Plant newb, suggestions?

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majolo

Aquarium Advice Freak
Joined
Jul 14, 2006
Messages
263
Location
West Central MN
Well, I've got all the fish I'm planning on, so even though I wasn't really thinking about plants for my first tank, well, I'm thinking... :lol:

So I thought I'd check in with the experts to see what tips and suggestions there are before I go place a big order. Here's what the tank's like:
55 gal, medium walmart gravel, single satellite compact fluorescent fixture with 2 end-to-end 65W 50/50 bulbs (what the fixture comes with), established about a month and a half, fishstock in My Info. I may want to add a mystery snail. Also, my water is hard & alkaline.

Here are changes I am willing or not willing to do:
Willing:
change to a different bulb
dose liquid fertilizers

Not Willing:
change substrate
change light fixture
do too much mucking around with substrate fertilizers
pressurized CO2

So with that info in mind, what am I looking at as far as plants? I think in a thread when I was planning to buy this light fixture, someone said I am now at ~1.5wpg, low to medium light; is that right? So I gather that I could work with a lot of Anubias, a lot of Crypts, Java Fern & Moss, that sort would do fine? Are there any vals or similar looking background plants that would work?

Also, I have no idea how many plants to get. Are those package deals that some online stores offer a decent guideline as far as numbers?

And finally, I've been seriously underwhelmed by most of the plants at fish stores around here. One place has nice specimens, but only like 3 or 4 different plants, and asking $25 for an Anubias... 8O
The others are chain stores, Petco/Petsmart, and their plants look, well... lousy. Petco has no lights on its plant tank! Just ambient. So anyway, is it worth trying lousy-looking plants? I'll probably mail order, but I though I'd ask.
 
Well, I dont know as much about plants as many others on this forum but...

The 50/50 bulbs should be replaced I think, because the 50 thats actinic doesnt help the freshwater plants.

I have many similar questions as your regarding mail order so I will be looking closely at this...

The other option is to check the barter/trade section of the forum to see what people are parting with for plants.

HTH

Steve
 
To start I think that light fixture would be perfect. It would give you a great easy beginning and see if you want more trouble (I mean fun :) ). If you want later on, you can replace one of the bulbs with a 6700K bulb or other and increase your lighting by 1.5X or 2.0X depending on if you only replace one or both bulbs.

Take it from me, you want to plant heavily from the start (including some fast growers), go with an online retailer for good quality plants if your local stores have junk. It's not worth the time nor effort to baby a bad plant back. This also creates a ripe situation for algae to grow since you've got damaged leaves that can leak nutrients into the water (say hello to BBA, staghorn, brush, etc).

DIY CO2 while not needed at your 50/50 light level will not be required but I would try to talk you into it. Your water is perfect for this as well.

Be careful with the mystery snail, you might just buy a plant eating maching... :)

You mention you are fully fish stocked. Other than your ghost shrimp, you have no algae eating species present (the cory's won't even look at algae in my experience). I would highly recommend a team of algae eaters, mainly a BN pleco, Oto's, SAE (need to be properly identified!), and if you can find them some nerite snails. This will give you a sort of buffer between messing up, and a tank full of algae.

Please note, a planted tank is IMO far more work than you might expect (especially at higher light levels). The results can be catastrophic or incredible (and the difference between the two is much closer than you might think :) ). There is also a lot of information to digest regarding deficiencies, algae types/causes, and maintainence. I started off getting an anubias and 2 java ferns for my 20gallon with stock 16w NO light. Thought I would be fine adding nothing to the tank since I had a high fish load and low light level.

Look where I'm at now........

afterwoflash.jpg



Goodluck! :)

EDIT:

And czcz from this forum in the barter/trade section gave me all of the plants you see in that picture except for the anubias and java fern. Most were just very small clippings that have been propogated for a couple months now. Use the B/T forum! But make sure to get a good start you know what plants you are getting and their light requirements ahead of time.
 
Please note, a planted tank is IMO far more work than you might expect (especially at higher light levels). The results can be catastrophic or incredible (and the difference between the two is much closer than you might think ).

That is very well said 7enigma.

I wanted to say that I also think that for what you say you are looking to do, you are fine right now. Algae crew would be nice, at a minimum BN pleco and Oto's. Stay with Anubias, Java Ferns, and Mosses. I think most vals would do just fine. A wall of vals along the back of the tank looks great.
 
I definitely want to stick with low light now. I get the idea from threads here that DIY CO2 is a no-go on a 55g. For some reason I had the idea that mystery snails were plant-safe, oh well, scratch that snail.

For algae eaters, my selection is a little limited. I don't think I've seen any BN plecos at local stores. Otos I have seen, and I could probably fit a few in since the bulk of my fish are small tetras, low waste producers. As long as they would get along with the corys. I may check the Twin Cities for nerite snails, since I guess snails should travel better than fish, right? Are the nerite snails listed for marine aquariums the same? (E.g. http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=1472 ) Or perhaps they would be too shocked by the change even if they're the same species...?

Thanks for your comments, and beautiful tank shot! I think I'm ok with the work. I'm sort of doing this so I'll have something to do with the tank besides just feeding/cleaning/watching.
 
DIY CO2 is possible on any size tank, and on a lower light tank even getting 10-15ppm instead of the ambient 1-3ppm will make a difference. It all comes down to efficiency getting and keeping the CO2 you generate in the water. You can have a pressurized CO2 system blowing incredible amounts into the tank, but if you have a poor diffuser (say just the tube in the tank) your levels may still be low.

The term mystery snail encompasses many different species (and probably genus' if you look far enough). Many are very peaceful and will clean your tank walls, some will eat only dead plants and food matter, and some will raze your entire plantlife in a weekend! There are some mystery snail websites that you can google for that give differentiation and buying tips.

Oto's are as peaceful as they come (just like cory's), you can get a nice school of them and they will increase your bioload very little. Purchasing these involves a lot of sleuth work to get a good group (they are very fragile fish and go through awful conditions to get to your LFS), you want the biggest of the group, you want them to have been in the store for at least a week or two, and many recommend treating them for parasites prior to tank addition (though I have never done this).

You need freshwater nerite snails. All nerite snails are originally SW (or brackish), they are slowly weaned into FW. Once in FW they do not multiply, they DO NOT touch live plant matter, but are algae eating MACHINES. Or so I've read, I have yet to obtain any for my tank.

A BN pleco is a much larger fish than the rest, but can consume a great deal of algae types as well, and looks very unique. They are also generally peaceful as long as you only have 1 in the tank.

SAE's are considered the best overall algae eater you can get, BUT, you need to ensure its a true SAE and not a CAE which is a poor algae eater than generally gets large and aggressive. They eat algae types that few others will touch, and are generally considered the only fish that will eat the dreaded BBA.
 
If you really want to get a snail, check out the AppleSnail species page. It details the differences between snails so that you can select one that will be plant safe for your tank. Basically you are looking for the Pomacea bridgesii which comes in a wonderful variety of colors that aren't usually found in your LFS. Most LFS only carry the Yellow and Wild Type Brigs.

Your currently lighting is perfect for starting out with plants. Check out the PlantGeek Plant Guide and look at the listings by Lighting Requirements. Most anything listed under Low or Medium Low Light should work well in your tank. Another plant similar to Vals that would likely do well with your Lighting are Sags.

As far as ferts go, you will most likely only need to dose a good Trace mix (Flourish Comprehensive, Tropica Master Grow, or CSM+B) and Potassium (Flourish Potassium or K2SO4). Keep an eye on your Nitrates (Flourish Nitrogen or KNO3) and Phosphates (Flourish Phosphorus or KH2PO4), if either starts to bottom out you'll need to start dosing them as well. It might be a good idea to have these on hand just in case, especially if you end up ordering from GregWatson as the shipping is the bulk of the price.

CO2 definately isn't necessary with your currently lighting, but would be beneficial for your plants if you ever decide to give it a try. Unfortunately your tank is large enough that while DIY CO2 is possible it would probably end up being a headache. I would recommend waiting until you are ready to bump the lighting and then investing in a Pressurized CO2 Setup. The natural inconsistancies of DIY CO2 especially at low levels could easily induce a BBA outbreak which is a royal pain to get rid of.

If you end up getting Swords, Crypts, or other heavy root feeders I would highly recommend considering Root Tabs. These will give the plants an extra boost that they need with minimal expense. Just place one under the plant and replace every few months. Really simple.

Definately plant as heavily as possible from the start. This will help balance the tank and avoid algae issues. Your best bet is to check out the Barter/Trade section to see what other members have available. If you don't see what you're looking for, you can always post a list of what you're looking for. Often people may not have it available immediately but will be able to send you some within a couple of weeks. If you don't have luck there, then I would recommend checking out AquariumPlants or Lowcoaster on Aquabid. I've used AquariumPlants in the past and would gladly order again, Lowcoaster gets lots of recommendations from the members here and I plan to try him out in the future.
 
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