Is this SUPER Ich? Any Advice Please...

[akitagirl]

Ok Let me say hello to all and this is my first time posting to the forums, although I've been reading and following up with a lot for the last 2 months now. Apologies in advance for the long post, but I'm feeling a bit down about this ich treatment and I need some guidance and reassurance to see this through. Thanks so much.

I'm fairly new to fish keeping but I've done an extensive amount of research to aid in my novice.

Tank Stats: 55 gal - fake plants, Emperor400 BioWheel, 1 sponge filter, bubble wall and air stone, all natural tiny gravel bed, lots of hiding places,
1 300w fluval heater

ammonia: 0, nitrite: 0, nitrate: 5-10ppm, p.h 7.4, temp: 86 (for ich treatment, usually resides at 78-80)

Inhabitants: 2 dwarf gourami, 1 blue gourami, 1 gold gourami, 4 baby clown loaches (less than 1"), 1 common pleco (very small 1.5" maybe), 1 young black ghost knife (under 3"), 2 cory cats

(we plan to upgrade to 100+ gallons for the loaches and the pleco and ghost in due time)

Basically the tank was cycled with preseeded material and ammonie before adding the first batch of fish. It ran smoothly for a month with the gouramis, cories, and the pleco. Husband brought the clowns and ghost knife to surprise me and he didn't even see the loaches covered from head to toe in ich spots.... he put them in the community tank and I came home to find this disaster...

I figured it was too late to return the fish now that ich was so graciously dumped in my tank *sigh* so I decided with the scaleless fish in there that heat and salt was the way to go. My heater maxed out only brought the tank to 84 and I slowly added 1 TBSPN of salt per 5 gallons over the next 48 hours (predissolved and dribbled near the filter intake). I lost the smallest, weakest, most heavily infested loach the following day. Over the course of the week the remaining 4 loaches had maybe 10-20 spots each and they exploded with even more spots but then during week two they all slowly fell off. I gravel vacced almost daily to help remove any parasites and replaced salted water accordingly. Week 3 was looking so promising, 2 of the 4 loaches were cleared for days while the last 2 had 1-2 spots. NO other inhabitants ever showed symptoms of ich and the cory cats and pleco seemed to be tolerating the salt. Everyone was eating well, swimming and the loaches went from pale white thin sickly to bright orange with dark black stripes and had grown quite a bit. We are currently in week 4 of treatment and I've added a second smaller heater to bring the temp from 84 to 86 because these last few spots wont budge! And it appears that the 2 that cleared now have 1 spot each, and the 2 that had a few are completely CLEAN... what is going on here? I'm not mixing my clowns up lol because they each vary in size.. the largest baby is almost double the size of the smallest with 2 similar sized mediums but one has a solid black face (beautiful) so I can easily distinguish them.

Is it ok to have this salt concentration and heat for so long? I thought the heat/salt treatment should top out at 3 weeks and I can see my ghost knife is finally succumbing to the salt.. he was perfectly fine for 3 weeks but now his fins are thining out.. he is still eating well and growing but this looks like the onset of fin rot and the only thing I can attribute this stressor to is the salt. He has plenty of hiding places and no one bullies him. In fact, all of the fish get along surprising well.

My main concerns: Is the treatment is taking too long to rid the last 3 spots on my clown loaches or should I remain patient with it and keep going? Is it time to switch to meds? I don't want to kill my biofilter. Our little ghost is a toughy and has been eating from my hands since the day we brough him home (as do all the fish actually..... lol). The cories have also slowed down a bit. Everyone is eating, like I said, but I stay at home and tediously care for the fish and watch them A LOT. I know their habits already and I notice even the slightest changes in behaviour. I know the ghost is wearing thin of the salt as are the cories.

I recently added another smaller heater to get the tank to 86 and it's stabilized there since yesterday in a desperate effort to kill these last stubborn spots...

I'm disheartened by this mess so ANY and ALL advice would be much appreciated. TY for reading.

[Hholly]

What signs of stress are you seeing? When you raise the temp, some fish can become agitated and act more aggressive and swim faster from that. Heat alone can kill ich at 86 degrees and up. If you think the salt is a problem take it out. Too bad you didn't get the new heater before. But now that you have the temp up, it should kill off the ich fairly quickly. "They" say that you should continue treatment for 2 weeks after the last spot is gone. But if the heat is stressing your fish too much, maybe don't wait that long. Good luck!

[akitagirl]

The only signs of stress I'm seeing is the thinning of the long fin on the black ghost and the cories seem more sluggish and rest frequently. His fins aren't frayed or shredded but it appears to be the early signs of fin rot. And here is a 5 minute ago UPDATE (please don't laugh I seriously can not believe this); so I finally post needing help but I JUST CHECKED the loaches and guess what.. only 1 spot... 1 freaking spot LOL (when there were 4-5 spots BEFORE posting what the heck) *sighs* I guess it only took those 2 degrees SHEESH.

I'm going to watch the ghost carefully, if his fins damage further I'm going to remove the salt and just stick with the high heat for the next 7 days. If he can bear it one more week with both, I'll do that. Thanks for the reply holly.

[Hholly]

Yeah it's amazing what 2 degrees will do. Glad you're seeing improvement. Sounds like a good plan.

[akitagirl]

that was a mistype 3-4 spots not 4-5

[akitagirl]

Thanks so much. I was getting really down why those last spots wouldn't leave after what felt like forever...

[KaylNeko]

Looks like you're almost at the end. Just keep it up for at least 3 or 4 days once those last spots drop off so you make sure you kill the ich--either by preventing reproduction because of the heat, or by catching any babies with the salt. Almost there.

[Mumma.of.two]

Sounds like you doing everything right. As said you can remove the salt or even cut the dosage in half if you think it is effecting some fish. Heat alone is enough. Under 86F the ich life cycle is sped up, over 86F it stops the life cycle and they ich dies instead of reproducing. At 89-90F the ich is killed.
http://www.aquahobby.com/articles/e_ich2.php

[absolutangel04]

I agree with Mumma. Now that you can raise the heat up, I suggest dropping the salt down because it does sounds like it is bothering the fish.
I am sorry that you have been dealing with this for so long! That stinks.
I know people have said different things, but I recommend keeping the heat up for at least 7 days after the last visible symptom is gone. Clown loaches seem to be particularly susceptible to ich, so you want to make sure its all gone. Good luck.

[akitagirl]

I want to thank all that replied and post an update for any one else that may be battling ich/ick. A day after my last post (which was the 8th) the last spot vanished and the fish are doing wonderfully!

I am happy to report that there have been NO SPOTS and the fish have been slowly returned to their normal temperature and I removed the salt over a 48 hr period after my last post because my ghost was struggling. His fin rot continued to progress but halted once the heat was dropped down. (looks like heat might have been the stressor, but I shall never know..) I am also happy to report that with water changes and constantly pristine water conditions, his fin rot is beginning to slowly resolve itself without the use of medication and offered him additional hiding places (although he never hides lol...)

I want to give THUMBS UP to the heat/salt method for anyone else like myself that is hesitant to medicate! It rid my tank of the little buggers and my fish have never been healthier !

[absolutangel04]

Awesome! I am glad to hear the fish are doing well.