Ooooh Nooo!

[Eelpout]

Parameters: ph 8.0-8.2, 3N's 0,0,5.0ppm per API Master Test. Weekly 50% PWC's.

Tank: 2 month old 37 gal started with filter media from another tank

Original Stock (survived proper fish-in-cycle)
4 cory babies <1/2"
2 guppy
3 young guppy+3 fry
7 WCMM babies
lots of guppy fry eventually 40+ then eaten back to around 12
1 mo ago, added 2 german blue rams...no problems

5 nights ago (2 month point), added 12 1/4" neon tetras and 8 1" rummynose tetras and a pair of swords. The next morning I got a good look at the swords and returned them to the LFS. Male emaciated w/ cupped fins, inactive. Female long stringy white poo.

4 days ago I put a florecent light over tank for 1st time. The fish colors really popped but it also iluminated a couple tiny white spots on a couple of the rummys. Made a mental note to observe and treat if it was what i thought it was.

Yesterday I noticed one of the corys laying still. (my canary in the coal mine) Not unusual except that the others were very active and his dorsel fin was not erect. I also noticed all the fish were flashing. I'd had ich previously on initial set up...I think. So I figured I'd look again in the morning and then treat for ich.

This morning...FUDGE! 2 dead cory 1 on his way out. A couple rummys dead or dieing and two F guppys swimming on surface w/ mouths rotted wide open. See attached photo of them in an orange QT bucket, floating verticle, near death.

I drew out a cup of water to test (3N's 0,0,5.0ppm) did about a 75% PWC. Applied a 1/2 dose of Quick Cure (tetras) netted the sick guppys for salt bath then quarentine.

Current dead: two pictured F guppy, 6 rummy nose tetra $$$ I think the mouth rot got them too, 3 cory, 4th on his way. Very supprised to still have all the baby neons.

What do I do at this point? How do I get rid of the mouth rot disease? Will Quick Cure handle it? The mouth rot seems to kill in hours not days.

Quick Cure with Tetras: Anyone have advice for exactly how to do a tank ich treatment with tetras and plants? I dosed 1 drop per 2 gallons per instructions. Should I do that 3 days then do a PWC or do water change day? How big a PWC? Bump up my temp. to 86F too or leave it alone? Salt or not? How much?

I guess everyone preaches quarantine tanks for a reason. I paid premium prices from the supposedly best LFS in my state. -no guarantee of health. A second tank will be a really tough sell to the Mrs.

Thanks all.

 

[Mumma.of.two]

Oh dear. That is columnaris! Turn the tank temperature down to 70*F. Are you in America? You will need a gram negative antibiotic to treat. Add 1 tablespoon of salt per 5g (US) of tank water slowly over a day or so.
I will find some more info for you......

 

[Mumma.of.two]

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f100/help-urgent-fish-mayday-188992.html

http://badmanstropicalfish.com/fish_palace/tropicalfish_disease_identification.html#ERM

The quick cure will do nothing. I suggest getting the antibiotics ASAP. As you've witnessed it moves FAST! QT the visibly infected fish to try and avoid healthier ones getting it.

 

[Eelpout]

I'm in the US Mumma. You helped me last time, when I'd first started the tank. You nailed it then! I'm pretty certain it was ich that time. I was unable to see it with natural lighting only. Florescent lighting helps illuminate those nasties. Increased temp for 2 wks cured all the fish. The flashing was gone. THANKS!!!

 

[Eelpout]

I can see ich on the rummys so I think I will keep going w/ ich treatment. What antibiotics? Any one know a U.S. brand name for a newbie? Dose whole tank? I assume If I dose whole tank, will kill the filter bacteria? Every answer seems to generate more questions...sorry.

 

[Eelpout]

Visibly ill fish are QTed...and dead now.

 

[boadams87]

I can see ich on the rummys so I think I will keep going w/ ich treatment. What antibiotics? Any one know a U.S. brand name for a newbie? Dose whole tank? I assume If I dose whole tank, will kill the filter bacteria? Every answer seems to generate more questions...sorry.

No meds just turn heat up to 86°

 

[Mumma.of.two]

This is a tricky one. With ich you need to get the heat up pretty high. With columnaris you need to get it as low as you can. Any other fish showing columnaris or just ich?

 

[Mumma.of.two]

Ok been thinking. Turning the temperature down will slow the ich to the point that it will not multiply fast enough to harm the fish a significant amount. Turning the temp down will also give you precious time to treat the columnaris. Antibiotics will harm your biofilter but it shouldn't wipe it out completely.
What i would do is turn down the temp, treat for colomnaris, then treat for ich later.

 

[Eelpout]

Can anyone recommend a specific retail antibiotic brand? I'm nearest to a Petco/mart. I'm guessing that with this plan I will lower to 70-75F? Do a 75% PWC to get the Quick Cure out, add antibiotic and cross fingers...correct? After the antiboitic treatment period, bump slowly up to 86F for 2 wks and/or Quick Cure? I hope this doesn't wipe out my filter bacteria. I imagine tetras and tank cycling would be sketchy. I think doing nothing will insure fish soup though.

 

[Mumma.of.two]

Can anyone recommend a specific retail antibiotic brand? I'm nearest to a Petco/mart. I'm guessing that with this plan I will lower to 70-75F? Do a 75% PWC to get the Quick Cure out, add antibiotic and cross fingers...correct? After the antiboitic treatment period, bump slowly up to 86F for 2 wks and/or Quick Cure? I hope this doesn't wipe out my filter bacteria. I imagine tetras and tank cycling would be sketchy. I think doing nothing will insure fish soup though.

Maracyn 2. Check the packet and make sure that's the one that does gram negative bacteria. Lower the temp to 70-72F. Follow the instructions on the packet of maracyn. Do a full course of treatment. I would wait as long as possible to treat the ich. Turning the temp up too soon might make the columnaris come back. we will see how the antibiotics go then worry about the ich.

 

[jlk]

Petsmart carries Maracyn2 (not regular maracyn!) and Triple Sulfa products. Im not sure if Petco carries antibiotics & I know Walmart doesnt. Maracyn 2 would be my first choice after kanamycin (which you will not find in chain store). Triple sulfa would be my 3rd choice. Add a low dose of aq salt (1tbsp per 10gal) & turn down the temp gradually. Ich will not kill immediately, columnaris does so this must be treated asap!

 

[Eelpout]

Off to the store...thanks again all!!!!!!!

 

[Mumma.of.two]

Off to the store...thanks again all!!!!!!!

Good luck keep us posted!!

 

[Eelpout]

I found/treated with Tetra Fungus Guard. Directions: Apply. Apply again in 4 days if needed.
Due to schedule, I would not be able to follow dosing instructions w/ the other meds I found.

Active ingredients: Nitrofurazone, furazolidone, potassium dichromate.

It makes the water look nasty. Blue/green like porta-potty water. No deaths since application, but another rummy nose has "the look" this morning.

Googled: NITROFURAZONE is bactericidal for many gram-positive and gram-negative bacteria causing disease in fresh water and marine fishes. This antibacterial is effective for control of Aeromonas, Vibrio and related species. Nitrofurazone is particularly useful for control of minor topical skin infections of marine fishes that have not become systemic (internal).

Googled: Furazolidone is used to treat bacterial and protozoal infections. It works by killing bacteria and protozoa (tiny, one-celled animals). Some protozoa are parasites that can cause many different kinds of infections in the body.
Googled: potassium dichromate nasty stuff

Anyone ever had success with this product?
In theory, will this chemical cocktail cure what ails my fish?
Will it do anything for ich?
-if not can, I do the salt/86F ich treatment concurrently or will the salt react with the other chems? My other options are Quick Cure or Aquarisol.
In general, what concentration of salt would you use with plants and sensitive neon and rummy nose tetras?

Thanks!

 

[jlk]

Give it a try! I am not familiar with this particular product but it is supposed to have some effectiveness against minor cases of columnaris. The only knowledge i have about the potassium dichromate is its a known carcinogen & can kill plants so you may want to remove them. Keep up with the low dose of salt & the lowered temps- its more important right now to treat the columnaris. We can can deal with the ich when your fish are no longer infected. Keep us posted!

 

[LyndaB]

When my tank got columnaris, I culled the two symptomatic fish, did a 50% water change, scrubbed tank interior walls, refilled and dosed at half-dose aquarium salt. It got rid of the columnaris and no more fish got sick.

Sometimes you have to take drastic measures for the good of the tank as a whole.

 

[Eelpout]

I did the fungus med and dropped the temp. I added 1/2 tablespoon/gal kosher salt. Now I've crept the temp back up to 86. Things may have stabilized...I hope. I got a credit from the LFS after explaining what happened. Very cool. I noticed the tank that was previously full of RNTs, had just a couple left. They were sick and lacking in color. The swords were looking sick too.

More questions:

Should I syphon some bleach water through my python before my next use?

How long before I attempt more fish if my remaining fish make it?

Any way around the quarantine tank?

I have hard/high ph water. LFS guy said it's too much stress for amazon fish. A different LFS guy told me it would be fine, just not for breeding. How could I lower the ph? From what I've read/ heard, I need to mix RO water w/tap water. What else works?

Thanks again!!!

 

[jlk]

Disinfecting your python between uses is a wise idea until you are positive your fish are no longer sick. I would wait a couple of weeks before considering new fish to be sure the columnaris & ich are completely gone & that your fish are healthy & fully recovered. It also sounds like your lfs is a bit suspect here...keep in mind that most stores run on a central filtration system, so one or few sick fish mean all the fish have been exposed to the same diseases. No experience here with amazon fish & i dont know what their ideal requirements may be- perhaps you should ask in general discussion for further advice & opinions.

 

[Eelpout]

Update

1 wk into 86F and salty:

No deaths, no fungus or spots visible. All the remaining fish are healthy, eating, and showing normal behavior. The plants did take hit though. I didn't have time to remove them.

So, I don't know if it was the medicine+low temp, or the salt+high temp, or both, or neither, but all is well.

Thanks once again.