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[Danio3]

Hello to everyone hoping to get some advice on a Fluval Edge 23litre tank I have had the tank for 2 years now and had no problems until the end of November when all my fish died off at first I thought it was a disease but the more I read I think it was over stocked and when the fish were clearly unwell changed to much water and lost the bacteria in my filter.
As I thought it was disease I washed out the tank with diluted vinegar and replaced the gravel and changed all the filter media and at that time thought I understood the nitrogen cycle had water tests done by fish retailer all ok got fish died within hours. Now after 6 weeks of doing fishless cycle still seems that I cant get ammonia down below 1 nirates is less than 10 nitrites is 0 ph is 6.4 the hardness ones are o. My tap water has a reading of 1 for ammonia. Tank water on a test strip the chlorine reading bears no resemblance to the chart. If ammonia levels were my only problem I would expect the fish to last longer than 4 hours have I got a problem with Chlorine ? When I last went to the LFS his test indicated ammonia and he sold me a water treatment to block the ammonia which I added and my ammonia readings went to .5 , got 3 serpae tetras again they all died within 4 hours and I still get these readings I add dechlorinator have done numerous water changes but still not confident of getting more fish.
Can someone help I have been on other forums but cant quite get a solution to the problem.
Thanks

 

[Fishie]

Welcome to AA a greatt place! Hopefully someone can help you!

 

[redsea]

Welcome Danio3! Thanks for joining AA!

 

[paytertot]

Your tank isn't fully cycled, maybe you could try fishless cycling for a while, then introduce some hardy fish like danios or barbs?

 

[Galligak]

As I thought it was disease I washed out the tank with diluted vinegar and replaced the gravel and changed all the filter media and at that time thought I understood the nitrogen cycle had water tests done by fish retailer all ok got fish died within hours. Now after 6 weeks of doing fishless cycle still seems that I cant get ammonia down below 1 nirates is less than 10 nitrites is 0 ph is 6.4 the hardness ones are o. My tap water has a reading of 1 for ammonia. Tank water on a test strip the chlorine reading bears no resemblance to the chart. If ammonia levels were my only problem I would expect the fish to last longer than 4 hours have I got a problem with Chlorine ? When I last went to the LFS his test indicated ammonia and he sold me a water treatment to block the ammonia which I added and my ammonia readings went to .5 , got 3 serpae tetras again they all died within 4 hours and I still get these readings I add dechlorinator have done numerous water changes but still not confident of getting more fish.
Can someone help I have been on other forums but cant quite get a solution to the problem.
Thanks

Hi there! Welcome to AA!

First you're using test STRIPS. Those aren't very useful an are often wrong. Go out and buy the API freshwater liquid test kit. They have it on amazon for a great price.

The ammonia stuff you're using isn't really helping, it's more putting off the issue for a little while. When you get your test kit test the tap water. Check the codes for your local area and see if it's ok, sometimes it's the place you get your water from is the issue.

In the mean while, keep doing PWCs. If need be go get some RO water from your grocery store, the containers that you get water from or the jugs. They're only like $0.69 around where I live for 3L (1g). And keep doing changes daily.

Are you adding the chlorinator directly after the water change or before you put the water in? Or something else?

Also serpe tetras don't work in that. Size tank... Sorry. I hope that I've helped a bit, hopefully others can help even more!!!

 

[Danio3]

Thanks AquaKai
Yes I was using test strips then I got a API ammonia test kit and that is what I use to test my tank water for ammonia and my tap water both read 1 on the colour scale. Water company confirm ammonia added to water it is safe for humans but not fish.
I had bought the test strips before the ammonia test kit and use that for other tests.
The fish was the ones recommended by LFS and all other treatments I have bought have been recommended either on forums or by LFS, as it is costs are escalating for such a small tank that was bought to be of interest to my Grand kids.

 

[Danio3]

Sorry forgot to say I add the dechlorinator to the water that I am adding to the tank when I do a pwc.
This always worked for the 2 years previously.

 

[Galligak]

Thanks AquaKai
Yes I was using test strips then I got a API ammonia test kit and that is what I use to test my tank water for ammonia and my tap water both read 1 on the colour scale. Water company confirm ammonia added to water it is safe for humans but not fish.
I had bought the test strips before the ammonia test kit and use that for other tests.
The fish was the ones recommended by LFS and all other treatments I have bought have been recommended either on forums or by LFS, as it is costs are escalating for such a small tank that was bought to be of interest to my Grand kids.

Ok, I just got a little confused at the whole strip-test tube thing. I have heard that sometimes when the tank is cycled that it can take the extra ammonia added in by the PWCs. But I've never had that happen.

I'm sorry to say that LFS and the other forums aren't necessarily telling you the truth about the fish. I haven't had serape tetras, but I've seen them and have had other people tell me about them. I have a tank that's similar in size to yours. I have a male betta in there and am planning on getting a few nano fish in there as well. I would highly suggest a betta, in my opinion they're on of the best fish. But look around on here for some other good suggestions! This place is by far one of the best forums on fish on the Internet.

For the ammonia issue, I can only suggest getting help from other people. One of the more seen people on here is mumma.of.two, she really knows her stuff and can help! Sorry, but this is just about where my knowledge ends with ammonia and cycling

 

[Galligak]

Sorry forgot to say I add the dechlorinator to the water that I am adding to the tank when I do a pwc.
This always worked for the 2 years previously.

Ok, that's good. It sort of matters but as long as you're not waiting a while it's good!

 

[paytertot]

What do you think about doing a fishless cycle for a while and then adding a few fish? Because it seems that you just don't have enough bb yet.

 

[Galligak]

What do you think about doing a fishless cycle for a while and then adding a few fish? Because it seems that you just don't have enough bb yet.

+1 I agree to this. It's probably the best way to go! Thanks for pointing this out paytertot

 

[paytertot]

+1 I agree to this. It's probably the best way to go! Thanks for pointing this out paytertot

Thanks for the thanks! Haha I'm glad I'm giving the right advice.

 

[Danio3]

I thought I was doing a fishless cycle for the past 6 weeks that makes me think I am getting something wrong that it is taking so much time for such a small tank. Do you think it would be safe to add a couple of Danios now?
Whe I first set my tank up 2 years ago all I did was add the 2 small bottles of Nurifn cycle and water conditioner and then cloudy then clear within a few weeks added 3 Danios and only lost 1. After setting up tank again it was hazy but is now crystal clear and all looks well apart from the readings on test kit.

 

[Galligak]

I thought I was doing a fishless cycle for the past 6 weeks that makes me think I am getting something wrong that it is taking so much time for such a small tank. Do you think it would be safe to add a couple of Danios now?
Whe I first set my tank up 2 years ago all I did was add the 2 small bottles of Nurifn cycle and water conditioner and then cloudy then clear within a few weeks added 3 Danios and only lost 1. After setting up tank again it was hazy but is now crystal clear and all looks well apart from the readings on test kit.

Umm can you tell us the readings again. I don't remember if you posted the readings. Nurfin sometimes works but sometimes doesn't. Have you been adding in an ammonia supply? That's fishless cycling. There's actually an article on here about it, but I can't get it since I'm on the app. Someone else, can you post it?

 

[paytertot]

For fishless cycle, you can either use fish food, or pure ammonia to get the cycle going. Putting in media from another tank will speed it up also. The advantage to using pure ammonia is that when you're finished you'll have a larger amount of bb, resulting in the ability to add more fish at a time. You can learn how to do a fishless cycle by just googling it, its pretty easy.

 

[Danio3]

I have read a number of articles on fishless cycling had great difficulty getting the correct ammonia but got some built ammonia levels to 4 got it down but not below1 added again to get 4 but still only drops to 1 lowest it has been is .5 with the ammonia blocker.
Recently I have not added ammonia and have tried small amounts of food. I have added nurafin cycle as per instructions a few times.What I have not seen is high nitrite readings this makes me think I cant have cycled the tank.

 

[paytertot]

Hmm.. I think I may be stumped, this is where my knowledge ends. I hope someone else chimes in

 

[Danio3]

Sorry no one seems to be able to offer a solution. This is a update of more info that might help.
I today took a sample of tank water to LFS they tested it in front of me water was perfect no ammonia no nitrite and a ph of 6.5.
Bought 2 rosy barbs acclimatised them and apart from initial hour they were sluggish for rest of the time. They were put in tank at 1.30 pm and by 6.30 pm they were struggling to swim and were turning over did a PW of 30% no change, filled a bowl with water and moved them but they did not recover.
I assume that even with a 23Litre tank the water could not have been polluted in this time by 2 fish to the extent that the fish died.
I did after starting the tank from scratch all these weeks ago added a heater (which I did not have before) could it be at fault in that could affect the fish?
Please help I am on the verge of giving up on this tank.

 

[CoryFan]

What decor do you have in the tank, please? Also, what is your filtration?

I am concerned that something may be leaking toxins into the water.

 

[Danio3]

My filtration is part of the fluval edge and consists of sponge then carbon finally biomax all have been renewed at various stages.
My decor is some plastic plants and some resin and terracotta ornaments they were all in the tank for 2 years with no problems.
New this time round is bronze effect gravel and a submersible heater/ thermostat.
Today have tested the heater which has a lag of 5 degrees c. I also tested the voltage between water in the jug I was using to test heater and a earth and with heater on got a reading 14 VAC heater off was 6VAC.
On visiting two lfs today I was offered various advice non consistent but I opted to empty tank remove new gravel reinstate old gravel and leave out the heater and apart from dechlorinating water is pretty much back to what i started with originally.
Thanks for your help all is appreciated.