Tank Meltdown

[joanofsnark]

Hi, all.. this is my first post, but I've been lurking here a while for all the great aquarium advice.

Four years ago, I inherited an established 65 gal tank with lights, Eheim canister filter, heater, and airstone. At my friend's, this was the most low-maintenance tank you have ever seen. They did a water/filter change once every 6 months, the water was crystal clear and the fish were happy.

At my place, the tank location gets more daylight (which I can't help, small apartment), so the tank has had some troubles (mainly algae and water turning green), but everything was fine. I had my friend's fish and I didn't lose a single one until I got Ich and lost a couple of favorites while dosing with Rid-Ich. The tank is prone to get low in pH, but I think that is due to the piece of wood and I monitor and buffer to compensate. All to say, everything was running pretty smoothly, other than the algae issue.

Now, my current issues. I was gone for 8 months and I'd walked my friend through the filter/water change; she said she would take care of that for me. My roommate fed them and topped up the water as needed. My friend did not do a single change the entire time (don't get me started on how bad I feel for the fish), so when I got home, the tank was overrun with algae and the water was tinged green. I did a water/filter change right away and scrubbed as much algae off as I could.

Got new fish to restock and all was good until the 3 tiger barbs I'd just bought were dead three days later, all at once. I exchanged them, put the new ones in about a week ago and all seemed well.

BUT THEN.. I noticed that my new snakeskin gourami had a white spot and then that the other snakeskin had a bigger infestation. I really wanted to never use Rid-Ich again after last time, so I tried to play it safe by doing half-doses (and not over-medicating, by dosing only for the replaced water).

Even so, I have just lost so many fish.. Two tetras, two of the new little tiger barbs, pictus cats, a cory, and one was a pleco that came with the tank (sad. ). Additionally, my goldfish looks a hot mess. It's white, but is now pink and blood-red around its fins. It's gone from being chill and foraging leisurely to swimming constantly and seeming agitated.

Most of my test kit has expired, but I was able to test the pH, which is fine. I just did a 50% water change yesterday after finding dead fish and I'm going to do another 50% change today. Other than buying a new test kit, do you all have any advice or ideas on what's going on?

 

[Eggheadfish]

So many things...
First of all welcome!
I'm going to try to keep this short, so please don't think I'm being snarky...lol
Goldfish and tropicals do not belong together
Ich usually pops up when you add new fish without quarantine or when water conditions are bad and fish are stressed. Always use meds as directed. Half doses aren't going to get you anywhere. I've had success with jungle ick cure but you have other options (heat treatment if fish can tolerate it). Be careful with meds if you have plecos or cories as scaleless fish are sensitive to some treatments (should say on the bottle if you can't use it) I'll let someone else go into that in detail since I'm not an ich expert.
When you say changing the filters, I hope you don't mean the filter pads. Filter media stores all the beneficial bacteria that your tank needs. Take a quick read on establishing the nitrogen cycle, you could have ammonia and nitrite present in the tank which is killing the fish.
When you say you buffer your ph, how are you doing that? Using chemicals can cause ph swings which are not good for the fish. Consistent ph is better than perfect ph.
Do you treat your water for chlorine and chloramines? How often do you change your water? What is your current stock?
If you can tell us your ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate readings it would be helpful.
Hope things get better

 

[joanofsnark]

Thanks for replying.. I've been using Rid-Ich Plus, which says that it's safer for scaleless fish. My research into the matter indicated that I could do half doses in the case of having sensitive fish. The first time, I used full doses and killed my prized upside-down catfish and a loach. I had a couple of cats, some corys and plecos, so I really didn't want to repeat killing fish during ich medicating.

I use a cuttlebone in the filter to buffer pH and that does the trick. I've also used baking soda to bring the pH up. I try to avoid using chemicals when possible.

My filter is a canister filter with the bio media stuff, I forget what it's called. Stuff made for canister filters, the bottom level is coarse (like short stone tubes) and the next level is the same material, but finer and rock-shaped. Those are topped with a filter to help with finer particles. During cleaning, I use tank water to rinse out each level and the filter.

Any time I add new water, I use the appropriate dosage of AquaSafe Plus. I do water changes as needed, when the water clarity is off.. originally, I was doing every 6 months as taught, but given the water quality issues I have (that she didn't), I need to do it more frequently.

All my testing stuff is expired and I read that expired stuff can be inaccurate, so I'm going to get a new kit. I don't know about ammonia/nitrite/nitrate yet, but I did a 50% water change yesterday, so I would think things would have been better if that was the issue. Only, I lost a few more fish overnight.

The goldfish's redness makes me think it's the water. I was reading that this problem is caused by high ammonia or nitrites. However, I did a 25% water change a few days ago during the Rid-Ich regimen and I did a 50% change yesterday. Hopefully, things will improve with another water change today.

What remains: I've got 3 tiger barbs, 2 snakeskin gourami, a rainbowfish, a goldfish (it was my sister's, it's 6 years old), 2 corys, 1 zebra loach, 1 tiny algae eater, 2 plecos (clown and ?), and 2 white tetras. Some of these guys came with the tank and the goldfish has been in there for 4 years without any issue until now.

Thank you again!

 

[Matt68005]

Why not buy a ten gallon tank and heater/airstone and use this for dosing rid-ick. Rid-ick should never "kill" a fish, and i strongly reccomend against dosing anything in the main tank, not to mention its a 65 gallon display tank. A bare bottom ten would work great as a Quarintine and Hospital tank, and save you money in the long run. You could get it off craigslist.
Sounds like your roomate needs to grow up as well. If he/she cant take care of fish, how are they suppose to raise children someday?

 

[joanofsnark]

I live in a pretty small apartment and I don't really have room for another tank... however, I'm brainstorming about options because I do think that I should have a quarantine tank or at least a tank to remove certain fish if necessary.

As far as the ich.. my understanding (correct me if I'm wrong) is that you can't treat individual fish because you can't treat ich on fish -- at that point, it's in the water, the tomites are in the substrate, and the entire tank is affected. So, you have to treat the tank. Some of my sensitive fish died the first time I treated with Rid-Ich at full doses and I was extremely hesitant to use it again. I researched it, hardly anyone seems to have the dying fish problems, so I thought I'd try it again at half doses, which is recommended for sensitive fish. Only, I think the Rid-Ich just caused more problems in the tank, if that's possible. All this dying of my fish began with dosing with Rid-Ich.

I've now lost most of my fish. Since my last post, I've lost all of my tiger barbs and both plecos. All I have left are 2 snakeskin gourami, 2 albino cory, 2 white tetras, the rainbowfish, and the goldfish. The goldfish seems to be on the mend, however. Very sad.

I've done a bunch of 50% water changes over the past few weeks. The pH, I keep finding at about 6.6-6.8 (but, that's pretty normal with this tank, which is why I use a cuttlebone and baking soda). Just did a water test, nitrite was 0. Ammonia was hard to read for certain, it's between 0-0.25. Nitrate was 20ppm.

Other than more water changes, what do you recommend? I'll keep testing the water.. but say that nitrates are the issue, is there a way to do something with the tank to help keep that number down (without chemicals, preferably)? Like can I add/do something to help buffer nitrates on an ongoing basis?

This is an established tank of many years and I would think that there should be an adequate amount of beneficial bacteria! Especially since I rinse the filter media in tank water (not tap water). I'm at a loss and feeling pretty down about losing all my guys.

Thank you so much for your help and advice! I really appreciate it.

 

[Eggheadfish]

Really strange...
Nitrates at 20ppm shouldn't be an issue, of course lower is preferable but you're not in the danger zone. Live plants can help reduce trates but I don't think that's the issue.
Are these the new fish that are dying or ones you already had? What is your acclimation process?
If you're getting slight ammonia readings you could be going through a mini cycle, dose the water with some Prime if you have some it helps neutralize ammonia and nitrite for I believe 48hrs.
Other than that are the fish acting strange at all? Any other symptoms?
I'm not sure where to go with this one...sorry

 

[joanofsnark]

Yeah, it's very strange. I've done so many water changes that the Rid-Ich should be all but gone... I have plants and a biofilter.. I don't understand why all those fish died. All I can think is that is has to do with the water, but WHAT in the world is it?

The gourami seem perfectly normal. Everyone else seems a bit on the lethargic side. The goldfish was in bad shape there for a while and I thought it was going to die, too, but I did a bunch of water changes and it is looking better. It's stopped flashing, too, so it must be feeling better.

I've lost new and old fish. One of the snakeskins and the two corys are new and seem to be doing okay. When introducing new fish, I sit the bags in the tank to acclimate water temp and put the fish in the tank. This is where I think a quarantine tank would be really helpful; keeping new guys apart for a while to make sure they're okay. Ich *sucks*!

I cleaned the filter a month ago.. am wondering if maybe I should do it again..

 

[Matt68005]

You could try acriflavine. Do you have adequate aeration during the rid ick treatment?

 

[joanofsnark]

Hi.. sorry, I didn't get notified of a response in this thread. Thank you for the recommendation; the ich seems to be gone now, but I will make note of trying acriflavine instead next time. Or maybe aquarium salt and temperature, since a lot of people seem to have good luck with that.