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Old 04-18-2011, 03:17 PM   #141
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One more question I'm not sure of Eco. I have plants as I'm starting my cycle and I want to add Seachem's Flourish Excel. Any thoughts on what this will do to my cycle progressing at a reasonable rate?

Day2 testing
Ammo 4ppm
no2 0ppm
no3 0-10ppm
pH 8.0
Temp 78

The trace of no3 may be due to my substrate (2.5" PFS over thin layer of Laterite on <1" of peat as base), the tannin free DW or plants that came from existing DT.

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Old 04-18-2011, 03:52 PM   #142
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One more question I'm not sure of Eco. I have plants as I'm starting my cycle and I want to add Seachem's Flourish Excel. Any thoughts on what this will do to my cycle progressing at a reasonable rate?

Day2 testing
Ammo 4ppm
no2 0ppm
no3 0-10ppm
pH 8.0
Temp 78

The trace of no3 may be due to my substrate (2.5" PFS over thin layer of Laterite on <1" of peat as base), the tannin free DW or plants that came from existing DT.
Sorry Mr Limpet, I really have no experience cycling with plants or the chems used to help support them. I know some people recommend against using plants during a cycle since they can cause some skewed test results. That said, obviously tons of people do and it works out fine. I guess if the plants can get by without the additives during the cycle that's probably the safer thing to do, but without researching the ingredients I can't tell you if it would help or hurt.
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Old 04-18-2011, 06:23 PM   #143
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Sorry Mr Limpet, I really have no experience cycling with plants or the chems used to help support them. I know some people recommend against using plants during a cycle since they can cause some skewed test results. That said, obviously tons of people do and it works out fine. I guess if the plants can get by without the additives during the cycle that's probably the safer thing to do, but without researching the ingredients I can't tell you if it would help or hurt.
No worries, just though I'd ask before I put some in.

Just to note:

The DW isn't dropping the pH, it's actually gone up .2 (7.8->8.0) in 24hrs.

I added 1/3 recommended dosing of F/E just to get some food to the plants .
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Old 04-19-2011, 03:37 AM   #144
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Probably doesn't have much in the way of tannins in it then. Not all driftwood does. Sometimes it is so bleached there is nothing left to leach out of it.
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Old 04-20-2011, 09:06 AM   #145
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Hi all,

So it's been a week now since my readings have changed. I dose ammonia up to 4.0 and within 24 hours, back down to 0. My Nitrites are still 5.0+ and Nitrates are at 5ppm.

I have an issue with water clarity (yellowish tint), so I decided to do a 50% pwc. I have two pieces of DW that came with the tank when I bought it. They were previously used, so would think that tannins weren't the cause... still not sure what the issue is there.

Anyway... after doing the 50% pwc, I was expecting my Nitrites to be readable, but they are still off the charts at 5.0+ and the Nitrates were still at 5.

I tested my tap water just to make sure and nitrites were at 0.

Since my tank began convering ammonia so quickly, I was expecting to see some sort of change at this point, but the readings have been identical for the past week. I dose the tank up to 4.0+ ammonia each night.

Should I just hurry up and wait at this point?

Thanks,

The impatient one
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Old 04-20-2011, 09:58 AM   #146
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Originally Posted by Mog
Hi all,

So it's been a week now since my readings have changed. I dose ammonia up to 4.0 and within 24 hours, back down to 0. My Nitrites are still 5.0+ and Nitrates are at 5ppm.

I have an issue with water clarity (yellowish tint), so I decided to do a 50% pwc. I have two pieces of DW that came with the tank when I bought it. They were previously used, so would think that tannins weren't the cause... still not sure what the issue is there.

Anyway... after doing the 50% pwc, I was expecting my Nitrites to be readable, but they are still off the charts at 5.0+ and the Nitrates were still at 5.

I tested my tap water just to make sure and nitrites were at 0.

Since my tank began convering ammonia so quickly, I was expecting to see some sort of change at this point, but the readings have been identical for the past week. I dose the tank up to 4.0+ ammonia each night.

Should I just hurry up and wait at this point?

Thanks,

The impatient one
Hi Mog, it's a tiny bit odd, but not unheard of that the pwc didn't bring your levels to a reasonable range. If your first stage bacteria is chewing through 4ppm every 24 hours it's going to continually produce massive amounts of nitrItes and nitrAtes. I'm trying to think of a family friendly way to compare this.....if you fed your dog 10lbs of food every night...he's gonna be spending a lot of time in the back yard the next day. Get it?

Here's what I would do, since you just did the pwc give it around a week to see if it drops on it's own. If not, do either a large or back to back pwc's to get the nitrItes ~ 3ppm. One thing people don't know (or don't agree with) is that many times a cycle is complete but that fact is hidden by super high readings of nitrItes and nitrAtes.

Remember that the 4ppm of ammo method is designed to be overkill. The amount of fish it would take to produce 4ppm a day would be criminally overstocked. Most likely your biofilter is capable of handling a small steady stream of ammo that fish produce, but this guide is made to build you a biofilter that is capable of handling whatever you initially throw at it. I think of it as preparing your swimming pool to stock a whale.

Shoot me a PM in around a week and I'll walk you through what we'll do. It's nothing crazy, but I don't want people who are new to read this answer and think it's okay to just do a massive pwc at this point and add fish...it's not. We'll get levels down and do a bit of testing.

As for the yellow in the water. If you're not running carbon now (as I suggest most people don't), once the cycle is complete you can throw some in to see if it clears up. Worse case scenario, check your ammo bottle and make sure it's pure (no dyes, etc...). Let's hope it's pure.
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:13 PM   #147
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Hey quick question about pure ammonia. I bought what I hope is pure ammo like you said and I'm hopinh u can confirm... I got Clear ammonia made by austins from busy beaver. Do u know if this is correct?.... I have never used pure ammo. Before to cycle my tanks so therefore I have never bought ammonia before..... the active ingredient is ammonium hydroxide and it contains no phosphorus... is this the correct stuff.. thanks again for ur help and I hope u had a great b day
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:19 PM   #148
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Look at the ingredients list. If it says there's more than ammonia, it's the wrong type.
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:22 PM   #149
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Ammonium hydroxide is the onmy ingredient...is ammonium HYDROXIDE pure ammonia?
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:24 PM   #150
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I'm pretty sure that's the right stuff.
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:24 PM   #151
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A quick google search showed me a clear liquid and a blue one. Obviously the blue is no good. We normally want to see it say "no dyes, no additives, no perfumes, no surfactants, etc...". But the one I used which was Blue Ribbon just said the same thing yours did. Shake the living heck out if it, and if it suds...run away. A couple air bubbles is okay to see.
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:25 PM   #152
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Smelling lemony or floral would also be a bad sign, lol.
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:28 PM   #153
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And yeah, ammonium hydroxide just means ammonia. Actual ammo is a gas, and they bubble it through distiller water to bottle it.
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:32 PM   #154
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And thanks for the B-day wishes. I'm 31 now, so birthdays basically consist of going to work, then going out to dinner, lol.
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:34 PM   #155
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And praying the next birthday would reverse your age? Oh wait, that's only what girls do isn't it?
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Old 04-20-2011, 07:56 PM   #156
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Finally!!!! finally!!!...let the gods know this, my ammonia has finally budged and its now at 3ppm, im soo drinking a bottle of harp tonight, my semi-patience has paid off lol
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Old 04-20-2011, 08:04 PM   #157
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Finally!!!! finally!!!...let the gods know this, my ammonia has finally bunged and its at 3ppm, im soo drinking a bottle of harp tonight, my semi-patience has paid off lol
People think I'm crazy, but I told you it was exciting to fishless cycle. You start treating the bacteria like little pets. You can let it drop to about 1ppm then dose back up to 4. It's fine to dose it back up now, but if you wait, you can see how fast it drops compared to a week from now. Good job.
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Old 04-20-2011, 08:06 PM   #158
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Also, I'm glad one of us is happy. Watching Barca lose to Madrid has hampered my mood significantly.
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Old 04-20-2011, 08:30 PM   #159
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Couldn't of done it without you eco, even though thinking about it, it seems real easy now to do. Thanks brah lol. I know its off topic but Barca losing, hope this doesn't effect them going into the Champions league semis against Madrid lol
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Old 04-20-2011, 09:53 PM   #160
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Just a quick question, if I am going to have live plants do I want to put them in before or after the fishless cycle? Hoping to get this started in the next week or two.
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