2 of 3 tinfoil barbs die...

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Grouch

Aquarium Advice Newbie
Joined
Feb 23, 2004
Messages
8
Location
Nebraska
Hey all. Had a very unusual experience last night. Two of the three barbs I have in with two tiger oscars and a pleco went belly up. They were about 3 inches. The third one is perfectly fine, other than being a little freaked out because his two buddies are gone. H2O params are 0, 0, and 10. In fact they died about 2 hours after I performed a partial H20 change. The only thing I can think of that has been different is about a week ago, I quit feeding them flake to use up the rest of some baby Hikari pellets that were for the Os. Is it possible they got greedy and ate too much causing some internal problems due to the pellets expanding? I am clueless. Any input is appreciated. Gonna stop by the pet store today and grab a couple more buddies.

Thanks,
Grouch
 
I use StressCoat at 1/2 teaspoon in every 5 gallon bucketful. I have never tested the treated water, assuming the product was doing what it was supposed to. It seems odd that the rest of the critters wouldn't have been affected if the SC wasn't doing its job, and there was a problem with the tap water itself. This tank has been up and running for about 2 months now, and I have always used the same tap.
 
yes, you're doing things fine. This is the only obvious thing I could see. There could have been a sudden problem with the tap water. That can happen unfortunately. If the fishes died from stress due to a heavy difference in water parameters (and I insist that it may well be not the solution), some fishes are more resistant than others. Sorry for your loss.
 
Thanks for the input, astroguy. It sucks that it happened, but what can you do? I guess the food theory I had is out the window, which I hoped nobody was going to reply, "Yep, that was the problem. Food overload." Any suggestions on what to do to monitor tap?
 
Is the tank completely cycled?

Do the other fish look like they are under any stress at all (i.e. even slight increase in breathing rate)?

Have you tested PH?

New food being eaten??? Are you adding too much food?

The loss is very suspicious and I'd say even more so considering that T.Barbs are very, very Hardy. My suggestion is not to take this in stride too quickly. I.e. I would continue checking things very closely otherwise you may get another morning surprise.

A quick spike in ammonia at high PH could easily do this. For example - new water is added which spikes the PH, combine this with new food some of which is not eaten after several large offerings, things rot, ammonia spikes, the bio-system in the filter can not respond fast enough and since the PH is temporarily raised due to higher PH tap water (and perhaps poor buffering) - the toxicity of the Ammonia is high - poof - dead fish.

Possible scenario. More so an example to consider what can happen and to be vigilant until things are back to normal.

Tom
 
That's rough... I lost a tinfoil barb this weekend, but he was the smallest and I'm fairly certain he got lost in my large Oscar's mouth :cry:

What % of water did you change? I'm not a big fan of stress coat for water changes, but it's much better than nothing. I use a different product that just clears the chlorine, but can't remember the name right now. I don't think it's the food, only thing that comes to mind is if you changed a high % of the water.

What about the temperature of the water you put in? If it was way off it could've stressed them.
 
Any suggestions on what to do to monitor tap?
If the tank isn't too big, you could treat the tap water in a bucket you use for fish only. Let it sit overnight with the StressCoat. Sorry for your losses, but I can't think of anything else.
 
Wow! Thanks for the responses!

To sum it all up...

-I did a 50% water change to bring down nitrates from 20 to 10
-tank has been fully cycled for over a month now
-temp of new water was within 1* of tank water
-no signs of stress from other fish, but now that you mention it, I did notice 2 of the barbs (probably the ones that died) breathing a little heavier after the water change. Hmmmm...
-have never tested pH
-food gets eaten immediately. I never leave leftovers sit. That is one of the reasons I wanted to get away from flake.

I have done water changes every weekend for a while now. The one thing that stands out is I changed 20 gallons instead of the usual 15. Isn't StressCoat and the like an instant chlorine/chloramine remover?

Thanks again, folks...
 
Yep - stress coat will almost immediately nuetralize cholorine.

Based on your response I'd be very wary of the PH factor. PH, especially large shifts can stress fish quickly and can even kill them in a few hours. There is no question about that.

What can happen is that if your tank is established it may have been slightly acidic - (due to the type and size of fish this is a likelihood) but your tap may be alkaline. Let's assume that your tank was running at 6.5 (good for the fish you have) and your tap is running at 8.5. Each single digit change in PH is 10 times more acidic or alkaline depending on the direction of the change. So in your case from 6.5 to 8.5 that is a huge change and if you changed 50% of the water this may have caused a jump from 6.5 to as much as 8 or even right up to 8.5 temporarily depending on the buffering capacity of your water.

I'd recommend you get a PH test kit (invest in a good one and macke sure it is suitable for fresh not saltwater and test both your tap and your tank).

The oppisite could have happened as well, i.e. your tank had a high PH, the fish got used to it and your tap has a very low PH and your water change caused a "PH crash", used up all of the buffering and the PH dropped quickly and drastically. In this case ammonia poisoning would not likely be part of the equation.

Most fish will tolerate a large variety of ph levels but they do not like fast changes.

Also recall that Ammonia is much more toxic at higher PH levels (this is because the free hydorxyl Ions combine with the less toxic Ammonia producing more toxic Ammonium). This is why Ammonia levels are considerably more critical in SW tanks which run at higher PH levels.

Anyway HTH.

Tom
 
Makes perfect sense, Tom! I am going to grab a pH test kit when I pick up a couple more barbs this afternoon. I think the loner is stressing a little without some friends and a couple of TOs swimming about. :D

Thanks to all!
 
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