25, nitrite off chart, nitrate about 120 ppm, and ph 7.5. I dosed ammo back up to 4ppm and that was it. Tonight ammo is 0.25, nitrite 0, and nitrate 140, ph seems to have gone up a little. Any ideas what is happening or what I should do??
Sooo....nitrIte went from off the charts down to zero in a day? If so, cycle complete

The first thing I would do is a massive pwc. When the nitrItes suddenly drop, it takes a toll on your water. It will almost instantly consume the buffers that hold pH stable and also consume many of the nutrients in the water. Doing a big water change will restore those things and make sure everything remains stable. The fact there is still a hint of ammonia left might show the water needs refreshing.

After that you should test the bio-filter one or two more times by dosing it up to 3-4ppm of ammonia, and making sure it can drop that to zero, with zero no2 within 24 hours. Assuming that happens, time to lower the heater, make sure nitrAtes are under 20... and add fish!

Great job. Now let's just make sure it's totally stable, then head to the fish store
__________________
The (almost) Complete Guide and FAQ to Fishless Cycling
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums...ng-148283.html
Being responsible...fishless cycling defines it, fish-in requires it. Choose wisely.
eco23 is offline  
Old 08-21-2011, 11:34 PM   #1323
Aquarium Advice FINatic
 
Rhino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Cookeville, TN
Posts: 744
Thanks a lot man. I was really hoping you would respond to this. Have you ever cconsidered getting this guide published? I think you should really look into it. Thanks again for your help.
__________________
Rhino is offline  
Old 08-21-2011, 11:41 PM   #1324
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
eco23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
Posts: 6,316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan_waite
Thanks a lot man. I was really hoping you would respond to this. Have you ever cconsidered getting this guide published? I think you should really look into it. Thanks again for your help.
Thanks for the compliment. Having it published really isn't anything feasible, but I welcome you to share it with anyone and everyone you'd like. The only way fishless cycling will become a known and commonly used process is by hobbyists sharing the idea with others.

Keep us updated on your tank, and post some pics once you've got some fish in there. Enjoy
__________________
The (almost) Complete Guide and FAQ to Fishless Cycling
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums...ng-148283.html
Being responsible...fishless cycling defines it, fish-in requires it. Choose wisely.
eco23 is offline  
Old 08-22-2011, 04:32 PM   #1325
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
cebo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Hot as hXll Florida
Posts: 13
Now I've gotten test results that completely baffle me. I tested twice to be sure of the readings.
No ammonia, no nitrites, no nitrates and a big pH spike. From 7.7 to 8.8! All this in just a day? Any ideas why?
__________________
cebo is offline  
Old 08-22-2011, 04:56 PM   #1326
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
eco23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
Posts: 6,316
Quote:
Originally Posted by cebo
Now I've gotten test results that completely baffle me. I tested twice to be sure of the readings.
No ammonia, no nitrites, no nitrates and a big pH spike. From 7.7 to 8.8! All this in just a day? Any ideas why?
Umm....have you done a really big water change recently? What is the pH directly from the tap? Have I already gotten you to do that little experiment where you leave a glass of tap water sitting out overnight and see if the pH changes?
__________________
The (almost) Complete Guide and FAQ to Fishless Cycling
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums...ng-148283.html
Being responsible...fishless cycling defines it, fish-in requires it. Choose wisely.
eco23 is offline  
Old 08-22-2011, 05:23 PM   #1327
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
cebo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Hot as hXll Florida
Posts: 13
Hi eco23, my tap water pH is 7.0 and stayed that way at least overnight.
I did a 20% pwc several days ago due to very high NO2 & NO3. During the entire cycle, pH varied only slightly from 7.5 to 8.0. I brought it up using CaribSea African Cichlid Eco-complete and crushed coral. This is what has happened over the past few days:

25) Tuesday August 16 11 AM
20% PWC - 1 hour later NH3/4-0, GH-180, Kh-240, pH-7, NO2-10+, NO3-200+
Added ammonia to 4ppm (two capfuls)

26) Wednsday August 17 6PM
NH3/4-0, GH&KH will no longer be recorded, pH-8.0, NO2-5+, NO3-80
mesurable reduction in NO2 & NO3. May be due to change it testing supply changed from API 5-in-1 to API Master Test Kit Liquids. Ammonia added.

27) Thursday August 18 6:30 PM
NH/3/4-0, pH-8.0, NO2-5+, NO3-40
added ammonia

28) Friday August 19 5:30 PM
HN3/4-0, pH-7.6, NO2-5+, NO3-40
added ammonia

29) Saturday August 20 3PM
NH3/4-0.25, pH -7.6, NO2-5+, NO3-20
Added 1 capful ammonia

30) Sunday August 21
NH3/4-0, pH-7.7, NO2-0, NO3-40
do nothing today, questions results?

31) Monday August 22 3PM
NH3/4-0, pH8.8, NO2-0, NO3-0

I just can't get the "0" Nitrates and the pH spike?
__________________
cebo is offline  
Old 08-22-2011, 05:33 PM   #1328
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
eco23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
Posts: 6,316
Odd. The only way no3 is going to go down is by water changes, plants using them...and also by denitrifying bacteria (which you never notice because the nitrAtes build much faster than they will be removed).

The x factor in this whole thing is the eco-complete. I don't understand it, but it does absolutely crazy things. There's a few people having weird things happening with it where 2 days into their fishless cycle they've got no2 and no3 through the roof, then sudden fluctuations of everything including ammonia. I know eco-complete contains heterotrophic bacteria (not true nitrifying bacteria and can also cause problems in the long run by outcompeting the true nitrifiers), but the mechanisms of how that stuff works in the substrate is beyond me. I'm at the point where I'm about to put a disclaimer on the guide that says "if you're using eco-complete...please contact a respected micro-biologist for answers" haha! I seriously starting to wonder if somehow it effects the API kits in some way.

I think you've almost got to ignore this crazy stuff and just keep plowing along.
__________________
The (almost) Complete Guide and FAQ to Fishless Cycling
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums...ng-148283.html
Being responsible...fishless cycling defines it, fish-in requires it. Choose wisely.
eco23 is offline  
Old 08-22-2011, 05:41 PM   #1329
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
cebo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Hot as hXll Florida
Posts: 13
Agreed! I'll see how things go for several more days.
BTW the Eco-complete has been in the tank from day one.
__________________
cebo is offline  
Old 08-22-2011, 05:50 PM   #1330
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
eco23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
Posts: 6,316
Quote:
Originally Posted by cebo
BTW the Eco-complete has been in the tank from day one.
That's all the more reason to keep being slow and patient with the cycle. If heterotrophic bacteria is going to be responsible for the tank seeming cycled...you've definitely got to be very vigilant and make sure the tank is fully stable and won't lead to future bio-filter crashes. Heterotrophic bacteria can be short lived, and if they outcompeted the true nitrifying bacteria then it decides to die off on you...let's just say that can lead to issues.
http://www.bioconlabs.com/autoheterobac.html
http://www.americanaquariumproducts....gen_Cycle.html
__________________
The (almost) Complete Guide and FAQ to Fishless Cycling
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums...ng-148283.html
Being responsible...fishless cycling defines it, fish-in requires it. Choose wisely.
eco23 is offline  
Old 08-22-2011, 09:53 PM   #1331
Aquarium Advice FINatic
 
Rhino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Cookeville, TN
Posts: 744
Quote:
Originally Posted by eco23 View Post
Sooo....nitrIte went from off the charts down to zero in a day? If so, cycle complete

The first thing I would do is a massive pwc. When the nitrItes suddenly drop, it takes a toll on your water. It will almost instantly consume the buffers that hold pH stable and also consume many of the nutrients in the water. Doing a big water change will restore those things and make sure everything remains stable. The fact there is still a hint of ammonia left might show the water needs refreshing.

After that you should test the bio-filter one or two more times by dosing it up to 3-4ppm of ammonia, and making sure it can drop that to zero, with zero no2 within 24 hours. Assuming that happens, time to lower the heater, make sure nitrAtes are under 20... and add fish!

Great job. Now let's just make sure it's totally stable, then head to the fish store

So I dosed ammo back up last night tonight, ammo-0, nitrite-0, nitrate-30. So I call cycle complete, I think. Now my next question is what do I do until tomorrow when I go get my fish? Should I add just a hair of ammo to keep bacteria fed overnight and then do a small water change to get nitrate to go closer to 20?
__________________
Rhino is offline  
Old 08-22-2011, 09:58 PM   #1332
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
eco23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
Posts: 6,316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan_waite

So I dosed ammo back up last night tonight, ammo-0, nitrite-0, nitrate-30. So I call cycle complete, I think. Now my next question is what do I do until tomorrow when I go get my fish? Should I add just a hair of ammo to keep bacteria fed overnight and then do a small water change to get nitrate to go closer to 20?
Your call. The beneficial bacteria can go some time without ammonia before they starve. You can either add just 1ppm, or skip the ammonia and go ahead and do your water change to get nitrAtes as low as possible, then add fish tomorrow

Just remember to turn the heater down if you've got it cranked up.

Great job...I expect pictures
__________________
The (almost) Complete Guide and FAQ to Fishless Cycling
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums...ng-148283.html
Being responsible...fishless cycling defines it, fish-in requires it. Choose wisely.
eco23 is offline  
Old 08-22-2011, 10:21 PM   #1333
Aquarium Advice FINatic
 
Rhino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Cookeville, TN
Posts: 744
Quote:
Originally Posted by eco23 View Post
Your call. The beneficial bacteria can go some time without ammonia before they starve. You can either add just 1ppm, or skip the ammonia and go ahead and do your water change to get nitrAtes as low as possible, then add fish tomorrow

Just remember to turn the heater down if you've got it cranked up.

Great job...I expect pictures
Sweet deal. They can get hungry overnight Now I just have to finalize my stock. New thread in a flash lol. Thanks once more for your help. I will post pics tomorrow when I get off work.
__________________
Rhino is offline  
Old 08-25-2011, 10:19 AM   #1334
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: TN
Posts: 14
Hi, I am looking for some advice here. I have tried reading through this thread for already asked questions that fit mine, but there are now sooo many pages after about 50 of them I kinda gave up. So, sorry if you have already helped someone with the same issue.

I am following your guide for fishless cycling. It has been 4 weeks. Last week, my Nitrates looked to me like they were off the chart, as was the nirtite so I performed about 60% water change. It's been a week, and my nitrite is holding steady at about 5ppm, and the nirtrate is about the same. Ammonia the last 2 days or so is completely gone after 24 hours. So I am dosing each night, checking nitrites each morning and nitrates only every few days, since the nitrites haven't budged in the readings. What did I do? Could I have goofed the nitrate test and PWC too early? I can't figure out how it was so high to not moving for a week. My PH is 7.8, in the tank and straight from my tap so there is nothing with that. I have the temp about 84, and its a 10 gallon, so I have the Aqua clear 20 running, no charcoal with an extra filter sponge instead. I used gravel from my larger tank to help, but it doesn't seem like it did. Though I only used 2 handfuls of it and wrapped it in tulle cause I had no panty hose. (Odd for a girl, I know).

\Have I just been bitten with the impatience bug, or did I do something to stall? What can I do for it now? Also, I am using straight ammonia, and yes its the right kind... took forever to find. Blue ribbon and the bottle was opened from the store using it... Gotta love mom and pop shops. I was just happy to find it! Thanks for any help anyone!!!
__________________
tlyons01 is offline  
Old 08-25-2011, 10:34 AM   #1335
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
eco23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
Posts: 6,316
Quote:
Originally Posted by tlyons01
Hi, I am looking for some advice here. I have tried reading through this thread for already asked questions that fit mine, but there are now sooo many pages after about 50 of them I kinda gave up. So, sorry if you have already helped someone with the same issue.

I am following your guide for fishless cycling. It has been 4 weeks. Last week, my Nitrates looked to me like they were off the chart, as was the nirtite so I performed about 60% water change. It's been a week, and my nitrite is holding steady at about 5ppm, and the nirtrate is about the same. Ammonia the last 2 days or so is completely gone after 24 hours. So I am dosing each night, checking nitrites each morning and nitrates only every few days, since the nitrites haven't budged in the readings. What did I do? Could I have goofed the nitrate test and PWC too early? I can't figure out how it was so high to not moving for a week. My PH is 7.8, in the tank and straight from my tap so there is nothing with that. I have the temp about 84, and its a 10 gallon, so I have the Aqua clear 20 running, no charcoal with an extra filter sponge instead. I used gravel from my larger tank to help, but it doesn't seem like it did. Though I only used 2 handfuls of it and wrapped it in tulle cause I had no panty hose. (Odd for a girl, I know).

\Have I just been bitten with the impatience bug, or did I do something to stall? What can I do for it now? Also, I am using straight ammonia, and yes its the right kind... took forever to find. Blue ribbon and the bottle was opened from the store using it... Gotta love mom and pop shops. I was just happy to find it! Thanks for any help anyone!!!
Honestly it seems like you're right on schedule . 4-5 weeks is about the norm for a fishless cycle. I'd be expecting that within the next few days you'll see the no2 drop significantly. If you'd like to try a little trick to possibly shave off a day or two, do an absolutely massive pwc...I'm talking down to the gravel. This will completely refresh your water, and also bring the no2 well within readable levels. After that, you can try adding only 1ppm of ammonia for the next few days. This can give the no2 > no3 bacteria a chance to catch up without being overwhelmed. I wouldn't keep the ammonia at 1ppm for more than 3-4 days though because we don't want the bacteria to start adjusting to the lower level.

I use the Blue Ribbon brand too...that's some weak stuff, lol. It took me almost 300 drops to get to 4ppm, but it's definitely the right kind
__________________
The (almost) Complete Guide and FAQ to Fishless Cycling
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums...ng-148283.html
Being responsible...fishless cycling defines it, fish-in requires it. Choose wisely.
eco23 is offline  
Old 08-25-2011, 10:50 AM   #1336
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: TN
Posts: 14
Ok. Looks like I have some work to do today! Glad for it though, it'll be a nice distraction. I dose about 1 tsp into the tank each day, using a dropper I have no idea how many drops that would be. Glad I am not the only one that thought it took alot of ammonia the first time I added it into the tank. I read drops should be used, but I was like its more than one tsp which seemed like a lot. At least its the right stuff. Thanks for the quick response, it is much appreciated. Have a great day!!
__________________
tlyons01 is offline  
Old 08-25-2011, 12:35 PM   #1337
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Ozydego's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 187
Interesting, the ammonia I got was super weak as well, 25 drops... .25ppm, 25 more, .5ppm, 28 more CC's (which are 25 drops each, BTW) then I got it up there... few tests trying to get that one right, but now I know... I am about a week in and I just am seeing my ammonia drop from 4 to 2 in the last 2 days
__________________
Ozydego is offline  
Old 08-25-2011, 12:54 PM   #1338
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
eco23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
Posts: 6,316
Sounds like you're off to a good start.

It was funny the first time I added the Blue Ribbon brand in. I put in about 15 drops, waited, and when I tested it was still zero. After almost 300 I finally got there. I had mine in a squeeze bottle, and by the end I was just squirting a bunch in there instead of adding drops, lol.

One thing to keep in mind for others, sometimes very weak ammonia is a sign of it not being pure. The Blue Ribbon brand is fine, but if you're having to add a ton of ammonia to dose it up, make sure you read the label very carefully and make sure there are no other additives.
__________________
The (almost) Complete Guide and FAQ to Fishless Cycling
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums...ng-148283.html
Being responsible...fishless cycling defines it, fish-in requires it. Choose wisely.
eco23 is offline  
Old 08-25-2011, 03:01 PM   #1339
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: TN
Posts: 14
that made me laugh. I think mine may have gotten weakened due to the age of the bottle. Who knows when it was made, but the bottle looked like it had been on that shelf for 10 years. And since they opened it and used some, I am betting that I am right about the age of it. Couldn't tell you how long ago it was opened either. I am sure that had a lot to do with it. Though when you open that bottle, it does NOT smell weak at all. No sir-ee...Cleans out your sinuses
__________________
tlyons01 is offline  
Old 08-25-2011, 03:33 PM   #1340
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Ozydego's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 187
One cool thing I learned was to shake the bottle before buying it, if the bubbles disappear instantly, it is most likely pure, if it foams, then stuff has been added and you should put it back... very helpful in easing my mind about the one I am using....
__________________
Ozydego is offline  
Closed Thread

Tags
cycling, fishless, fishless cycling, guide

Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on AquariumAdvice.com

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Fishless Cycle Complete so soon? GouramiFanatic Freshwater & Brackish - Getting Started 11 12-23-2008 08:05 PM
Fishless Cycle complete!!!!! EmptyH Freshwater & Brackish - Coldwater, Native Fish & Ponds 6 03-25-2006 06:30 PM
Complete buyers guide for freshwater aquarium by YOU manooosie Freshwater & Brackish - General Discussion 18 08-15-2005 10:56 AM
Question about the guide for the fishless cycle Mananhammer Freshwater & Brackish - Getting Started 1 06-29-2005 09:48 PM
Fishless cycle complete! russrimm Freshwater & Brackish - Getting Started 5 08-29-2004 11:07 PM







» Photo Contest Winners







All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:48 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.