Do my goldies have ich?

[MurfQ]

My goldies are getting these little white spots just on their fins and tails. Three of the four have them. It started with just one, the sickliest of my fish who also has a large tumor, but is now on two of the others (to a lesser degree). What's really weird is everything I've read on ich says it has to be introduced into your tank from an outside source like a new fish or plant or tank water from another tank. But, up until I recently moved them to their new home with a couple of new plants (this was long after the appearance of the spots) they lived in a tank that had no new fish or plants or anything introduced into it for well over a year. I'm posting a couple of pics and would really appreciate it if someone more experienced could let me know if this is ich or something else and what I should do about it.

Also, while I'm here, you'll notice that flash (the mostly white one in the last pic) has a whitish looking spot in the middle of his eye. While this is somewhat exagerated here due to the reflection from the camera flash, it really does look white in his eyes unlike any of the other fish. It's been like this for a long time. In fact, I think I first noticed it quite a while back when I had serious ph problems in my tank and almost lost him (seriously I went so far as to attempt to net him once because I was sure he was dead). Is this whitish eye normal or is it something I should be concerned about?

 

[DepotFish]

It almost looks like ich and flexibactor, a bacterial infection. I'd treat for both to be on the safe side. Any fungicide will kill the bacteria. Do you have plants that would be sensitive to salt? With either problem you DO want to treat the tank rather than using a hospital tank. http://www.goldfishparadise.com/forum/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=26596#26596

 

[Ichthyologist]

I see no signs of Ich.

 

[Devilishturtles]

Is this whitish eye normal or is it something I should be concerned about?

No, not normal. How often do you do water changes? What are the parameters (pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, etc.)? What size tank?

Cloudy eye is mainly a stress/poor water quality issue. Sometimes infection.

Whether it's ich or not, I can't tell from the pictures.

 

[MurfQ]

I typically do water changes once a week but sometimes more here lately as the conditions deem it necessary. They are in a 25 gallon but they were in a 10 gallon up until about 3 weeks ago. At last check the readings were ammonia around 0.3, nitrite 0.1 and nitrate around 10. I'm currently running the new HOB that came with my new tank along with the old smaller one from the 10 gallon until I'm fully cycled. I had hoped to avoid the cycle all together by using the old filter, but I am expreiencing somewhat of a mini-cycle likely due to the fact that I kept my old tank ammonia free through the use of an ammonia remover insert in my filter along with a zeocarb one. I never monitored nitrite and nitrate levels in the old tank. I only recently learned of those since I bought the new tank and found this forum.

The cloudy eye that Flash is experiencing, first appeared several months ago (might have been a year or more, I'm not so good with lengths of time) when my tank experienced a serious ph crash (it was at or below 4.5 as which was the lowest reading of the test kit I bought). I lost one fish at that time and was certain that I would lose Flash as well, but he pulled through. The cloudy eye never did clear up though. In the meantime, I can't say for sure that his water conditions have been ideal since then. Only that I kept ammonia at zero (using the inserts mentioned before) and that I did solve the ph problem (which turned out to really be a kh problem) and it has since remained consistent at around 7.5/7.6 (which I've read is great for goldfish). Like I said before I wasn't checking nitrites or nitrates. Should I assume it is an infection because it's been that way for so long and treat it somehow? Or should I wait and see if it clears up now that I'm monitoring water parameters properly?

Do you think I should assume the worst and treat my tank for ich, or wait and see what happens there? I was thinking I would try the salt treatment? Obviously, the high temp treatment is out of the question it being goldfish. Would the salt add unnecessary stress to the fish if it turns out to not be a parasite and just water quality issues? Also, I forgot to mention that one of my fish has very obvious red veins running through his tail. I've read that can be either stress related or parasite related. I'm just not sure what the best move is...

 

[jsoong]

You are having a mini-cycle & that is stressing the fish, likely the cause of your symptoms.

From the pics, hard to tell if it is ich .... might be other infections or lymphocystis.

First, make sure your water parameter is pristine ... it might mean daily pwc.

Salt is a good idea ... that is usually the first thing I reach for in an unknown sickness. It is good for ich & many parasites, and even surface columnaris. If you increase the salt to 0.3% over 24-48 hrs, there should be minimal stress. However, not all ich will be susceptible to low level of salt .... You might have to go with salt baths of 1-3% if you have a resistent strain.

At any rate, low salt level is well tolerated by golds, and it is protective of nitrite posioning.

I wouldn't treat the cloudy eye if it is over a year old. The fish prob had popeye or some other infection that he had recovered but is now left with blindness in that eye.

 

[MurfQ]

If you increase the salt to 0.3% over 24-48 hrs, there should be minimal stress.

To do that, do I have to go out and buy some sort of device for reading the salt levels? Or is there some sort of amount per gallon formula that I can safely use?

 

[jsoong]

No, the salt meters sold for SW tanks are not calibrated for this level. It is possible to recalibrate such a refractometer to read in the 0.3% range, but it is not necessary.

I dose the salt based on weight. 0.3% means 0.3 g of salt per 100 ml water (or 3 g per liter, or 11.3 g per gal). Note 1 oz is about 28 g.

It is best to weigh the salt to be added. But if you don't have a scale, 1 Tablespoon of Coarse salt is about 10 g, 1 Tablespoon of Fine salt is 12.5 g. 0.3% salt is approximate 1 Tablespoon (= 3 teaspoons) per gal of coarse salt, or 2 3/4 Teaspoons fine salt per gal . I usually give 1/3 of the dose every 12 hr. when salting the tank.

Note you should use aquarium salt (or kosher salt) rather than table salt for your fish.

 

[MurfQ]

Awesome. I already bought some aquarium salt, so I'll move my plants out and start that tonight. Thanks so much for the help.