Cloudy Eye Box Fish

[HyperVirus]

Hi All

Nice to be part of such a big forum for fish

Unfortunately my first post is a question about some sort of illness with one of my favorite fish.

I have 2 boxfish that have been in my tank since it was set up, which was mid November.

But i noticed today that one of the box fish has a cloudy popped out eye on his left side.

Please see 2 images attached (sorry about the large size's i didn't want to make it too small so you couldn't see)

I did do some water tests on saterday / sunday and the results were:

Ammonia 0.25
High Range PH 8.0 - 8.2
NO3 Nitrate 80-160
NO2 Nitrate 0
Calcium 360 (But Topped Up)

I have been using Ammonia & Nitrate solution which dropps the levels i have been adding this as my 2 tangs have been flicking. and this seems to have reduced allot so this solution is working i think.

I did go through a process which im ashamed of of not cleaning out the water. And only topping it up when it was low as the water looked very clean. I think i didn't do the full clean as i was used to my other 3 freshwater aquariums having dirty water which was an indicator that it was time to clean (1-2 months ago i started to clean properly).

So anyway im now doing water changes and cleaning the water and glass ect so i have got better.

I haven't done any tests since i have been using the -reducing- solution, i will do this tomorrow and give you the results (its time for me to goto bed)

I am feeding them mysis shrimp and brine shrimp (if that makes any difference)

I have had 1 death in the tank which was a yellow tale damsel (but that was cos the alpha male [im guessing] was a bully and forced her into a rock and wouldn't allow her to move.

Current tank mates:

2 Cleaner Shrimp
1 Boxing Shrimp, only has 1 claw due to fight
6 Hermit Crabs
1 Electric Blue Hermit Crab
1 Porcelain Crab (i think, blueish, with 2 orange like webs to catch stuff)
1 Arrow Head Crab, poor guy, has no eyes and 1 claw
1 Purple Urchin (thick spined)
6 Turbo Snails
1 Royal Gramma
2 Clown Fish
1 Pacific Blue Tang
2 BoxFish
1 Yellow Tang
3 Yellowtail Damselfish (used to have 4)
1 Spotted Mandarin

The tank has 8 large pieces of Live Rock, a v2 400 Protein Skimmer * a Fluval External Filter, in a 125 liter tank (UK Spec) And a air stone to help push the water around.

I think i have given too much information but i hope this helps and i hope my fish are ok.

Thanks for you time all!!!
Kev

 

[bawel]

I think that's overstocking the tank... the Nitrate level is dangerous... and Ammonia shouldn't present if possible. Welcome to AA btw, I hope the experts here can help you.

 

[HyperVirus]

Think i posted this in the wrong forum!! sorry

 

[HyperVirus]

The fish are all really small.

ill get a pic up of the whole tank. The shop where i buy my stock from is apparently the best in Europe and has won loads of awards ect and im now on first name basis and the bloke who deals with me says im about at my limit of fish now, he wouldn't let me overstock it so i think its OK for the moment? or well that's what he tells me.

Im trying my best to reduce the levels as you say.

A High Nitrate level isnt as harmfull as Ammonia so it cant cause long term dammage but i am trying to reduce them. (Well thats what the bloke says in the shop) I really dont know.

Any diagnosis on the Boxfish?

 

[bawel]

I forgot the site, I was searching for that bubble eye syndrome as well before for my friend, but I can't seem to find it now at work... As for Nitrate, do you do PWC (Partial Water Change) often? You need to do that to reduce the Nitrate, do as much as you can .

I really do hope someone can chime in soon, I'm sorry I can't help you any further, I'm just a beginner as well...

 

[Innovator]

Perform a 50% water change and get the NH3 to 0 and the NO3 below 40. The solutions used in dropping NH3 and other parameters into nontoxic forms just bind certain molecules, but they still need to be removed. If the eye doesn't clear or if you wish to treat, either set up a quarantine or medicate in baths with an anti-bacterial medication.

 

[HyperVirus]

The worrything thing is, that i keep doing big water changes, i dont want to do too many as it might harm the fish. But each time i do them it doesn't seem to reduce the levels.

Im using RO water which i get from my local Fish Shop, and i then treat it with aqua safe type products and add the correct dosage of salt. And airate it in a bucket for atleast 24 hours each time i do a partial change.

 

[buddha_red]

you shouldn't need the aquasafe if its ro water. test your incoming water for nitrates. What kind of substrate do you have? sand or Crushed coral?

Nitrates can come from fish waste, uneaten food and from improperly filtered water among other sources. How often do you clean your canister filter? Gunk can build up on the medium in the canisters and its easy to forget them when cleaning the rest of the tank.

Oh, and you can never change the water enough, don't worry about that.

 

[HyperVirus]

You mean test the RO water for nitrates ect?

I have sand on the bottom of the tank. I don’t know the colour of crushed coral so it might also be this. It has a fair few red and blue bits mixed in with the sand, and sometimes the fish manage to dig up a small rock or so from it, so I really don’t know. I’ll take some more pics tonight.

I clean out the external filter about once a month. As I don’t want to keep killing all the bacteria and stuff which is growing on it. Each time I do clean out the filter, only about half the sponges are dirty (like half way up the sponge) so I think I could leave it for 2 months if I had to.

But again this is just me thinking off my own back not having any input I’m fairly new to marine keeping but had more experience with Freshwater.

Ill test the water as soon as I get back from work tonight and let you know the new levels, but hopefully they should be 0. I have another batch of water waiting to go into the tank tonight so I will do a partial water change also.

Thanks for your help so far.
The bubble eye syndrome with my Boxfish, Is it serious? Will it live?

 

[melosu58]

As James (innovator) suggested I would suggest the PWC`s. They will in no wise hurt your fish. The cloudy eye will usually disapear with pristine water conditions. Right now your`s is not close to that. The ammonia and nitrates are playing a big part with the cloudy eye. Drops will not take care of it frequent PWC`s are the only route to go.

 

[HyperVirus]

Well i didnt actually make it home as i was called to a urgent meeting in another city, So im now at a hotel. I get back on saterday so will update you will the water status then. But i will keep doign the PWC's. How often do you think? once a week? im currently doing a bucket full every week.

 

[melosu58]

One big one to start off. 40-50% and then weekly 10-20% PWC`s after that.

 

[Ziggy953]

I absolutely agree with Innovator (James). I would suggest doing large PWCs (30-50%) at the minimum once a week and twice is even better. You have to get rid of that ammonia and drop those nitrates.

The tangs should go back to the award winning LFS, along with the mandarin. I have a feeling that cycling was not completed before they sold you all that live stock.

Even if your fish are small they still require the amount of space recommended for adults. Tangs should be in 100+g tanks (with a few exceptions). The Mandarin feeds almost exclusively on live copepods and with out them they will starve to death. This is a difficult fish for even the most seasoned SW person. Do some research on the fish that you have in your system and I think you will be surprised at what you find.

Bottom line get those PWCs cranking to get your ammonia and nitrate levels down.

 

[melosu58]

What size tank is this? I must have missed that. Ok I see. 125 liters. What is that about 35 gallons. You are way overstocked. I totally missed that. With those fish in that size tank you will never get ahold of your water parameters. The tangs need to go back . Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

 

[Ziggy953]

125L tank (30ishg)

 

[HyperVirus]

Sorry what does LFS stand for ive managed to keep up with most of them (PWC's ect )

The tank was cycled they werent all added at once, It stared off with 2 cleaner shrimp & snails & hermits for 2 weeks, then 4 fish were added. and left for 1 month then ive slowly been adding more fish / inverts since then.

The Mandarin has been tank bread and taught / brought up on frozen food, so he is feeding very heathaly on frozen mysis and brine shrimp which is good news, i made sure of this before i bought him.

But i also have another small tank for hatching & raising brine shrimp, and i am feeding him live food 2 times a week and they are loving it

Im not planning on keeping the fish untill full adulthood im planning on letting them grow untill 'teens' then selling them on, and then buying more (same types just babies, so there tiny again) that was my plan for the overstocking (when adults) i know this maybe a bit immoral to some people, and dont hate me for saying it.

 

[HyperVirus]

Right ive just got home and done another PWC. i waited a hour or so and have re done the tests and they are as follows:

HR PH - 7.8 (Im going to add some buffer)
Phosphate - 0.5
Nitrite - 0 / 0.25 (lower end i would say)
Ammonia 0 / 0.25 (about mid way)
Nitrate 80

I dont know why the nitrate is not coming down, im doing loads of PWCs and using addins to drop the nitrate (Seachem DeNitrate Nitrate Remover & AmQuel plus - 473ml [196065] - £16.99 : Aqua Essentials) so i dont know whats wrong.

Oh and the BoxFish's cloudy eye has gone hurray

Sorry if your all getting very fustrated with me

 

[Tank2379]

First I would really stop adding chemicals to your Tank. Right now with as many fish you have in your system they will not reach teen hood. Your fish will be stressed from all the Ammonia and Nitrates. As Melosu mention you will have a hard time getting a hold of your Water Parameters. The more Livestock you have the more fish waste is being generated each day, that is the cause for concern with overstocking... I have 55G and the max I am able to put are 6 right now I have 4 and they are very happy and Healthy I might add. I would suggest taking some back if you want anything to grow in your tank... Just My Opinion. Oh and if not answered already LFS means (Local Fish Store).