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Old 05-21-2007, 04:07 AM   #1
kaz
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Plant problems help

I have a few issues I like to make aware to the more experience ones.
1. Java fern has some leafs that are dark brown or black around the edges (some with wholes or gaps) even some stems are that color.
what can be the cause of this.

2. I have to species of Ludwigia one is repens which is find but the other is a bit red and bigger leafs, the problem is that I am noticing black dots on the leafs and now I am noticing holes and on the leafs edges are cut up like some one has been taking bites out of them.

3. I bought what they sold to me as an amazon sword with a runner and 2 smaller version on the runner, one of the main leafs of the main plants started to with a hole and turn transperent and now a week later half the leaf is all transperent and disolving. likewise with the small 2 plants on the runner is doing the same thing, 2 leafs are just fully transperent.
What might be the cause of this?

if I do have a fish that eats plants which one is it?
should I take out all the black leafs or leave them?
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75g/Rena Xp3/Inline Heater/Rena Air 200/Eco-Complete/Current Dual Daylight System
6 Rummy Nose, 9 Ottos, 2 Yoyo Loach, 1 Golden Nugget Pleco, 2 Julli's Cory, 4 Angelicus Botia, 1 Chocolate Kuhli Loach, 3 Ghost Shrimp, 1 SAE, 1 Black Mollie, 1 Redeye Swordtail Mollie, 1 C-Pleco, MTS, Guppy's
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Argentine Sword, Amazon Sword, Micro Sword, Xmas Moss, Pennywort, Hornwort, Jave Fern, Baby Tears, Moneywort, Ludwigia, Wisteria, Giant Bacoba, Hygro 'Sunset'
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Old 05-21-2007, 07:54 AM   #2
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In order to help, you need to post your tank specs, inhabitants, dosing schedule/method, Co2 use, lighting, photoperiod, etc...
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Old 05-21-2007, 08:40 AM   #3
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Read through this:

http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/Fertil...eficiency.html

It lists the most common nutrient deficiencies. HTH
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Old 05-21-2007, 05:06 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrettyFishies
In order to help, you need to post your tank specs, inhabitants, dosing schedule/method, Co2 use, lighting, photoperiod, etc...
I'm not sure if it shows or not but I have my sig that is in every post showing but again i'm not sure if everyone sees it so here it is.

I thank you all for your attention and time!
75g/Rena Xp3/Inline Heater/Rena Air 200/Eco-Complete/Current Dual Daylight System 2x65w 8hrs a day
6 Rummy Nose, 9 Ottos, 2 Yoyo Loach, 1 Golden Nugget Pleco, 2 Julli's Cory, 4 Angelicus Botia, 1 Chocolate Kuhli Loach, 3 Ghost Shrimp, 1 SAE, 1 Black Mollie, 1 Redeye Swordtail Mollie, 1 C-Pleco, MTS, Guppy's
Plants
Argentine Sword, Amazon Sword, Micro Sword, Xmas Moss, Pennywort, Hornwort, Jave Fern, Baby Tears, Moneywort, Ludwigia, Wisteria, Hygro 'Sunset'


I dose on mondays and thursdays with a small cup of hot water
I toss 1/2tsp of potassium sulfate and 1/4 of csm+b, possibly every two weeks I dose a pinch of potassium nitrate and potassium phosphate if necessary do to the readings of my test tubes.

I'm changes about three times a week only 5g at a time of water, I am not vac at all the substrate.

I do not have co2, I have the outtake of xp3 pointing towards the surface of the water and have a limestone running 24/7

I feed once or twice a day and occasionally i skip a day.
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I thank you all for your attention and time!
75g/Rena Xp3/Inline Heater/Rena Air 200/Eco-Complete/Current Dual Daylight System
6 Rummy Nose, 9 Ottos, 2 Yoyo Loach, 1 Golden Nugget Pleco, 2 Julli's Cory, 4 Angelicus Botia, 1 Chocolate Kuhli Loach, 3 Ghost Shrimp, 1 SAE, 1 Black Mollie, 1 Redeye Swordtail Mollie, 1 C-Pleco, MTS, Guppy's
Plants
Argentine Sword, Amazon Sword, Micro Sword, Xmas Moss, Pennywort, Hornwort, Jave Fern, Baby Tears, Moneywort, Ludwigia, Wisteria, Giant Bacoba, Hygro 'Sunset'
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Old 05-21-2007, 05:41 PM   #5
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Yeah, I can't see your sig...

You've got 1.8 wpg which is not going to be enough for some of the plants that you have. But, once you raise the wpg, you'll need Co2 or at the very least Excel. I recommend Co2 as I have had great results once I added my pressurized system.

You can probably increase your potassium dosing. I'm not sure what 1/2 tsp in 75 gal of water gets you, but it sounds like you need more - aim to add 20-25 ppm each dosing - you can't really overdose potassium.

The same for the csm+b - I would do that 3x a week.

Sounds like you have the sprybar pointing UP and causing surface agitation. that's BAD. You need to surface to remain still so that the CO2 that's there doesn't escape. there' really no need to run an airstone as the plants will supply enough O2 to keep the fish healthy.

I would change the water once a week and do anywhere from 50-75% at a time. That will reset the system and you'll need to dose soon after to prevent a nutrient crash.
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Old 05-21-2007, 06:19 PM   #6
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from my understanding and research its the opposite of what your saying prettyfishies,
I read over and over again that since I do not have co2 P. I need to keep the co2 in tank with ambient meaning alot of surface agitation, with a P. co2 system then I would do as possible to keep water surface calm so the P. co2 is not released.

for example tom barrs one of the many advice and readings I have done with medium to medium low light tanks is that do not do water changes often maybe once or twice a month. because of low co2 and light levels you have possiblities of BBA when changing the water often and producing co2 fuctuation will cause BBA, I understand that one must place water in buckets and leave for more than 24hrs so co2 settles and escapes but I don't have the luxury of have five to ten buckets around the house to do a major 50% pwc. I have one or two 5g buckets that I have them sit with water for around 48hrs and then empty water from my tank and add the bucket water, to keep BBA under control, I will be dosing one or two capfuls of flourish excel though.
I clean my filter twice a month.

All this is what I have been told from the majority, and or read from the majority info on the web, but again I am open minded and just letting you know what I have come across with maybe I am wrong and your right, thats why I always post and post question over and over again because I do not know anything for sure and I consider myself a rookie still even after about six years in the fish world starting with a bowl and a betta lol.

I appreciate everything and would like more feedback from everyone including prettyfishies input on this. I learn something new every week in this hobby. again I thank you all.

keep on coming
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75g/Rena Xp3/Inline Heater/Rena Air 200/Eco-Complete/Current Dual Daylight System
6 Rummy Nose, 9 Ottos, 2 Yoyo Loach, 1 Golden Nugget Pleco, 2 Julli's Cory, 4 Angelicus Botia, 1 Chocolate Kuhli Loach, 3 Ghost Shrimp, 1 SAE, 1 Black Mollie, 1 Redeye Swordtail Mollie, 1 C-Pleco, MTS, Guppy's
Plants
Argentine Sword, Amazon Sword, Micro Sword, Xmas Moss, Pennywort, Hornwort, Jave Fern, Baby Tears, Moneywort, Ludwigia, Wisteria, Giant Bacoba, Hygro 'Sunset'
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Old 05-21-2007, 08:34 PM   #7
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At 1.8 wpg I don't see the need for the co2, but it doesn't hurt. I have 2wpg and don't use co2, change 30-50% of the water once a week.

The Sword plants are heavy root feeders and when mine start showing the problems you state I know its time for another plant tab. I also think a little more potassium sulfate would help.
I would remove the damaged leaves on the sword, if will grow new ones faster than trying to repair the damaged ones.

It also sounds like your nitrate might be bottoming out.

I always dose potassium and csm&b on different days.
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Old 05-21-2007, 08:52 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoHobbies
At 1.8 wpg I don't see the need for the co2, but it doesn't hurt. I have 2wpg and don't use co2, change 30-50% of the water once a week.

The Sword plants are heavy root feeders and when mine start showing the problems you state I know its time for another plant tab. I also think a little more potassium sulfate would help.
I would remove the damaged leaves on the sword, if will grow new ones faster than trying to repair the damaged ones.

It also sounds like your nitrate might be bottoming out.

I always dose potassium and csm&b on different days.
why would I need to insert tablets when I have eco?
I will start dosing more of potassium and csm+b too

my nitrates are 10 to 15
my phosphate is 1.0

why is it good to dose on different days one thing and another on the other day?
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I thank you all for your attention and time!
75g/Rena Xp3/Inline Heater/Rena Air 200/Eco-Complete/Current Dual Daylight System
6 Rummy Nose, 9 Ottos, 2 Yoyo Loach, 1 Golden Nugget Pleco, 2 Julli's Cory, 4 Angelicus Botia, 1 Chocolate Kuhli Loach, 3 Ghost Shrimp, 1 SAE, 1 Black Mollie, 1 Redeye Swordtail Mollie, 1 C-Pleco, MTS, Guppy's
Plants
Argentine Sword, Amazon Sword, Micro Sword, Xmas Moss, Pennywort, Hornwort, Jave Fern, Baby Tears, Moneywort, Ludwigia, Wisteria, Giant Bacoba, Hygro 'Sunset'
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Old 05-21-2007, 09:34 PM   #9
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why would I need to insert tablets when I have eco?
Eco is quite good at holding the nutrients which enter it. It's not very rich out of the bag though. My swords need root tabs in it as well.

I dose all except PO4 on one day and PO4 only the next. Fe and PO4 can react in a tank in some instances causing the Iron to be useless to the plants.
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Old 05-21-2007, 10:03 PM   #10
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You're correct that having surface agitation in a non CO2 injected aquarium is a good thing. Since there isn't extra CO2 to gas off, it actually helps to keep levels up where they need to be.

Depending on how long the EcoComplete has been in use, any existing nutrients that came in the bag would be exhausted. This is true of any nutrient rich substrate. On average most last about a year. After that you have to start supplementing it. Of course there are heavy root feeders like the swords that appreciate the extra nutrients even if the EcoComplete is still relatively new.

1/2 tsp of K2SO4 is only 4.74ppm of Potassium. I would recommend dosing 2-4 times your current amount. Your CSM+B dosing is 0.261ppm fe and pretty much right where you want it. I'd start with the increase in Potassium dosing and see how your tank is doing afer 2-3 weeks. Keep a close eye on the Nitrates and Phosphates as the plants may start using more if they've been Potassium limited for awhile and suddenly aren't anymore.

CSM+B and Potassium can be dosed on the same day, it's Phosphates that can't be dosed at the same time as CSM+B.
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Old 05-22-2007, 03:50 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Purrbox
You're correct that having surface agitation in a non CO2 injected aquarium is a good thing. Since there isn't extra CO2 to gas off, it actually helps to keep levels up where they need to be.

Depending on how long the EcoComplete has been in use, any existing nutrients that came in the bag would be exhausted. This is true of any nutrient rich substrate. On average most last about a year. After that you have to start supplementing it. Of course there are heavy root feeders like the swords that appreciate the extra nutrients even if the EcoComplete is still relatively new.

1/2 tsp of K2SO4 is only 4.74ppm of Potassium. I would recommend dosing 2-4 times your current amount. Your CSM+B dosing is 0.261ppm fe and pretty much right where you want it. I'd start with the increase in Potassium dosing and see how your tank is doing afer 2-3 weeks. Keep a close eye on the Nitrates and Phosphates as the plants may start using more if they've been Potassium limited for awhile and suddenly aren't anymore.

CSM+B and Potassium can be dosed on the same day, it's Phosphates that can't be dosed at the same time as CSM+B.
2-4 times my current per day (of the dosing day) or weekly?
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75g/Rena Xp3/Inline Heater/Rena Air 200/Eco-Complete/Current Dual Daylight System
6 Rummy Nose, 9 Ottos, 2 Yoyo Loach, 1 Golden Nugget Pleco, 2 Julli's Cory, 4 Angelicus Botia, 1 Chocolate Kuhli Loach, 3 Ghost Shrimp, 1 SAE, 1 Black Mollie, 1 Redeye Swordtail Mollie, 1 C-Pleco, MTS, Guppy's
Plants
Argentine Sword, Amazon Sword, Micro Sword, Xmas Moss, Pennywort, Hornwort, Jave Fern, Baby Tears, Moneywort, Ludwigia, Wisteria, Giant Bacoba, Hygro 'Sunset'
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Old 05-22-2007, 09:38 AM   #12
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10-20ppm of Potassium twice a week.
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