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Old 06-07-2007, 07:38 AM   #1
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Nutrient Deficiencies...Please help me identify

Here are the pics













Here is a pic from last month (look at the glosso)



Here is a pic from last week (a lot less glosso)



Background:

55 G, Dose greg watson ferts mwf (all of them at the same time, was told this was bad, this will be the first thing i change).

CO2 = over 40 ppm

Light = 9-11am 130watts, 11-7 pm 260watts, 7-9pm 130 watts.
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Old 06-07-2007, 10:48 AM   #2
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The first picture looks like GSA and would be a sign of low phosphate.

The remaining pictures look like either a macro deficiency (probably nitrate or potassium) or it could be the result of say a pleco rasping too hard on the leaves.

I would switch your dosing so that the Traces and Phosphate aren't being dosed on the same day first. Wait 2-3 weeks to see if there is any improvement. If you're still seeing the GSA in the first photo, then I'd up your Phosphate dosing. Give it another 2-3 weeks. Continue adjusting your dosing in the same manner until everything is growing well again. You need to give it 2-3 weeks between changes so that the plants have a chance to react to the changes you've made. Less than that, and you're still seeing the effects of earlier dosing. Some of the damage may not heal itself, so you're mainly looking to ensure that the damage doesn't continue to get worse. Once you've got your dosing inline, you'll want to trim off all (or most) of the affected leaves so that the plants focus on new growth instead of trying to repair the old growth.
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Old 06-07-2007, 10:59 AM   #3
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I dont have any plecos, i have 1 CAE, 2 SAE, 1 Flying Fox, and 5 Otos.

The holes i really do believe are from a defeciencies....so u think nitrates (usually keep them at 50-90 ppm) or potassiums are the culprit?


The star grass is definately not from the fish, it has always looked like that, the new growth looks like that oftne.
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Old 06-07-2007, 01:12 PM   #4
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If your Nitrate readings are correct (ie you are using a calibrated liquid test kit), then it's probably either Phosphate or Potassium. Since you've got what appears to be GSA on the one plant, I'd still go with upping your Phosphate as the next step after you start dosing your Phosphates and Traces on opposite days. If your Phosphates have bottomed out it would cause both the GSA and prevent the plants from being able to use Nitrates.
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Old 06-07-2007, 01:37 PM   #5
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Joy is right.

If you mix your PO4 and Iron, they will negate each other leading to deficiencies. This is why it is recommended to dose them on separate days. Certainly do not mix them together if you are making a premix.

Definitely GSA on what looks like your Ludwigia. - Low PO4 and high light for over 8 hours can cause GSA. IME you will always have some GSA with high light. Just have to manage it buy keeping full blast lighting to a minimum (8 hours).

The Alternanthera reineckii (again a guess) looks like emersed growth die-off to me. Trim the bottoms and replant the tops. Also make sure your Nitrates are consistently high.

The Stargrass - a deficiency for sure, but I do not have enough experience with the plant to tell you exactly why it would do that. The tops look good and that plant is a weed. If you trim off the bottoms and replant you should see it come around.

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Old 06-07-2007, 02:20 PM   #6
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Ok so how does this sound?

MWF 1/2 tsp KN03, 1/8 tsp KH2P04

TuThSa 1/8 tsp K2S04, 1/8 tsp (CSM+B) Trace Elements

Water Changes on monday (dose after)

What does anyone think of my glosso death???
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Old 06-07-2007, 02:25 PM   #7
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Is that flourite you have it in? I tried Glosso 2-3 times in flourite with no success. Then I switched to Eco-complete and it grew so fast I ended up getting rid of it.
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Old 06-07-2007, 03:05 PM   #8
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Yes it is flourite....

i didnt know there were issues with this substrate. it would be easier to swap Ground covers.....anyone have success with anything else in Flourite?
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Old 06-07-2007, 04:11 PM   #9
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The biggest problem I had with Flourite was the grain-size. Most foreground plants like a small grain size - makes it easier for them to spread around. Glosso, HC, Hairgrass are all good examples. The only plant that I got to grow low and thick in Fluorite was HM. It is more of a midground plant though really.

Also - how old is your Flourite? I can't remember exactly - but Flourite has an effective life span of 1 or 2 years (perhaps someone else can correct me on that). It is also best not-mixed with gravel. I got better growth when I added Laterite over the top of mine. After a few weeks it sinks in below the Flourite and seems to provide better nutrients to the plants.
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Old 06-07-2007, 04:14 PM   #10
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17 months, should i work in some laterite? i wanted to make some underlating surfaces anways, this would give me the change to shuffle things around.
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Old 06-08-2007, 06:35 PM   #11
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Laterite may help, yes.
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Old 06-08-2007, 07:58 PM   #12
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how many lbs do u suggest?
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Old 06-09-2007, 02:40 PM   #13
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I would think 2 like this would be enough:

http://www.bigalsonline.com/BigAlsUS...relaterite55oz
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Old 06-09-2007, 02:49 PM   #14
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I found an article a while back that discussed stargrass and how it was a great indicator plant for nutrient deficiencies. This little chart has proven helpful to me, maybe it will help you solve your issues too.

Sorry I did not keep the whole article, just the chart:


- Lack of N - leaves turn pale and transparent.
- Lack of P - tips will start turning black. Holes may develope.
- Lack of K - plant will stunt.
- Lack of micros (Fe) - plant will become transparent.
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Old 06-10-2007, 08:10 AM   #15
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good info, sounds like a lack of N, K and Fe, prob all caused by dosing the K and Fe the saem day. i changed from doing that, lets hope this solves my problem.
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Old 06-10-2007, 11:18 AM   #16
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Perhaps a typo - but it is P(hosphate) and Fe that you do not want to dose together
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Old 06-10-2007, 08:35 PM   #17
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whoops, that is what i meant, i switched to dosing macros on one day and micros the next.
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