I need filter advice and substrate advice.

[davids aquarium]

I am setting up a 90 gallon freshwater tank for native fish and 6 small turtles. It will be a native Ozark stream envoirnment. The tank will be filled half full of water. I want white sand for the bottom but I also want an under gravel filter. Will this work?? Or would an external filter be better?? Have Fun! David

[mr86mister]

external filter alllllllll the way, UGF's are "old school" and dont do nearly a good as job as a HOB or other filters.....it should be all fine and dandy as long as you dont have a UGF....good luck!!!

[Fishyfanatic]

An ugf won't work with sand. What type of sand are you going to be using? For 90 gal, are you looking into more of a hob or canister filter? Considering that the tank will only be half full, I'd suggest a canister or internal filter. The hob will have a big splash on the surface of the water. With canisters you can have the output tube go down to below your water level.

BTW- Which fish are you wanting to keep? I know that you said fish that are native to the Ozark region, but remembering back to when we used to vacation to our summer house in the ozarks, there are MANY different types of fish in that lake. Many that got so big I thought they would eat my head whole.

[fishyrican]

Another consideration with an HOB filter is that the impeller may not have enough power to pull the water all the way up the tank. The water level in the intake tube will equal the water level in the tank. With a full tank, it is a small trip from the top of the tank to the filter. However, when the water is half full, the impeller must pull the water on its own all the way to the filtration chamber. The filter may not be strong enough to do that.

[greenmaji]

davids aquarium.. I am a little old school myself.. but the UGF has been relegated to very few uses in the hobby now.. Like a fry grow-out tank.. but sponge filters are perfered in this case because of cost and ease of maintains.. not to mention there just as effective..
you cant do sand and a UGF anyway.. the grain size is way too small..
I personally quit using UGF's about 12 years ago but I might have been a little early on the bandwagon.. I quit using airpumps on HOB and Canister filtered tanks back then as well.. Im wondering when everyone will be arguing how little they are needed as well..LOL

[Fishyfanatic]

I'm with you GM. In 20 years we will all be saying, Canisters? They are SO outdated. An UGF, what is THAT?

[Toirtis]

Only a good canister or two, or a sump wet/dry could even come close to handling the waste produced by 2 turtles, much less 6. What species of turtles are you planning to house?

[greenmaji]

In 20 years we will be skimming FW and/or all using Algae scrubbers!! ROFL..

Toirtis is right thats alot of turtles!

[davids aquarium]

OK guys, I get the point! My turtles are about 1.5 inch long. I can put all of them in a coffee cup. They are soft shell, snapping, red ear,map and painted. OK only 5 turtles now. I will be adding long ear sunfish bullhead cat and stream minnows and crawfish. So I can forget about under gravel filter completely. I am amazed at all the fast replies yall have sent. Great bunch of advisors! I appreciate all the info! Keep talking. David

[greenmaji]

Toiris should be able to advise you on wich turtles you should be able to keep long term in the tank.. Im certan that the snapping turtle is out... it will end up eating your livestock and they get freaking huge!! of the turtles the painted turtle sounds like it might stay small enough.. but it will need to be able to get out of the water occationaly.. same with all of the turtles besides the softshell and I think the male gets too big I could be wrong on that one Im trying to remeber..
I think the long ears are great.. bullhead cat might get a bit big as well.. the minnows sound like there life would be limited to becoming a snack by more than one of the others you have listed..
I love the idea of a native tank Im wondering what you will be able to keep out of what you want.. Im waiting to hear others advise on this one..
A big DIY wet/dry might be a good way to go on this one.. does the tank already have a bulkhead? if not you can get a overflow box the ones rated for 1200 gph are not too expensive..

[davids aquarium]

Thanks greenmagi! I plan to release the snapper in a year or two. I spend a lot of time on the river and I will be rotating my turtles every year or two, I like to keep them small. I will fillet the bullhead cat when he gets big and fry him. Just kidding! I will release him too. I realy like the DIY filter idea. I fabbricate most of my gadgits anyway. I am an amature herpetologist with a lifetime addiction for snakes. I keep 15 snakes now. This is my first large aquarium though. I am a member of reptile advice also. 8) Have Fun! David