Uneducated - Need help

[King Fisher]

It's all good. You made some solid suggestions.

 

[Texasdy]

Wow! Lots of info!
Life happened and I didn't get any water changes in this week. I'll try to answer all the new questions and concerns and update what's been going on.

I do use a conditioner, just a standard one from the store - Aqueon Water Conditioner (picture). I always take the fish out during a water change bc I've had fish die before when I didn't so it's how I'm comfortable doing it. I keep them out for at least 6-8hrs (sometimes more) so the conditioner has time to work and the temperature can regulate from the tap. IF I change the filter, I leave the old one floating in the tank for a day or two. I tested today from middle of the tank, previous were all from the top.

Tank today
Ph
7.4
Ammonia
0.25
Nitrite
0
Nitrate
40+ hard to tell (picture included)

And my tap water...
Ph
7.6
Ammonia
1.5
Nitrite
0
Nitrate
0

Behavior is mostly back to his spazzy-normal. He does have times of lethargy but not as bad as my last post. And although not as much this week as last, I am still seeing slow color improvement.

Both fish spend a lot of time in the "shade" under the filter. The tank came with LED lights. We've been keeping it turned off (except when my son asks for it) and just allowing for natural room/window light. They seem to be more active out of the "shadows" when the light is off. Should we get a new lid/light situation?? Are LEDs bad??

Thanks again!!!

 

[Francinej]

So 1- you need a bigger tank...
And 2- if you are getting ammonia still you are not cycled... my suggestion would be to NOT take an animal out during a water change.... also you have a change between your tank PH and your tap PH... have you ever gotten your “TRUE” PH?

What you have to do is let your water sit out for about 48 hours (helps if you have an airstone but it’s not necessary) every now and again stir up the water or agagitate it with a cup... then test that water after the 48 hours... that will be your real ph... it’s much more stressful on the fish to be removed during a water change as you should not have to do so big of ones that he would even notice.... so I would re think that part but I honestly do not think you will ever get cycled with him in that small of a tank... you need a 20g to 30g for him... otherwise you are just slowly poisoning him.... it’s too small for the bioload he produces....

As I said in my previous posts I suspected that you were not cycled and you are not....
when you mention having to “change tour bio media” what do you mean? Does your filter use the prepackaged cartridges? What kind of filter is it....
Instead of putting it in the water it can be much more effective to put the new one behind the old one to seed it before changing it... you shouldn’t have to put that in the water with him.... and do not go by what they say about changing it every couple weeks or every month because you are basically throwing out your cycle.... but I can help more with that when you let me know what kind of filter you have
Hope you can upgrade his tank or re home him (as sad as it may be) I’m sure you would rather see him go to a good home then slowly poison him

 

[King Fisher]

He's slowly improving. That's good to see!!!

I'll make some suggestions....water conditioner should work within seconds so you would be ok adding it to your bucket of water or whatever container you use then pouring it into the tank with the fish in. If you are applying water directly from faucet to tank then I'd say it's a good idea to remove them or switch to premixing in buckets then adding it to the tank. As far as temp....I found a cool way of using a meat thermometer. I place it in a bucket and adjust my faucet to a temp of 76-78 degrees (the temp I keep my tank is 77) as I'm filling the bucket. I then add my water conditioner and mix it around a bit...then add it to my tank. This might save you some time.

The ammonia in your tap at that level isn't really good. But it's lower in the tank?? So it appears it's being converted to nitrates as a cycled tank would. Being that you have ammonia in your tap water you don't really want to be adding that to your tank. If you have access to an RO system in your home you could use that to change your water. The other option you could try...if your tank is in fact cycled....is buying Seachem Prime conditioner and adding it to your water. This will help eliminate the ammonia and nitrites and lowers your nitrates for 2-3 days. By then the beneficial bacteria in your tank should take care of any ammonia and nitrites that attempt to build up. Your nitrates look like 40 ppm but you might want to hold the vile back a little bit from the paper. It always appears darker when it's right up against the white.

LED's are fine. I can't remember if you have live plants or not. If you do you will have to leave the lights on longer....6-8 hours a day....but if you don't then you could turn them on a couple hours a day or less if you have some natural room light. Some fish feel more secure with less light.

If your tank is cycled you won't have to float the old filter in the tank. You should be able to take the old filter and place it in a container of old tank water and scrub it off then reuse it. If you are disposing of the filter because it has prefilled carbon in it...and your tank is cycled...there should be enough beneficial bacteria in your substrate and on your decor to keep the tank stabilized. If you do gravel vacs do a light one on the days you change the filter. Don't be afraid to replace or clean the filter. A really dirty filter can add a lot of nitrates to your tank.

What is your water change schedule now?

 

[Francinej]

All I have to say to that is that PRIME DOES NOT remove your ammonia. It simply takes the NH3 (free ammonia) and binds it to change it to NH4 (ammonium) a less toxic form and it does this for an absolute MAX of 24-48 tops (closer to 24)
Your api test will still show the same ammonia amount as if you had not added the prime because it can not tell the difference between free ammonia and ammonium so don’t be shocked when your kit is still showing the ammonia... it is detoxified... but it will most certainly NOT last 3 days or more... feel free to email seachem yourself... or better yet just read the bottle... it’s clearly stated there....

 

[King Fisher]

Like I suggested, if her tank is cycled it is a safer alternative to add Prime than adding water with ammonia straight to the tank with a standard dechlorinator. Honestly, I've never seen print on a bottle of Prime that gave a time frame for effectiveness, just what I've been told by other aquarists. I had to check this just now to make sure and I still don't see where this is printed. But if you emailed Seachem and they said 2 days tops but more like 24 hours then I'd go with that. And I said 2-3 days not more than that.

So dose the tank with Prime 24 hours after your initial water change.

 

[Francinej]

You can certainly do a water change right from the tap but you have to add the prime immediately... people who use pythons do it all the time.. but you dose for the full tank not the replacement water... especially when you have ammonia in your water...
that’s the only difference....

when you are adding it directly to the aquarium you ALWAYS base it on the entire aquarium volume... when you are adding it to a bucket for evaporated water replacement or for water changes you base it on the volume you are replacing... which is why many people just add it to the tank right after, or during a water change because it’s often easier to know what your aquarium volume is compared to buckets etc....

And most certainly it will only detoxify it for a MAX of 48 hrs but with the ammonia already being in the tap water I would add it every 24 hours.... you can go up to 5X the dosage in an emergency.... but just be aware that if too much is added it depleted the o2 in your water so don’t think more is better with this product... just follow the label.... but it is much better than what you are currently using

 

[King Fisher]

With a smaller tank you could get away with putting tap water straight into a tank then treating it. Yours probably takes around one 5g bucket tops and very little time but then again why not treat the 5g bucket of water first. Once you get a bigger tank and you are adding multiple buckets and it's taking longer to do a water change then I would add your dechlorinator to each bucket as you go. It's easy enough to break down the dosage amount and if you are putting a slight amount more than you have to it won't harm anything.

IMO, I wouldn't dump untreated tap water into a tank that takes me 20-30 minutes or longer to fill before I'm done.....though some people do that. If you use a Python siphon to fill your tank make sure you get the temp of your tap water within 2 degrees +/- your running tank temp. before hooking it up and filling it in your tank. Temp swings can harm or kill fish. Again, depending on the size of the tank, you are adding untreated tap water to your tank for several minutes. Some people will change out the water, dose the tank, then begin siphoning water into the tank... allowing the water to begin treatment inside the tank as it's filling. I personally like to treat the water before adding it to a tank. Another reason I personally don't do this is because tap water generally has chlorine and chloramine....mine does as well....that can kill the beneficial bacteria in your tank and harm your fish. I don't like to chance dumping it directly into the tank untreated. Fluctuating temperature is also something to consider with a Python siphon fill.

 

[Francinej]

People do it everyday... you just add the prime as you are filling your tank... no one loses fish that way...
Unless you forget to put it in... but that would just be your fault for negligence