Go Back   Aquarium Advice - Aquarium Forum Community > Freshwater > Freshwater & Brackish - Unhealthy Fish
Click Here to Login

Join Aquarium Advice Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on AquariumAdvice.com
 
Old 04-12-2004, 05:13 PM   #1
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Arlington Virginia USA
Posts: 134
How not to stress fish

New 55gal with scattered plants. One week after adding 10 neons 6 of them died. One is in critical condition and soon will die, I think. The dead fish had had ICH, some had rot fins/tails and losing scales. I'm afraid very soon I'll be looking at an empty tank again.

THE QUESTION: What are the DOs and DON'Ts in general to avoid stressing fish, and in specific tetras?

Thanks!
__________________

__________________
mikemou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2004, 05:26 PM   #2
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Nebraska, USA
Posts: 6,703
Mike,

You're biggest problem is actually something we call Neon Tetra Disease...at least it sounds that way. It seems like a very un-hardy strain of neon tetra are being sold in certain areas right now. Fish that act healthy one day will be dead the next. What's worse is that it seems it's some kind of true infection, and when the other neons eat the dead carcass, they become infected.

Most tetra are hard, and won't keel over that easily. I have a black neon that's got some kind of tumor for 3 months now, and is fine (i'd euthanize him if I could catch him, though he doesn't seem to be suffering...so...)

However, these deaths could be attributed to an un-cycled tank...you say it's a new 55 gallon. it's possible that 10 neons were enough of a bio load to spike ammonia to the point of fatal toxicity. Please elaborate more on just how new this tank was, whether you fishless cycled or used bio-spira...all that necessary information.
__________________

__________________
Former advisor and planted tank geek...life's moved on though.
malkore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2004, 07:12 PM   #3
Moderator Emeritus
 
Menagerie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Vancouver, WA
Posts: 13,230
I would agree, I don't think neons are the best fish to add first. You should give the tanks months to establish before adding neons.
__________________

Menagerie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2004, 08:29 PM   #4
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Arlington Virginia USA
Posts: 134
It's brand new - not cycled. But I checked water everyday and there has been no ammonia or nitrite reading at all. Maybe the plants ate them all? I did a 30% water change.

Well, what I would like to find out is what are the best practice to provide a fish-friendly environment that will reduce the chance of them getting sick.
__________________
mikemou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2004, 09:50 PM   #5
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: NY
Posts: 4,536
Chances are your neons were ill to begin with. I actually don't think it was neon tetra disease, as the symptoms don't match, but neons are really delicate overall. I also doubt the issue was a cycling issue at this point, especially with your water readings. 10 neons in a 55g is barely scratching the surface of nitrogenous waste.

A fish friendly environment is a cycled tank which is similar to the parameters the fish came from. Obviously thats not always possible; hence fishless cycling, Biospira, using media from other tanks, and slow acclimation of new fish.

I do suggest you leave the tank fallow for a few weeks; it would suck to introduce new fish and have them come down with whatever the neons had. You might want to get new fish and QT for 2-3 weeks before adding them. This way you keep the main tank from any more disease and its easier to watch new fish in a bare QT tank then a large planted tank.
__________________
aka Cycling Guru and the Ich Slayer

*glares at Terry and QTOFFER*

Card carrying member of FTAS & GCAS.
Allivymar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 04:22 PM   #6
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Arlington Virginia USA
Posts: 134
Thanks Allivymar.

I'm down to 2 neons as of this moring. One is visibility illed with ICH and rot fins/tail so I suspect I'll loose it soon. The other one is looking extremely healthy, not even a slightest difficulty visible.

I agree I shouldn't introduce any fish for a few weeks, but if this last one survives at last, is keeping it alone the best thing to do? I mean aren't they schooling fish? Is kept alone for a couple weeks OK?
__________________
mikemou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 04:37 PM   #7
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Cheese, anyone?
Posts: 177
If you did get ICH in your tank, I would definately treat your tank for ICH (check the articles section). A fish can still die from ICH even if there are no visible signs on the surface of your fish. All that has to happen is enough ICH inside the gills of your fish (not very noticable, especially on a neon) and the poor guy can't breathe. You should definately consider getting a QT tank to prevent your healthy fish from becoming infected from bad ones. My friend just lost 20 healthy fish from one bad batch of 6 neons. By the way, stress has nothing to do with ICH.
__________________
CiRXSi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 04:44 PM   #8
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Nebraska, USA
Posts: 6,703
Yep, and if one fish has ich, the rest should always be assumed to have ich.
__________________
Former advisor and planted tank geek...life's moved on though.
malkore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 05:30 PM   #9
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Arlington Virginia USA
Posts: 134
i am treating the tank, just don't think the medication is working fast enough to save lives. if that one neon makes it through it's probably not because of the treatment but it's exceptionally good immune system that fended off ich.

btw, from what i gathered elsewhere, ich attacks stressed fish.

as to QT, i checked out some of the marineland eclipse and allglass aquarium 5 gal tanks at petco last weekend, but to my surprise none of them come with heaters. is heater not needed for small tanks?
__________________
mikemou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2004, 08:52 PM   #10
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: NY
Posts: 4,536
*nods and agrees*

Stress decreases the immune response and a compromised immune system opens the door to all sorts of infections and infestations, including ich.

As for small tanks and heaters, depends on the fish. If the fish needs a certain temp range, it will need a heater. As most fish do best within a certain temp range, its necessary. They prob don't include it cause it keeps the price down. Most setups don't include one.
__________________
aka Cycling Guru and the Ich Slayer

*glares at Terry and QTOFFER*

Card carrying member of FTAS & GCAS.
Allivymar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-14-2004, 01:14 AM   #11
Moderator Emeritus
 
Menagerie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Vancouver, WA
Posts: 13,230
There are 25 watt heaters out there. I bought one on ebay and use it on my 5 gal QT tank.
__________________

Menagerie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-14-2004, 06:51 PM   #12
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Nebraska, USA
Posts: 6,703
Yep, otherwise get a 50 watt that's a good brand, like Visi-therm. It'll last many years, so you can use it the next time you upgrade your tank.

And yes, ich is pretty much always present in a tank, but until the fish become stressed it really can't take hold.
Good luck
__________________
Former advisor and planted tank geek...life's moved on though.
malkore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2004, 05:31 PM   #13
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Arlington Virginia USA
Posts: 134
I'm setting up a 5 gal QT and moving the two struggling neons in there to continue their ICH treatment.

As to the big 55 gal tank, I don't want to tear it down and clean it inside out...AGAIN! It's got several plants and a couple baby snails came with them and gravel so it would be too much hassle to do a complete cleaning job. I'm planning to syphon/gravel vac most of the water out and leave just enough for the plants and let it sit there for over 48 hours, and restart the tank. From what I gathered ICH won't last 48 hrs w/out fish. Any other concerns I should wait longer than that? Or there're better options/solutions?

Thanks for your help!!!
__________________
mikemou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2004, 01:03 AM   #14
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 1,728
Send a message via Yahoo to deli_conker
I would keep treating for ich even if the fish aren't in there. It always pays to be safe.

You might also want to do a fishless cycle on your 55 and get it done the easy way...

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/showqu...q=2&fldAuto=15
__________________
deli_conker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2004, 01:09 AM   #15
Moderator Emeritus
 
Menagerie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Vancouver, WA
Posts: 13,230
Keep up with the heat treatment on the main tank and there will be no need to drain and start over. Plus bacteria will not be lost.
__________________

Menagerie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2004, 01:45 AM   #16
Aquarium Advice Regular
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Upstate New York
Posts: 56
Send a message via AIM to Mayonnaise Send a message via MSN to Mayonnaise
IIRC Neons are a bad idea for first fish. I remember that from my first tank. I made the same mistake, starting with Neon Tetras... and they all died on me, simply because as was explained to me later, they are not good fish to start with.

8^(
__________________

__________________
Mayonnaise is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
stress

Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on AquariumAdvice.com

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Too Much Stress Coat & Stress Zyme? HollieDahhrlinn Freshwater & Brackish - General Discussion 5 11-30-2009 11:04 PM
To Much Stress For Fish rtoycrow Saltwater Reef Aquaria 6 10-12-2007 12:34 PM
Definition of stress in fish. BillD Freshwater & Brackish - General Discussion 16 01-03-2006 10:32 AM
fish stress craziness... deli_conker Freshwater & Brackish - General Discussion 17 12-30-2003 08:14 PM
Aquarium Pharma - Stress Coat and Stress Zyme pachuco2k Freshwater & Brackish - General Discussion 19 11-04-2003 07:29 PM







» Photo Contest Winners







All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:58 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.