465 Gallon Planted Amazon Biotope

[SparKy697]

A tank that size begs for an Aponogeton! WIth that height how can you go wrong?

[severum mama]

Anubias and java ferns look great IMO, but are not native to the discus' environment.

[Lonewolfblue]

[Jchillin]

OMG, how did I miss this???!!! Pleco, I'm moving this over to the planted tank forum so you can get some plant ideas (although a number of planted tank folks have already been here).

Congrats and I cannot wait to see this monster set up.

[black hills tj]

Can we get an update on how this is coming?

[Wizzard~Of~Ozz]

you can try aquariumplants.com

If you want to find plants by region, then perhaps plantgeek.net would be a good start.

Good luck with this monster (I can't recommend any driftwood places since the pieces they offer would be dwarfed by the shear size.)

Oh, Might I also suggest a wetsuit.

[sherry]

I would definately consult with Tom Barr on this. He has set up some monster tanks for his clients and would know a lot about the structural and mechanical issues involved.. I'd personally hire him just to get yourself started -- even if you completely do the design on your own. Seems like a great project, but one that might benefit from experience.

for instance what happens in an earthquake? I'd be excited but really want a second opinion on the basics.

[Pleco]

Thanks for all the sites guys

Who is Tom Barr, sorry if its a name i should recognize.

As far as what the status is, I am in a waiting game for the cabinet and tank to be made.

So far i have bought, 3 XP4's and 30 bags of Eco-Complete.

I am still debating lighting, plants, driftwood, etc...

[black hills tj]

I hope I don't seem intruding but what's the bill for a 400g tank, 30 bags of eco, etc?

[Pleco]

Originally Posted by black hills tj

I hope I don't seem intruding but what's the bill for a 400g tank, 30 bags of eco, etc?

$3500 for Tank and Cabinet

around $525 for the Eco.

I'm kinda cringing when looking at lighting, but too late to back out now!

[black hills tj]

what kind of lighting are you setting up?

[Pleco]

Originally Posted by black hills tj

what kind of lighting are you setting up?

I'm not quite sure, but I'll take any advice i can get

I was thinking something like this http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Produc...&N=2004+113352

-Pleco

[Hoovercat]

MH is the way to go but I don't think any of the ones you posted will work out for your tank. You'll need 4 or so of the halides either 150s or 250s and then CFs to even the lighting. Essentially ollollollo with the o being a MH pendant and the l being a CF tube. If you like the idea I'll round up some links for supplies.

I don't think anyone makes a fixture or a pair of fixtures that will give you what you want.

[Glenc]

I wish I could give you some advice on this monster. I have no experiance with tanks this size. I'm watching this thread with my tounge hanging out, waiting for pics!
As Wizard of Oz suggested, check out aquariumplants.com. They have a section devoted to Discus/warm water plants.
Google Tom Barr, he's been around a long time. He can tell you just about all you need to know about setting up any large tank.

[Purrbox]

Tom Barr also happens to be a member of our forum and has the username Plantbrain.

[SparKy697]

You'll need 4 or so of the halides either 150s or 250s and then CFs to even the lighting

At that level you will be generating an enormous amount of heat in the tank and in the room for that matter. You have reached the level where you will need to look at your building AC's ability to keep up. That much heat will tax even the biggest home ac system.

Isn't it great how these things just grow and grow......

[Atl300zx]

Originally Posted by Pleco

$3500 for Tank and Cabinet

around $525 for the Eco.

I'm kinda cringing when looking at lighting, but too late to back out now!

WOW, that is so much....i thought the $700-800 i've spent on my tank over the course of 18 months was insane.

I guess we all have our hobbies, like i spent 20-25k on my 300zx. I dont add the receipts up b/c i dont wanna know

[Plantbrain]

I recently set up, for the 3rd time, a 1600 gallon amazon tank.
I take care of 200 and 350 gallon SA tanks.

I think you can get some wood from there, but it's extremely costly and small.
I would give that requirement up.

There are no submersed plants to speak of in many Discus habitats.
So again, I think you will be hard pressed to stick to specific locations.

I think that you live in CA will be of use.
We have good wood here for larger tanks.

You can spend 500-2000$ or you can drive and collect it yourself, or you can make fake walls of wood etc etc. I also got some really nice wood from Tom's Cypress in Waldo FL.
Cedar is awesome from there. I collected in the wild as well.

Light, I'd suggest some MH's, 400w.

4x 250 w with 8 x 54 W T5's.
Do not skimp on this.

Set it up so you can use the MH's, 4x 54w and the last 4x54w on separate timers.
You will use the T5's mostly and then the MH's for about 3-4 hours in the mid day.
Use e ballast for the MH's. Do not use 400w MH's that is too much light for your goals.
This set up will offer you low light and moderate light and variable levels so you can adjust for the growth and algae issues in the future.

This will make life much easier and reduce cost in the long run as well as provide a more stable long term set up. Also, the MH's wash out the color of most fish, so the T5s are nicer for viewing. MH's are good for plants, but bad for viewing fish.

Fish choice and load sounds good.
There are many plecos I keep in SA tanks with many tetras, Hatchets, Pencil fish, etc.
I generally offer clients cost at wholesale + 10% for supplies and live stock. So you can end up saving a fair amount. So 400 Amano shrimp at 1.99 vs 45 cents at the Wholesaler, or Rose lines at 10$ vs 30$. You get the idea.

I do not worry too much about the SA plant theme, few do, rather, having it look like that rather than trying to piece together impossible set ups. Many plants we use are similar to what one might see, although they are not from the range.

Fish you can do pretty easily.

Since it's a large tank, hard plumb a fill line coming in, at least 3/4" pipe.
Drain, 1.5 " PVC will work good, do this on the bottom of the tank.
Run the refill through a carbon prefilter if tap water is used.
Run hot and cold to adjust for temp.

This will save you lots of time and labor.
You need to consider long term maintenance an cost here.
You can take short cuts and regret them for years to come.
Water change and in/out lets are certainly one and lighting is the other.
Do not skimp there.

I'd use the large Ehiem filters personally, 3 x 2260's ideally or a pair of those and a wet dry with overflow.

Wild fish will look best.

Regards,
Tom Barr

[Pleco]

Originally Posted by Plantbrain

I recently set up, for the 3rd time, a 1600 gallon amazon tank.
I take care of 200 and 350 gallon SA tanks.

I think you can get some wood from there, but it's extremely costly and small.
I would give that requirement up.

There are no submersed plants to speak of in many Discus habitats.
So again, I think you will be hard pressed to stick to specific locations.

I think that you live in CA will be of use.
We have good wood here for larger tanks.

You can spend 500-2000$ or you can drive and collect it yourself, or you can make fake walls of wood etc etc. I also got some really nice wood from Tom's Cypress in Waldo FL.
Cedar is awesome from there. I collected in the wild as well.

Light, I'd suggest some MH's, 400w.

4x 250 w with 8 x 54 W T5's.
Do not skimp on this.

Set it up so you can use the MH's, 4x 54w and the last 4x54w on separate timers.
You will use the T5's mostly and then the MH's for about 3-4 hours in the mid day.
Use e ballast for the MH's. Do not use 400w MH's that is too much light for your goals.
This set up will offer you low light and moderate light and variable levels so you can adjust for the growth and algae issues in the future.

This will make life much easier and reduce cost in the long run as well as provide a more stable long term set up. Also, the MH's wash out the color of most fish, so the T5s are nicer for viewing. MH's are good for plants, but bad for viewing fish.

Fish choice and load sounds good.
There are many plecos I keep in SA tanks with many tetras, Hatchets, Pencil fish, etc.
I generally offer clients cost at wholesale + 10% for supplies and live stock. So you can end up saving a fair amount. So 400 Amano shrimp at 1.99 vs 45 cents at the Wholesaler, or Rose lines at 10$ vs 30$. You get the idea.

I do not worry too much about the SA plant theme, few do, rather, having it look like that rather than trying to piece together impossible set ups. Many plants we use are similar to what one might see, although they are not from the range.

Fish you can do pretty easily.

Since it's a large tank, hard plumb a fill line coming in, at least 3/4" pipe.
Drain, 1.5 " PVC will work good, do this on the bottom of the tank.
Run the refill through a carbon prefilter if tap water is used.
Run hot and cold to adjust for temp.

This will save you lots of time and labor.
You need to consider long term maintenance an cost here.
You can take short cuts and regret them for years to come.
Water change and in/out lets are certainly one and lighting is the other.
Do not skimp there.

I'd use the large Ehiem filters personally, 3 x 2260's ideally or a pair of those and a wet dry with overflow.

Wild fish will look best.

Regards,
Tom Barr

Wow, thanks for all the advice.

A few questions,

Lighting
What is an "e-ballast" ?
Are their commercially available fixtures you can recommend, or will they all be custom built?

Plants/Wood
Thanks, I have been going in circles looking for wood/plants and havent really found anything. Hopefully i can stick to SA plants, but it looks like i will have to look for wood from another location.

As far as plumbing goes i never thought of doing that. woudlnt i have to call the company building the setup and ask them to pre cut a hole in the bottom for drain and on top for fill? This is going in to a living room, I am not particularly sure if there are water lines nearby.

Are you in California? Better yet are your services for hire?

I have spent around $4200, and have roughly around $4-5k left for this project.

-Pleco

[Hoovercat]

I've heard Mr. Barr mention clients.

http://www.championlighting.com/prod...roductid=18407 e-ballast. There are various MH fixtures that could use such a ballast. http://www.championlighting.com/home.php?cat=717 examples.