I hate you people...

[theotheragentm]

So I started into the world of aquaria for the fish. I threw in a couple of plants into my tank, which I'm not positive are aquatic yet, but it's been almost four months and they're growing and not rotting.

Anyway, back to my point. I peak into these forums to ask about my not aquatic, non rotting plants and to see pictures of people's planted tanks and now I want to go with more plants. I was at the LFS and I was seriously asking about different CO2 setups. I still have a lot of research to do, but now I have complicated this simple hobby even more by wanting a planted tank now.

That is why I hate you guys. Now onto some of my questions.

I was talking to the store owner and he was telling me about different methods to place CO2 into the water, pressurized tank, electrolysis, yeast kits. He said the tank would be the most cost effective in the long run. Is that true?

I'm planning on more plants, but I don't want to go with a huge amount like some of your tanks I've seen. Is fertilizer absolutely necessary? If my fish are pooping, am I not fertilizing?

I'm way behind on work, so this will be a ways off, but I'd like to learn as much as I can before I jump into this.

PS. I hate you guys.

 

[An t-iasg]

Don't hate me because my tank is beautiful!

The pressurized CO2 cylinder will be easiest, and best, in the long run. The initial cost is high - even after being "warned", I was still surprised that mine cost about $300. I got a package online with the regulator, the pH meter, the solonoid, tubing, and the calibration fluid for the meter. I got the cylinder and got it filled locally. You don't absolutely need a solonoid or a pH meter. I just felt that it would be easier to maintain.

I bought an ADA diffuser, but many people here have made their own diffuser very cheaply. Look in the DIY forum for the threads.

I'm not sure what an electrolysis CO2 method is. A yeast system is often called "DIY CO2". You mix yeast, sugar, and water. The yeast gives off CO2 and you simply feed it into your tank. My small 5 gallon tanks use this method. I have found that wine yeast lasts much longer than bread yeast. One thing to keep in mind that with the DIY CO2 method, it is a bit harder to maintain and keep a stable CO2 level in large (above 30 or so gallons) tanks. It can be done but it will require more work, and diligently changing the yeast-water bottles.

You can also have a very nice tank without CO2.

Fertilizing (how much and what nutrients) depends on many things - how much light you have, your fish load, or the special needs of the plants. Low-light tanks may just need a bit of trace elements, while a high-light tank needs all the macro nutrients - nitrate, phosphate, and potassium. Some plants really grow well with iron supplementation.

A good start would be to read all the stickys at the beginning of this forum. They will guide you through the things that you have to plan before getting the tank - the lighting level that you want, whether CO2 is necessary, what ferts you'll need. It's good that you're doing your research before jumping in!

 

[Jchillin]

Thanks for the kind words agentm.

As An t-isag says, you can have a very nice planted tank without CO2 injection. I happen to have such a tank. I would suggest reading through all of the stickies at the beginning of the forum to get an idea of what the various methods and needs of planted tank aquaria involve...everything from substrate to lighting is included.

I've heard of the electrolysis method. It's a piece of carbon based material that gets a static charge through it to discharge the CO2 in the water column. It's been out for just a bit but it is uncontrolled dispensing from what I've heard and that is not a good thing (hopefully someone with a bit more info on it will chime in).

Since you are a ways off, you have plenty of time to be assimilated...erm, gain all the steps and info you need.

Welcome aboard (resistance is futile).

 

[JDogg]

Welcome aboard (resistance is futile).

i know what you mean, i started with an onion plant i grew from one of those walmart bulbs and now i am planing my 5th planted tank

I'm planning on more plants, but I don't want to go with a huge amount like some of your tanks I've seen. Is fertilizer absolutely necessary? If my fish are pooping, am I not fertilizing?

yes your fish pooping will add some nutrients, but the plants need way more then your will can ever produce. you need even more if you go with CO2 and more light. if you are not sure about ferts i would go with a low light-non CO2 tank for now.

 

[Purrbox]

The light that you use over your tank determines how fast your plants are being pushed to grow. The faster they grow, the more carbon (CO2) and nutrients they'll need.

Until you go beyond medium light, the ambient CO2 levels will be enough for your plants. You could always add CO2 at lower light levels and it will help your plants grow better, but your tank will do fine without it.

Pressurized CO2 will be more of an expense upfront, but in the long run is the easiest to maintain and least expensive. I believe the that the electrolysis method is probably referring to systems like CarboPlus. These are just as expensive (if not more in the long run) as Pressurized CO2 and not as reliable or effective. They rely on an electric current to break down the KH in the water to provide carbon. This means that your KH and pH levels will be fluctuating which isn't good for the fish if you have a high KH out of the tap, or that it won't work at all if you have little to no KH to begin with. For small tanks DIY CO2 (yeast) and Flourish Excel (liquid carbon) are often the easiest solution, but for larger tanks it really is best to go with Pressurized CO2 if you can manage it.

At some point the nutrient needs of your plants will out pace the rate that your fish can supply it. This varies depending on the amount of light, the quantiy and type of plants, and the number and size of fish. Lower light tanks often only need a little bit of Potassium and Trace Fertilizer. At a certain point the Nitrates and Phosphates will start to bottom out, which is the signal that you have to dose these as well.

Now just sit back and absorb the information and relax while we assimilate you. It really is easier that way.

 

[squawkbert]

Best lighting & CO2 FAQs: RexGrigg
Best Fert Faqs AquaticPlantCentral
Best Fert Source GreggWatson

Happy Reading!

 

[theotheragentm]

I definitely need a closer look at all the stickies in this forum. I don't have high lighting on the tank. It's actually very low. I do get natural, non direct sunlight into the room every day pretty much (living along the beach in So Cal). I don't know what amount of light that adds up to at all, but the plants I have in the tank are visibly growing. If I have low light, would I be wasting my time with CO2? Is that something that has to be upgraded with the CO2? I really like my low 15-watt flourescents and the way they glow blue on my tank in the dark room.

 

[Purrbox]

You wouldn't be wasting your time with CO2 and you would get some improvements in plant growth as a result. With your lighting you can get away without it if you want though.

Something else to consider is that your fluorescent bulbs should be changed every 6-12 months. If you've had them longer than that, simply replacing the bulbs with fresh ones should get an improvement in growth. The reason is that the spectrum in the bulb shifts over time, so that after a year there has been a significant decrease in the amount of usuable light by the plants.

 

[Rupret]

From my experience on beginning a planted with an already established tank, you are apt to have some (ok, maybe a lot) of frustration, but in the end it is well worth the effort. Once you get started and get some high output lights, you will need CO2 and definately nutrient dosing. I initially overlooked the nutrients and have had desperate fights with algae.

I would also recommend a pressurized CO2 injection. I works wonderfully. My set up was around $250. I am running 3 watts/gallon of light; 384 watts for a 125 gallon tank. I do weekly PWCs, check water chemistry every week, add nutrients daily, and have added a UV light filter to control the algae. It is really not too difficult once you get going and the plants get established. Just don't give up.

The people here on Aquarium Advice give excellent advice. Purrbox has given me a lot. Just a word caution, I have gotten a lot of really poor advice from my local fish stores, so confirm any advice they you here. Another excellent resource is a book entitled "The Simply Guide to Planted Aquariums" by Barber and Wilson. The book really helped me out and the advice in the book is consistent AA here.

Good luck and enjoy!

 

[SeanMurphy]

Below is an example of my planted tank. Just a bunch of livebearers, a trio of corys, a baby pleco and two mystery snails. I don't use CO2 (just the air bubble wand), and I haven't fertilized in months (though I do have 6 root tabs in total, each under a major plant cluster). I've got 88W of 6400K light from CF bulbs in a DIY fixture made from the shell of the one that came with the hood, and a lot of light bulb sockets and glue.

 

[Robert H]

I've heard of the electrolysis method. It's a piece of carbon based material that gets a static charge through it to discharge the CO2 in the water column. It's been out for just a bit but it is uncontrolled dispensing from what I've heard and that is not a good thing (hopefully someone with a bit more info on it will chime in).

Actually it has been around for about ten years. Its called the Carbo Plus. Its easy to set up, very un intimadating, but extremely expensive and marginally effective. You have to have hard water in order for it to work. It strips the carbonate out of your water to make C02. It is a black carbon bar inside a chrome metal clip "sandwich" that sits inside your aquarium. A cable runs from the sandwich to a control box outside the aquarium which has different settings. The control box is plugged into an electrical outlet. The blocks are supposed to last three months, but often times only last for as little as 3 or 4 weeks. I think the cost of the blocks is now up to about 40 dollars to replace. The whole metal sandwich with the block is quite a bit more. As it strips the water to make C02, layers of calcium become encrusted on the metal sandwich. You have to clean it off regularly or the unit stops functioning, and then you have to buy the whole new metal sandwich instead of just a replacement block.

The most C02 you can get out of one unit in a 20 to 30 gallon aquarium is about 10ppm and that is only if your KH is fairly high.

The product is made in Germany and exported to this country, and every year keeps getting higher and higher in price. Supposedly there is a Chinese knock off/rip off of this product, but you hardly ever see it any where.

Robert Hudson
www.aquabotanic.com
Read my column in FAMA magazine
"The Planted Tank!"

 

[Sidi]

Don't hate. Just imagine when you invite friends over and they look at your tank. Absolutely crystal clear water, fish frolicking, and plants growing everywhere.

They probably had a goldfish in a bowl once that died. They can't figure out why. But you'll be the hero because you have this lush, beautiful oasis in your living room that hypnotizes people for hours.

Edit: Oh, and don't underestimate the power of a beautiful fish tank at a party. As long as a drunk doesn't stumble and smash it, a nice tank will provide endless entertainment to inebriated people.

 

[theotheragentm]

Actually, my tank is in my bedroom.

 

[happygirl65]

Thanks for the kind words agentm.

As An t-isag says, you can have a very nice planted tank without CO2 injection. I happen to have such a tank. I would suggest reading through all of the stickies at the beginning of the forum to get an idea of what the various methods and needs of planted tank aquaria involve...everything from substrate to lighting is included.

Since you are a ways off, you have plenty of time to be assimilated...erm, gain all the steps and info you need.

Welcome aboard (resistance is futile).

I second that emotion!

This is a pic of my tank. This is a 55 gallon and I dont use any co2. I only had an algae problem before I got enough plants in there to use up the nutrients produced by the fish and the lights. I have 1.7 watts per gallon of light over this tank which gives me many plant options without the need for CO2. I use root tabs mostly for ferts. But each tank is different of course, read the stickies! And then know that you will always need to do your own adjusting in your tank. After a few months now, I have only small traces of algae that is dissapearing more everyday and my plants are thriving.

Best wishes to you, I am sure you will love it.