I killed MTS!

[fish_4_all]

Actually I don't know if i killed them but they are all dead in one tank and have been for a while, well 1 a couple days ago but anyway. I don't know what happened. I think maybe my substrate is too large and heavy. The pond snails are thriving and multiplying like crazy. There was very little debris in the gravel especially since I removed every plant in the tank and expected to see a blackout.

Nitrates 10
Ammonia 0
PO4 2
Gas pockets but not Hydrogen sulfide, no odor! I am in the process of a complete gravel cleaning except around my Red Wendtii to see if any snails are still alive. Thinking maybe it was just the adults that died.

Any suggestion as to what might have caused it?

 

[Jchillin]

It could be due to low mg and ca. Are the shells are very light gray and crumbly?

 

[fish_4_all]

Holes in the shells and the snail bodies look like they have been dead for quite some time. I guess it could be a lack of calcium but I have put zuchini, romaine, algae wafers and all that jazz since before I got them for the BN and cories. It might have been a delayed death from shipping but living for 3 weeks then dying from shipping doesn't seem like a likely scenario. Hopefully they survived better in my other tank and I can reseed my tank with them. I figured with all the shells in my substrate and the shells from dead snails I would have had plenty for them.

Wouldn't a calcium deficiency have effected the pond snails? Which btw I found numerous egg cases for on the vals and they are thriving?

 

[Jchillin]

It's possible, that's why I asked about the shells. I had encountered similar issues with mine, the ramshorns seem to have had tolerate it a lot better than the MTS. If it isn't ca, your explanation could fit. Do you know your GH?

 

[fish_4_all]

GH always stays above 7 kGH with or without dosing MgSO4 so I don't know. All I know is it was really dissapointing to see them all dead. But who knows, I managed to almost kill java fern so snails dying shouldn't be a surprise. Would my pH staying about 6.6 have any negative effects with a KH of 7-10 dKH. It could be calcium deficiency. Maybe the shells and coral pieces that were in there have lost all the calium and only the carbonate is left giving me the KH false readings. I am going to check my other tank here in a few minutes to see how they are doing in there. I at least saw one alive in there eating a piece of lettuce last night.

 

[Jchillin]

With those numbers, I would doubt a calcium deficiency...by comparison, mine is usually at >4 and I had to dose them to keep things up to snuff. Your numbers fine and are just a little better than mine, my water has almost nothing in it. I also have a kh of 3.

 

[fish_4_all]

My tap water is reverse omosified so it is clean as a whistle which makes it hard to figure out where my GH comes from but oh well. Maybe I will get lucky and enough actually are still alive that I will see larger numbers of them soon. Could always drop a big cuddle bone in there to see if that helps.

I might just set up a small tank for them if I find any alive so they can reproduce in there. Have to clean my other tank first to see how many I have to work with if any. Maybe I will set it up with CC so they have plenty. Just kidding but it is frustrating to kill something so indestructible.

 

[fish_4_all]

Well both tanks are toast. Not a single living MTS in any of them. I supposed there could be little ones too small to see that will come along sooner or later but for now I am at a loss.

Tank1/Tank2
GH 8/9
KH 6/7
pH 6.6/6.6
Tank 1 75% water change, tank 2 50%, measured before dosing

It really doesn't make any sense but oh well. The pond/ramshorns are thriving so I guess they will control some of the minimul algae I should have. As for stirring the gravel. I haven't a clue until I can find out what is killing the MTS. Guess it is back to gravel vacs and moving plants.

 

[fish_4_all]

Well not all is lost as I have seen 3 in one tank and 2 in the other but they are small. Hopefully a little crushed coral will serve them well and they will start to reproduce.

 

[7Enigma]

Just saw something interesting last night for the first time. About 7pm I notice about 5 adult size MTS on the surface, some with their openings facing upward (like they are sunning themselves ). Later that night before the lights went out I noticed one was about 1/2 way up a small java fern leaf. I woke up this morning and a baby MTS was resting on one of my large anubias leaves. So I'm wondering if the lack of food in the substrate is causing the slow growth of these buggers and they are now leaving the substrate in search of food.

I almost want to take a bunch out of the substrate and lay them on my algae covered leaves and see if they help at all before I start a blackout.

I think tonight I will bury an algae wafer against the front glass and check to see who is there in the morning.

 

[krap101]

i dunno but my mts seem to come out more at night. usually on the walls.

 

[travis simonson]

I'm just guessing here becuase I've never had any problems keeping MTS, but I suspect that they do require a certain amount of Ca and Mg. I've got a 125G with about 50% Cichlid Sand, which is a carbonate buffered substrate loaded with Ca and Mg and my MTS thrive in it. I also have 30G grow-out tank with ADA Aquasoil which is about as far away from Cichlid Sand as you can get and I've noticed that my MTS do not survive long at all in it. I suspect it is a Ca/Mg issue.

 

[fish_4_all]

Yah, I think it is a lot to do with calcium in my tanks. I think my GH is 90% Mg, should have ordered calcium when I got my ferts but that is ok. I also think my pH is too low at 6.6 so the combination is really hard on them. That doesn't explain the pond snails but they are all different i guess so who knows.

Anyone know a good local source of calcium other than calcium carbonate because I don't need a higher Kh in my tanks, just calcium.

 

[7Enigma]

travis simonson,

That wouldn't explain my problem. My GH is about 10degrees. I've really got to get a printout of my local water. I could just see it now being 95% Mg, that would explain a lot of problems (though my MTS shells look healthy).

Last night 5min before lights out I took an algae wafer and buried it in the substrate about an inch from the front of the tank. I buried it so that its longways up, so I'll have to see if I can find a bunch of MTS nearby.

Funny thing is I woke up last night to make a bottle for my daughter at 3am and took a quick peek with a flashlight and noticed my cory cat was sitting RIGHT over the spot where it was buried.

Came in this morning to feed right before the lights turned on and sure enough the cory was in the SAME spot, so I'm pretty sure he knows whats down there.

 

[Jaybird]

I have a similar problem, but it starts with my geophagus. He keeps eating all my MTS. I bought a dozen and put them in the tank. I didn't think he would be capable of the deed, but I guess persistence pays. I now have about nine half-crushed shells on the substrate and it has only been three days that they have been in there.

 

[7Enigma]

I have a similar problem, but it starts with my geophagus. He keeps eating all my MTS. I bought a dozen and put them in the tank. I didn't think he would be capable of the deed, but I guess persistence pays. I now have about nine half-crushed shells on the substrate and it has only been three days that they have been in there.

Might think of creating a "safe haven" spot in a corner of the tank. Use something like a thin plastic mesh (people on here use it for making plant lawns of HC and such), and build a 1/2" house or so that will allow them to surface at night and not get nibbled.